Caught not having a network railcard

[jackie14]

Hi,

I got a train/tube from Tottenham Hale to Stansted airport. I got the ticket under the network railcard as I thought my mum had purchased me one.

I’ve come to found out that the one she purchased is not valid for me.

The inspector wrote all my details down and said I’ll get a letter within 2-3 weeks.

This was a genuine mistake and I have learnt to be more vigilant.

Please could someone advise on what will happen as he did not.

Will I get a criminal record? Or will I be fined?

Many thanks

 

[AlterEgo]

Hi,

I got a train/tube from Tottenham Hale to Stansted airport. I got the ticket under the network railcard as I thought my mum had purchased me one.

I’ve come to found out that the one she purchased is not valid for me.

How did you come to find that out?

The inspector wrote all my details down and said I’ll get a letter within 2-3 weeks.

This was a genuine mistake and I have learnt to be more vigilant.

Please could someone advise on what will happen as he did not.

Will I get a criminal record? Or will I be fined?

Many thanks

It depends - where were you stopped, and what train company are you dealing with here? Different companies treat these things differently.

 

[Gloster]

You will get a letter in a few weeks and then you can post it on this thread: please obscure your name, address and any other identifying details, such as reference numbers, when you do.

Until the experts know how the railway is dealing with this, which should be clear from the letter, they can’t give a definite answer. However, it is usually possible to negotiate an out of court settlement, which will not give you a criminal record. But until the letter arrives, the experts can’t give the best advice.

 

[jackie14]

How did you come to find that out?


It depends - where were you stopped, and what train company are you dealing with here? Different companies treat these things differently.

It is only in my mums name. I was stopped at Stansted airport so I have no idea who it was

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 2 Jul 2024 ==

You will get a letter in a few weeks and then you can post it on this thread: please obscure your name, address and any other identifying details, such as reference numbers, when you do.

Until the experts know how the railway is dealing with this, which should be clear from the letter, they can’t give a definite answer. However, it is usually possible to negotiate an out of court settlement, which will not give you a criminal record. But until the letter arrives, the experts can’t give the best advice.

There’s a chance I can get a criminal record for an £8 mistake?

Surely that can’t be right

 

[Gloster]

There’s a chance I can get a criminal record for an £8 mistake?

Surely that can’t be right

Unfortunately it is. However, there is every chance that you can get an out of court settlement, which means no criminal record, without too much difficulty if you handle it right: the experts will advise how once you have the letter. But you do need to handle it right as there is no certainty: it is entirely the railway company’s decision as to whether they offer you an out of court settlement, although they usually seem to do so to those who engage with them. You just need to wait for the letter: if you move make sure that you organise a postal redirection order or for someone reliable to forward your post.

 

[jackie14]

Unfortunately it is. However, there is every chance that you can get an out of court settlement, which means no criminal record, without too much difficulty if you handle it right: the experts will advise how once you have the letter. But you do need to handle it right as there is no certainty: it is entirely the railway company’s decision as to whether they offer you an out of court settlement, although they usually seem to do so to those who engage with them. You just need to wait for the letter: if you move make sure that you organise a postal redirection order or for someone reliable to forward your post.

What is the statistical probability of me being prosecuted?

My career would be completely over

 

[AlterEgo]

What is the statistical probability of me being prosecuted?

My career would be completely over

If you engage with them it would be very low.

It is unlikely your career would be ended by a low level Bylaw conviction in any case. Don't panic.

 

[WesternLancer]

One thing you could do as it shows that you have learned from the mistake you made thinking that the Network Railcard that is in your mum's name (and thus for her) was one you could use would be to now buy yourself a Railcard that you are entitled to - eg a Network Railcard - which is then something you can say you have done to prevent the mistake happening again when you seek to persuade them not to prosecute you and ask to settle the matter without court action.

I would recommend you buy one now if you have not already done so.

 

[Hadders]

Welcome to the forum!

If you were stopped at Stansted Airport then you'll be dealing with Greater Anglia. They are generally one of the 'better' train companies to deal with when it comes to this sort of thing.

What happens next is that Greater Anglia will send you a letter int he next few weeks. The letter use quite threatening language and say they have received a report and are considering prosecuting you but asking for your version of events before they decide how to proceed. It is important that you reply to this letter. I suggest you mention the following points in your reply:

- That you are sorry for what has happened
- What you have learned from the incident
- That you are keen to settle the matter without the need for court action
- Offer to pay the outstanding fare and the train company's administrative costs in dealing with the matter

Greater Anglia are usually prepared to offer an administrative settlement (commonly known as an out of court settlement) for people who engage with the process and who haven't come to their attention before. We cannot guarantee this and Greater Anglia is within their rights to prosecute you in the magistrates court if they want to.

If you are offered a settlement expect to have to pay the cost of the fare avoided at the full Anytime rate plus an admin fee, typically around £150. An out of court settlement might appear to be a fine, but it isn't and you won't have a criminal record as a result of accepting one. You will need to be in a position to pay the settlement in full within a few days of it being offered - payment in installments isn't normally allowed.

Feel free to post a copy of the letter once it arrives (with personal details redacted) along with your draft reply in this thread and forum members will be happy to proof read it for you.

 

[Mcr Warrior]

@jackie14. Welcome to the forum. Was this a one-off incident, or will inspection of your online ticket purchasing history show any other occasions when you've bought and then inappropriately used railcard discounted tickets without holding an accompanying, valid, in date, and registered in your name, railcard?

It's easy enough for the train company's investigation team to check this; however, if not, reckon you're looking at having to stump up £22.40 for the fare due, plus the £150.00 fee that @Hadders has just mentioned above.

 

[MotCO]

My career would be completely over

If you co-operate and are truthful (I'm not suggesting you're not), then you should not get a criminal record.

In the worst case and you do get a criminal record, then depending on your job you may need to inform your employer, but it is usually considered a minor indiscretion. The bigger and worst sin, however, is not telling your employer and letting them find out from somehere else. Your union rep should be able to advise. But all of this is unlikely to happen.

 

[AlbertBeale]

Hi,

I got a train/tube from Tottenham Hale to Stansted airport. I got the ticket under the network railcard as I thought my mum had purchased me one.

I’ve come to found out that the one she purchased is not valid for me.

The inspector wrote all my details down and said I’ll get a letter within 2-3 weeks.

This was a genuine mistake and I have learnt to be more vigilant.

Please could someone advise on what will happen as he did not.

Will I get a criminal record? Or will I be fined?

Many thanks

You say you thought your mother had bought you a railcard - but even if she had done, you obviously didn't have it with you. Remember that if you buy a discounted ticket where the discount depends on having a particular railcard, you need to have the railcard with you - as well as the ticket - for the cut-price ticket to be valid; surely that's fairly obvious.

For this reason, it seems unlikely that the railway would believe this was just a "mistake" as you describe it.

However, as has been said, you're nevertheless likely to be able get an out-of-court settlement, which would mean paying the amount mentioned above; if you don't achieve a settlement, then you will end up with the case going to a Magistrates' Court and you'll end up with a criminal conviction and a fine.

Was it an electronic ticket, or a physical ticket? If it was an electronic ticket, bought online, then they can and will trace and check all of your other online ticket purchases to make sure there haven't been other instances where you've done anything similar. This could, of course, affect their willingness to settle out of court.

 

[jackie14]

If you engage with them it would be very low.

It is unlikely your career would be ended by a low level Bylaw conviction in any case. Don't panic.

You say you thought your mother had bought you a railcard - but even if she had done, you obviously didn't have it with you. Remember that if you buy a discounted ticket where the discount depends on having a particular railcard, you need to have the railcard with you - as well as the ticket - for the cut-price ticket to be valid; surely that's fairly obvious.

For this reason, it seems unlikely that the railway would believe this was just a "mistake" as you describe it.

However, as has been said, you're nevertheless likely to be able get an out-of-court settlement, which would mean paying the amount mentioned above; if you don't achieve a settlement, then you will end up with the case going to a Magistrates' Court and you'll end up with a criminal conviction and a fine.

Was it an electronic ticket, or a physical ticket? If it was an electronic ticket, bought online, then they can and will trace and check all of your other online ticket purchases to make sure there haven't been other instances where you've done anything similar. This could, of course, affect their willingness to settle out of court.

It was a physical ticket but I have bought a couple of tickets previously where the same thing would have occurred and they were digital. I’m happy to pay any fine really but honestly idk what I’d do if I get convicted. I work in the financial services

 

[30907]

It was a physical ticket but I have bought a couple of tickets previously where the same thing would have occurred and they were digital. I’m glad I’m in this situation to be honest. I feel bad and It just goes to show you can’t  beat the system.

According to your original account you weren't even trying to

I’m happy to pay any fine really but honestly idk what I’d do if I get convicted. I work in the financial services

If it comes to court you should tell your employer immediately, and explain your misunderstanding clearly. Check your contract of employment!

 

[jackie14]

According to your original account you weren't even trying to

If it comes to court you should tell your employer immediately, and explain your What I meant is I’ve learnt I need to be very careful even the smallest errors

I wasn’t referring to this case. I just meant I learnt a life lesson. This was genuine mistake however it was preventable as it was caused by my ignorance

 

[AlbertBeale]

It was a physical ticket but I have bought a couple of tickets previously where the same thing would have occurred and they were digital. I’m happy to pay any fine really but honestly idk what I’d do if I get convicted. I work in the financial services

Just to be clear - you'll only have to pay "a fine" if you are convicted in court (or plead guilty); a criminal conviction generates a fine, but any financial settlment you make with the railway company in order to avoid gong to court isn't a fine in the legal sense ... it's just a private agreement between you and the rail company.

Although the ticket when you were stopped was a physical ticket, since they have your details it's possible they will track down the other (digital) tickets - though less certain than if the one when they stopped you was also digital.

All you can do is wait until you hear from them.

Incidentally, I'm still puzzled how (whether the card you mother had got was valid for you or not) you thought you could buy a discounted ticket on the basis of that card, but not have the card as well as the ticket with you when you travelled. I fear that strange aspect to the story is likely to make it harder to persuade anyone that it was genuinely a mistake.

 

[AlterEgo]

It is only in my mums name.

We know, but that doesn't answer the question.

How did you come to find that out? As you have to have the railcard with you, and present it. It's obvious whose name it is in.