caught using a child ticket

[tei]

hi, i bought my gf a childs train ticket down to come see me since we're both 17 and don't have much money. it was an avanti west coast train and she got caught by the inspectors. she gave her details and a letter got sent to her house (i don't know what it said since her parents took it, but she told me that they had to fill it out for her since she couldn't as she's a minor).
i know it's my fault but as she used the ticket then the consequences fall on her and ive been beyond nervous that it's going to go on her record.
ive maybe done this 4/5 times, but will it be different since the ticket was bought with my details not hers? i don't mind paying a fine i just really don't want to be the reason my gf gets prosecuted, plus i really don't have much money so an idea/estimate of how much i might have to pay would be appreciated a lot... any advice would help, ive been drowning in anxiety and guilt for over a week straight now. thank you.

 

[furlong]

The reality is that they are unlikely to prosecute a person they know to be 17 for this (because of all the extra bureaucracy involved). (If they are 18 within 6 months of the offence, in theory they can wait then use the adult process but I don't think the forum has seen that happen.)

Expect a warning and a request to pay the rest of the fare (which again is difficult for them to enforce immediately).

There is a 16-17 Saver railcard available which offers a 50% discount - similar to a child fare - so it's worth looking into that. It lasts a full year from the date of purchase even if you become 18. If you buy this, you can mention it as mitigation, particularly if they do notice the previous purchases and try to get money for those too, arguing that their true loss is merely the cost of this railcard that you (presumably) didn't know about.

 

[WesternLancer]

hi, i bought my gf a childs train ticket down to come see me since we're both 17 and don't have much money. it was an avanti west coast train and she got caught by the inspectors. she gave her details and a letter got sent to her house (i don't know what it said since her parents took it, but she told me that they had to fill it out for her since she couldn't as she's a minor).
i know it's my fault but as she used the ticket then the consequences fall on her and ive been beyond nervous that it's going to go on her record.
ive maybe done this 4/5 times, but will it be different since the ticket was bought with my details not hers? i don't mind paying a fine i just really don't want to be the reason my gf gets prosecuted, plus i really don't have much money so an idea/estimate of how much i might have to pay would be appreciated a lot... any advice would help, ive been drowning in anxiety and guilt for over a week straight now. thank you.

Where was the journey to and from?

Knowing that will help us give an indication of the sort of money Avanti will likely want paying to resolve this.

As you are both 17 you should be looking at getting the 16-17 saver railcard as mentioned. Then you get half fare tickets legitimately for the duration of the railcard validity.

 

[tei]

Where was the journey to and from?

Knowing that will help us give an indication of the sort of money Avanti will likely want paying to resolve this.

As you are both 17 you should be looking at getting the 16-17 saver railcard as mentioned. Then you get half fare tickets legitimately for the duration of the railcard validity.

glasgow to preston, very long and expensive trip....

 

[WesternLancer]

glasgow to preston, very long and expensive trip....

Ok. It would be good if her parents got some advice from here on how best to respond to the letter in respect of their daughter in order to help get best outcome achievable.

Any chance of you or your gf persuading them to have a look at this thread do you think?

 

[Mcr Warrior]

Knowing that will help us give an indication of the sort of money Avanti will likely want paying to resolve this.

As you are both 17 you should be looking at getting the 16-17 saver railcard as mentioned. Then you get half fare tickets legitimately for the duration of the railcard validity.

glasgow to preston, very long and expensive trip....

Just what fare type might Avanti claim to be the unpaid fare for this particular journey? Maybe an Off Peak Single (route 'via Carlisle'), perhaps, if someone was actually travelling via Carlisle?

 

[WesternLancer]

Just what fare type might Avanti claim to be the unpaid fare for this particular journey? Maybe an Off Peak Single (route 'via Carlisle'), perhaps, if someone was actually travelling via Carlisle?

Do ITAL manage this enforcement for Avanti do we know?
If so it probably won’t be cheap as I’d expect them to err towards a higher fare.

 

[tei]

Just what fare type might Avanti claim to be the unpaid fare for this particular journey? Maybe an Off Peak Single (route 'via Carlisle'), perhaps, if someone was actually travelling via Carlisle?

it was via carlisle! it was a connection from glasgow-carlisle, then carlisle-preston. she got caught in lancaster. idk if this changes anything but it might be useful information? it says on the ticket 'advanced single' and the route as 'awc&connections', i think since the first train from glasgow was actually a scotrail train. does that mean they can only claim from carlistle-preston, or can they still claim the entire trip?

 

[John R]

it was via carlisle! it was a connection from glasgow-carlisle, then carlisle-preston. she got caught in lancaster. idk if this changes anything but it might be useful information? it says on the ticket 'advanced single' and the route as 'awc&connections', i think since the first train from glasgow was actually a scotrail train. does that mean they can only claim from carlistle-preston, or can they still claim the entire trip?

No, they can claim for the entire trip, and probably will do so. The Anytime Single via Carlisle is £73.

 

[WesternLancer]

it was via carlisle! it was a connection from glasgow-carlisle, then carlisle-preston. she got caught in lancaster. idk if this changes anything but it might be useful information? it says on the ticket 'advanced single' and the route as 'awc&connections', i think since the first train from glasgow was actually a scotrail train. does that mean they can only claim from carlistle-preston, or can they still claim the entire trip?

I guess it would help to know what's in the letter that's been sent - but I appreciate you have not seen that yourself.

Avanti could adopt different approaches to the sum they consider is owed

- but what they are most likely to do is to seek to get a payment for a new ticket at the most expensive fare for the journey that they can - this would be the Anytime Single for Glasgow - Preston, which as @John R says is £73 adult single

- anything cheaper than that would be a win for you / your GF. They would typically not make an allowance for the sum already paid either. Again if they do its another win.

- And - they might trawl the ticket buying records associated with the ticket used and find the other similar tickets bought and ask questions about those / want paying for them... (so you need to prepare for that) - although if they ask you, you didn't use them so you did not commit any offence yourself

You say that's 4/5 other occasions - It would be wise to log into your account and check exactly how many instances of buying child fares for someone over 16 (either yourself or your gf) because this is what they will do - don't deleted the account tho - they can still access it anyway and it looks suspicious to do so too.

- Alternatively they could (given the person is under 18) adopt a different approach at the other end of the costs scale and ask for the 50% of the fare not paid (ie the adult rate) of the ticket actually purchased - given you say it was an Advance Single I suspect this is a lot less than £73

- Or they could maybe ask for an Off Peak fare if the travel was actually taken at an Off Peak time (£51.60)

Clearly most of these are not cheap and if they ask for 4 or 5 of them it will add up - ideally you can discuss with your gf and their parents because if they are being asked for the money they will probably have to pay it - so ideally you need to think about how you can offer to pay it back to them, even if that is in instalments.

If it got to the option of some sort of fine then it's not going to be the Penalty Fare type sums (£100) that you see on a poster at the station - a fine would likely be more than the sum of the tickets evaded.

 

[tei]

I guess it would help to know what's in the letter that's been sent - but I appreciate you have not seen that yourself.

Avanti could adopt different approaches to the sum they consider is owed

- but what they are most likely to do is to seek to get a payment for a new ticket at the most expensive fare for the journey that they can - this would be the Anytime Single for Glasgow - Preston, which as @John R says is £73 adult single

- anything cheaper than that would be a win for you / your GF. They would typically not make an allowance for the sum already paid either. Again if they do its another win.

- And - they might trawl the ticket buying records associated with the ticket used and find the other similar tickets bought and ask questions about those / want paying for them... (so you need to prepare for that) - although if they ask you, you didn't use them so you did not commit any offence yourself

You say that's 4/5 other occasions - It would be wise to log into your account and check exactly how many instances of buying child fares for someone over 16 (either yourself or your gf) because this is what they will do - don't deleted the account tho - they can still access it anyway and it looks suspicious to do so too.

- Alternatively they could (given the person is under 18) adopt a different approach at the other end of the costs scale and ask for the 50% of the fare not paid (ie the adult rate) of the ticket actually purchased - given you say it was an Advance Single I suspect this is a lot less than £73

- Or they could maybe ask for an Off Peak fare if the travel was actually taken at an Off Peak time (£51.60)

Clearly most of these are not cheap and if they ask for 4 or 5 of them it will add up - ideally you can discuss with your gf and their parents because if they are being asked for the money they will probably have to pay it - so ideally you need to think about how you can offer to pay it back to them, even if that is in instalments.

If it got to the option of some sort of fine then it's not going to be the Penalty Fare type sums (£100) that you see on a poster at the station - a fine would likely be more than the sum of the tickets evaded.

i dont have a trainline or mytrainpal account where theyve all been bought, ive always logged in as guest because im lazy but it has been my details every time (my email, my bank ect) so i cant check the exact details. does that mean theyll still be able to find all the previous incidents?