Cardiff Bus/Coach Station

[Envoy]

The plans for Cardiff’s Bus/Coach Station have been changed.
http://www.walesonline.co.uk/news/local-news/cardiff-bus-station-central-square-11923910

QUOTE "The original curvy design is the one that was revealed to the public first.

But the proposals put forward to consultation by Cardiff council's ruling body on Wednesday show some changes".







QUOTE "The original curvy design is the one that was revealed to the public first.

But the proposals put forward to consultation by Cardiff council's ruling body on Wednesday show some changes.

The design, the rounded edges, and shape have changed dramatically"[/QUOTE]
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
The plans for Cardiff’s new bus/coach station have now been put out (by the developers) for consultation. Looks like a massive development of ugly office blocks with a few (14) spaces for coaches in a confined space - which will hold fumes in a similar way to Birmingham New Street Station. The height of the buildings is also going to amplify the winds and thus make walking from the Central Station to the main shopping areas very unpleasant.

Looks to me that the developers are simply trying to extract the greatest value out of a given amount of land.
http://www.cardiffinterchange.co.uk

QUOTE:> Should you wish to submit comments on the current proposals please send them to:
cardiffinterchange@nlpplanning.com

Or write to us at:

Cardiff Interchange Consultation
Nathaniel Lichfield & Partners
Helmont House
Churchill Way
Cardiff
CF10 2HE

Comments should be submitted no later than 31 October 2016.

 

[godfreycomplex]

Looking at the CGI images on the proposal it does seem like a radical change.
I haven't checked my sectional appendix lately but I'm pretty sure that TGVs are barred from Cardiff down goods. Maybe the SNCF have made good on their long held ambition for a Paris-Margam service.

Maybe the wibble merchants should rent one of the penthouse offices and shower down drool on the assembled masses below every time the Gerald comes in...

Sorry; it's been a long shift. In all seriousness though; I wouldn't like to be in charge of the queuing pens after a game across the road. There isn't really enough space in Central Square anyway; let alone with a load of crowded restaurants on the bottom floor taking up space. Other than that I suppose it was inevitable that something like this would go in; I was never that much of a fan of the curvy design; and not to sound too cynical; but it's gotta pay I suppose

 

[Envoy]

Detailed plans for the new Cardiff bus/coach station have been put out for objections by Cardiff’s Planners.
http://www.walesonline.co.uk/news/wales-news/everything-now-know-cardiffs-new-12196660

The planning application has been submitted to Cardiff council

The most detailed summary of Cardiff's new bus station have been released, as councillors get ready to have their say on the scheme.
The planning application contains 134 documents, covering everything from the effect on the environment, roads, archaeology, air quality and noise.
Now the plans have been made public, there is a minimum 21 days before planning committee either approve, or refuse the application.

If you wish to find the detailed information on the Planning Application, click the following link and insert this number in the search box:> 16/02731/MJR

(You then click ‘Documents' - which take a few seconds to load). http://planning.cardiff.gov.uk/online-applications/

 

[nottinghamcity]

It looks like the current Euston, but a bit uglier.

 

[Envoy]

It is reported that plans for Cardiff’s new bus station are in disarray.

http://www.walesonline.co.uk/news/wales-news/plans-cardiffs-new-bus-station-13367126

The plans for Cardiff’s new state-of-the-art bus station have been thrown into disarray, we can reveal.

The long awaited multi-million pound scheme in the heart of the city centre cannot go ahead in its current form, according to the developer.

This has dragged on for years. Land deals done with a property company that include ugly high rise buildings that will create wind-blown ‘canyons’ between the Central Station & the main retailing areas. The BBC Wales HQ is nearing completion and this is rather close to the Central Station thus leaving little room to expand a new concourse at the station. Goodness knows why BBC Wales needed to be in this position - where they also demanded car parking spaces for their overpaid staff. So much for encouraging use of public transport. I guess that these are the kind of people who don’t do public transport.

 

[Blindtraveler]

The local, inter regional and long distance coach and bus situation in Cardif is farsical as it is so this is bad news.

 

[bussnapperwm]

And what's the odds it'll end up closed for the day when the Speedway cometh into the Millennium Stadium

 

[padbus]

Cardiff Council don't do much to encourage bus travel. They had a bus station right outside the train station and handy for the city centre. They let it fall into disrepair so that, latterly, it was not a nice place to be. They then closed it and allowed the site to be used for massive office blocks with just a vague promise of a new bus station. They had already closed off most of the city centre to traffic so that buses could only serve to periphery. With the bus station closed bus terminii are now spread far and wide. I am a fairly frequent visitor to Cardiff but if I wanted to use a Stagecoach bus I would not know were to find it. I do know that National Express coaches have relegated to a park behind the castle remote from any other bus services.

And this is from a council which actually owns the major local bus company.

 

[tramboy]

Conversely, this being Cardiff, you'll find the Stagecoach buses are the ones least displaced - all except two services depart from St Mary's Street, just around the corner from the railway station.

Cardiff Bus themselves have probably come out worse off, being scattered from Wood Street on one side, up both sides of Westgate Street and then around Canal Street for other services.

National Express' terminal is nowhere near the City Centre anymore as you note, and not handy if you want to carry on travelling by bus.

And yes, travel on any event day, and buses are scattered even further apart.

 

[Mwanesh]

If it was the Tories they would be an uproar but its the peoples party Labour who are making a mess of it.I have been to Bedford were Stagecoach teamed up with the council to redevelop the bus station.

 

[carlberry]

And this is from a council which actually owns the major local bus company.

This just removes one of the major voices that would point out the folly of their ideas!

One of the most wonderful things the council have done recently is a sign near the rail station that's intended to help people find the displaced buses. It's got two different arms pointing in two different directions with 'Buses' on them. Basically if you have to use the buses, go and find them yourselves, we're not going to help you.

 

[padbus]

This just removes one of the major voices that would point out the folly of their ideas!

Indeed.

 

[CardiffKid]

Cardiff is scrapping its bus station plan and starting again
The city has admitted that there will be no bus station before 2020

http://www.walesonline.co.uk/news/wales-news/cardiff-scrapping-bus-station-plan-13817624

Old Bus Station closed in August 2015.

 

[WelshBluebird]

Old Bus Station closed in August 2015.

But of course, the main building part of the old bus station was demolished a long time before that (around the time I moved away for uni, so 2008 ish I believe), and quite a lot of services were rerouted to serve bus stations nearby rather than the bus station itself. I would say you couldn't make it up, but based on how useless the council have been when it comes to this over the last few years, I really am not surprised at all.

 

[CardiffKid]

Stand A closed long before 2015 and the main 'terminus' building was demolished* but remind me what was in that building? There was no waiting room etc, it was just another row of bus stops/stands and some less than attractive shops/cafes? The Cardiff Bus and National Express Offices, both moved across the road so that was no great loss, but what else?


*I don't think it was quite as far back as 2008, the year I moved to Cardiff, I remember some Olympic exhibition appearing on the site once it was clear so I think it would be circa 2012.

 

[GusB]

Thread reopened

 

[route101]

I was in Cardiff at the weekend. Was surprised Sophia Gardens National Express stop was just a regular stop. I used the stop for the Megabus at North Friar Street and thought it was pretty central. Cardiff would do well to have a bus station.

 

[anthony263]

I was in Cardiff at the weekend. Was surprised Sophia Gardens National Express stop was just a regular stop. I used the stop for the Megabus at North Friar Street and thought it was pretty central. Cardiff would do well to have a bus station.

Yes that be pretty nice if politicians etc didn't make such a farce of this !

New bus station going to be useless for coaches. Better building one of the southside of central station

 

[markymark2000]

Cardiff could do with a central coach station but no one wants to get stuck in the Cardiff traffic so it would have to be on the north side because of the motorway. Ideally, just off Greyfriars Road somewhere would be good.

Megabus has the best stop location in Cardiff but there isn't enough space for 2 coaches to properly stop in the stand and it's not very accessible for buses needing to use the wheelchair lift. Not ideal having so little space considering layovers. Lack of shelter considering the amount of people using the stop.

NatEx at Sophia Gardens is some sort of re-enactment of people trying to board the overcrowded Indian trains. It's a free for all. While operationally it runs ok, there isn't much space for layover and passengers act like it's an evacuation out of the city and that is the last coach to leave. Never seen anything like it. So little space for passengers and considering the amount of coaches, to provide a lousy bus shelter as the waiting area, not very good. 15-20 minute walk into the city (Depending on the area you want), too far for most people. Want to get a bus to get a bit closer to the coach station? Forget it, the walk from the bus stops, you may as well walk the whole thing.

Flixbus, Too far out of town, not accessible for wheelchair users. You're just stood at a random bus stop on a big main road.

None of the stops are particually attractive and shout 'Welcome to the Capital City of Wales', then again, if you see most of the anti public transport measures from the planks at Cardiff Council, it's a surprise that the stops were permitted to be this close to the city! All this could be solved by permitting the use of the old Megabus stop again on Kingsway. But no, the empty cycle lane takes priority and everyone else must work around the (none existent) cyclists.

 

[Markdvdman]

It is a travesty Sophia Gardens as you say! I use it often when getting the National Express from Cross Hands on a Sunday or Bank Holiday Monday. Quickest way towards the centre is to walk left, cross the road, and cross the river. that way you can be in Cardiff Central station in 5-10 mins. However, it is a joke it is not close to a station and to have a Capital City Bus Station that cannot cope with coaches is ludicrous beyond belief! Swansea can cope, Merthyr can (though they no longer go to Merthyr). It is a stain on the city to not have coaches not calling anywhere near the centre!

Also, not to have a date of opening is quite ludicrous!

 

[markymark2000]

Quickest way towards the centre is to walk left, cross the road, and cross the river. that way you can be in Cardiff Central station in 5-10 mins.

I can only say what my Google maps is telling me (which I think adjusts the time for my walking speed), it says 17 minutes to Central Station.

Also, not to have a date of opening is quite ludicrous!

I don't think anyone knows what is going on with the bus station. It's just being built and no one knows more than that. It's interesting though as Stagecoach have moved yet more buses up to Greyfrias Road so there's even less buses to possibly use the new bus station now.

 

[Mwanesh]

Never understood the logic of selling the old bus station to the BBC. The BBC could have built their offices out of town. The old bus station was dated I agree but it could have been updated. Bristol Marlborough Street was dated but then updated to it's present form.

 

[Markdvdman]

I think the simple reason for the new bus station is the old trick - follow the money. There was absolutely NO reason not to refurbish the old station. The BBC as you say could have gone anywhere, and this station they have made it small to get more retail and business estate out of it. It is tragic! As for walking Sophia Gardens to Central on a good day I would say 12 mins but traffic can play a part!

 

[Mwanesh]

I think the simple reason for the new bus station is the old trick - follow the money. There was absolutely NO reason not to refurbish the old station. The BBC as you say could have gone anywhere, and this station they have made it small to get more retail and business estate out of it. It is tragic! As for walking Sophia Gardens to Central on a good day I would say 12 mins but traffic can play a part!

Some times I wonder if the councillors use busses in Cardiff. Some of the decisions are diabolical. There is no information hub nothing for visiting passengers. They can't even look at Newport which has a bus station for their local busses and another for Stagecoach and other operators.

 

[markymark2000]

Some times I wonder if the councillors use busses in Cardiff. Some of the decisions are diabolical. There is no information hub nothing for visiting passengers. They can't even look at Newport which has a bus station for their local busses and another for Stagecoach and other operators.

There are still TrawsCymru T9 posters up at the bottom of St Mary's Street directing people from Central to the T9 bus stop.

 

[Envoy]

So, it appears that National Express are going to stay at Sophia Gardens in what was supposed to be a temporary terminal until the so called ‘Transport Interchange’ by the station was completed - all 13 bays. Stagecoach seem to be using Greyfriars Road as their Cardiff terminal as their buses go north to the valleys. Adventure buses criss cross the city west > east and north > south. Cardiff Bus use the bridge under the railway as their ‘dwell place’. Goodness knows what buses will eventually use the new Transport Interchange? Cardiff Bus 32 to St.Fagans (soon to be scrapped) leaves from Wood Street by the Inland Revenue Offices.

Cardiff does not have a Tourist Information Centre. Goodness knows why they don’t put one in foyer of the Museum of Cardiff in the centre of the city? One of the new units facing the station would be a good place for one to help visitors arriving by train. (They once had one in the Central Station which was well used and TfW can’t be bothered to have their Information desk manned half the time).

I don’t think that building a new bus station on the site of the old one would have been a good idea due to the fact that it would have had to shut down when events are held at the stadium due to the number of people in the area. For the same reason, this new Transport Interchange is also not a good location. I think that the best place for new bus and coach station would be Callaghan Square as it is just a short walk from the Central Station whilst also just being a few minutes from the main shopping areas and the stadium. Of course, much depends on how the Metro will cross this area as you would not want that getting stuck in traffic.

Mention has been made that coaches need to go north to the M4 but I contend that access to the CBD would be easier from the south as an expressway already goes west to J33. The problem is that they have not completed The Bay Expressway (A4232) to link with the M4 to the east. Rover Way is overloaded with traffic trying to use this route and the anti road Welsh Government are unlikely to do anything about it.

The T9 service mentioned above was the bus that went from the city centre to Cardiff Airport and does no longer run. The quickest way to get from the city centre to the airport is to use the train to Rhoose and then the bus shuttle for the 2 miles to the terminal. The sooner this line gets a half hourly service the better.

 

[WelshBluebird]

So, it appears that National Express are going to stay at Sophia Gardens

Disappointed if that is the case but not surprised.

National Express don't even give the coaches enough time to get out from Sophia Gardens towards the castle and onto North Road, I can't imagine they would be happy giving them the extra time needed to come out of a proper bus station and deal with the traffic and lights around Central / St Mary's street.

I'm not so bothered by Megabus etc as the other coach and bus stops are still within the city centre, but Sophia Gardens just is not good enough. Hell if I was new to the city I'm really not sure if I would have a clue which direction to go from there to get to the city centre!

Goodness knows why they don’t put one in foyer of the Museum of Cardiff in the centre of the city?

Do you mean the old library building just off The Hayes? There defo used to be a visitors centre there a few years back. I suspect it was probably shut to save money sadly.

I don’t think that building a new bus station on the site of the old one would have been a good idea due to the fact that it would have had to shut down when events are held at the stadium due to the number of people in the area. For the same reason, this new Transport Interchange is also not a good location. I think that the best place for new bus and coach station would be Callaghan Square as it is just a short walk from the Central Station whilst also just being a few minutes from the main shopping areas and the stadium. Of course, much depends on how the Metro will cross this area as you would not want that getting stuck in traffic.

I wonder if the rear of the station would have been an option (what is now a fairly large car park) though granted that is needed for replacement buses when they run (which at the moment is all of the time thanks to the Metro works), or the old brewery site nearby that is currently being redeveloped. Ah well all what if's now.

 

[markymark2000]

I don't think moving the bus station down and away from the town would be the best idea because for many routes, it would mean going through more of the City. The City is very congested and as we have already highlighted, certain sets of lights can take all week to change. Having more buses get stuck is surely not a good idea. Coaches would likely find it harder to serve the station as well because it would take longer. The ONLY benefit of having the bus station at Central is a bus/rail interchange. That should never, ever be a priority though over taking the majority of passengers to where they actually want to go (which is a common thing on this forum, benefit a few people connecting, stuff everyone else who wants to make normal journeys not changing).

Greyfriars Road is a much more central location and has huge potential to be a bus station/shopping centre/hotel. It would mean that Megabus, NatEx and Flixbus all have easy access to serve the site from North Road. Given many normal service routes terminate at Greyfriars Road as well, it is handy for all of those routes.

Then, have the new bus station isn't in a bad place for the routes which terminate in the area like your Barry routes, X2, 304, 89s but it's not very good for routes which run north. Leicester, Liverpool, Manchester, Newcastle and Nottingham are all large cities which have 2 bus stations, why not Cardiff. As long as they introduce some buses doing a clockwise loop (rather than them all doing the loop anticlockwise) to link the two bus stations together, I think that 2 bus stations would suit Cardiff really well.

National Express don't even give the coaches enough time to get out from Sophia Gardens towards the castle and onto North Road, I can't imagine they would be happy giving them the extra time needed to come out of a proper bus station and deal with the traffic and lights around Central / St Mary's street.

I'd really have expected National Express to do better and build something. I am not sure on the history but NatEx has their own coach stations in Southampton and Newcastle. I think NatEx own Milton Keynes Coachway as well? I know they certainly run it. I suppose now it's like everything else to do with transport, everyone wants it but everyone wants someone else to pay for it. NatEx would want Cardiff Council to pay and vice versa and then nothing happens as it's a stalemate.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

I'd really have expected National Express to do better and build something. I am not sure on the history but NatEx has their own coach stations in Southampton and Newcastle. I think NatEx own Milton Keynes Coachway as well? I know they certainly run it. I suppose now it's like everything else to do with transport, everyone wants it but everyone wants someone else to pay for it. NatEx would want Cardiff Council to pay and vice versa and then nothing happens as it's a stalemate.

And then came Megabus and Flixbus so NatEx aren't going to spend money on that sort of facility nowadays; in fact, they sold off Liverpool for a tidy sum and wouldn't be shocked if Newcastle went the same way in due course.

I suspect that Sophia Gardens will have to suffice - the location isn't so bad but the facilities are somewhat basic!!

 

[Envoy]

National Express don't even give the coaches enough time to get out from Sophia Gardens towards the castle and onto North Road, I can't imagine they would be happy giving them the extra time needed to come out of a proper bus station and deal with the traffic and lights around Central / St Mary's street.

Do you mean the old library building just off The Hayes? There defo used to be a visitors centre there a few years back. I suspect it was probably shut to save money sadly.

I wonder if the rear of the station would have been an option (what is now a fairly large car park) though granted that is needed for replacement buses when they run (which at the moment is all of the time thanks to the Metro works), or the old brewery site nearby that is currently being redeveloped. Ah well all what if's now.

Castle Street now has cycle lanes taking up one of the two eastbound lanes. This has created massive traffic jams.

I did indeed suggest that the Old Library on The Hayes be used as at TIC. The staff already appear to deal with visiting tourists but they should have a plentiful supply of city maps. I don’t see why the spare space in this area can’t have racks for leaflets promoting nearby attractions such as Castell Coch, Caerphilly Castle, Llandaff Cathedral, St.Fagans Castle & Museum, Dyffryn Gardens and Tredegar House. Space could also surely be found to promote other places in Wales such as The Showcaves in the Swansea Valley, Brecon Mountain Railway, Big Pit and places further away in the rest of the country. That would cost the Council nothing.

I also note that The Cardiff Museum (inside the Old Library) is not clearly marked on the outside - just the word “Welcome”. This is bad marketing.

A new multi storey car park is going to be built on the Brain’s Brewery site. The present station car park will be used by the tram-trains linking Central Station to the Bay with the ultimate intention of this forming an east > west cross city route.