Car hits Metro (again)

[142094]

Link to story. A car has hit a Metro train on the level crossing at Howdon (note how BBC thinks we're in East Yorkshire).

I've been on a Metro a few times when a car has gone through the red lights (although thankfully I haven't been on one that has crashed). I've also seen a lot of people walking/running across the level crossing at Howdon when the lights are on, even though there is a subway provided.

Can't say for sure as yet whether it was driver error or something else happened, but if it was due to stupidity I hope the person gets a very big fine and their licence taken away.

 

[jamesontheroad]

Finally a report that puts it the right way round: "a car collided with a Metro train" instead of "a Metro train collided with a car." It doesn't matter who hits who side on, if a car and a train collide on a level crossing, it's not because the train is where it shouldn't be...

 

[142094]

Exactly, far too many times it is reported as a rail accident when a car or lorry has hit a bridge or train.

 

[robertclark125]

At traffic lights at a junction, car drivers stop at a red light. Why should they do different at a level crossing?

 

[142094]

Only reasons I can think of are:

1) Sun was dazzling the view of the lights (however there are sirens as well)

2) Driver did not pay attention to lights; there is a junction at the north end of the crossing which is directly after the crossing, so could have been paying too much attention to getting through the junction and not the warning lights.

3) Could have been more than one Metro there - on Metro crossings only one train is permitted over it each time, so if two meet one will wait until the other has passed. Howdon is also a staggered station, one platform on either side of the crossing. So one train might have left but the driver did not think that there may be another and drove across.

4) Playing chicken - not unknown I'm afraid, could have got it wrong this time.

 

[robertclark125]

In the event of point 3, Kingston Park, Fawdon, and Callerton Parkway are also staggered. If I remember correctly, when there is a second train about to cross, the lights stay on. Not only that, Metro trains have to sound their warning horns, so to make motorists, and other road users, aware.

 

[A60K]

It doesn't matter who hits who side on, if a car and a train collide on a level crossing, it's not because the train is where it shouldn't be...

Generally I agree, but there is a chance that the railway is at fault - think of the Cotswolds accident some months back.

 

[142094]

In the event of point 3, Kingston Park, Fawdon, and Callerton Parkway are also staggered. If I remember correctly, when there is a second train about to cross, the lights stay on. Not only that, Metro trains have to sound their warning horns, so to make motorists, and other road users, aware.

Callerton Parkway isn't staggered, both platforms are on the side closest to Newcastle. The lights do stay on but people sometimes assume that because one train has passed it is OK to cross. They also do have to sound their horn but I've been on a couple where this hasn't happened, and you might not hear it over the sound of a radio.

 

[DannyBoy]

I hadn't heard about this, thanks for posting.

One of the things I have noticed with the Metro, which is unusual, is that the level crossings do NOT stay on if theres a second train there. The first train to the mark gets the first signal, the lights go off, then after about 10 seconds, the red lights go back on, and the second train gets the signal to go. Kingston Park is the best place to see this happening, as there's nearly always 2 trains due in at the same time.

It's very intruiging how many accidentshave happened on Metro crossings, since the speed limit for the Metros is 15 kmh. That means the car driver has to be giving it the beans to not notice the Metro is actually there, or else the Metro driver would have sufficient time to stop.

 

[142094]

I'm sure I've seen the lights stay on when two trains are there, but this is when they are at the station at exatcly the same time. Could this but only for Kingston Park, as I know there is normally a large queue of traffic on Brunton Road due to the Tesco and the additional problem of that roundabout?

 

[mumrar]

if a car and a train collide on a level crossing, it's not because the train is where it shouldn't be...

Erm, Moreton-on-Lugg?? Back on topic

 

[DannyBoy]

I'm sure I've seen the lights stay on when two trains are there, but this is when they are at the station at exatcly the same time. Could this but only for Kingston Park, as I know there is normally a large queue of traffic on Brunton Road due to the Tesco and the additional problem of that roundabout?

Nope, I've seen it at Howdon and Callerton as well (trains also meet there, but only during the day), I'm sure it's something to do with a 'slot' system, because a driver once told some kids off for holding the train doors open, because he could have missed his slot. There was a train opposite as well. Although that could've been a lie to hurry the kids up.

 

[142094]

I'll have to check next time but sure I've seen both. Might just depend on time of day or whatever.

 

[Frankfurt]

When trains stop at stations with crossings they activate a treadle which sets off the crossings warning lights and sirens and subsequently clears the signal for train to cross.

So when 2 trains arrive at their platforms at same time, whichever activates their treadle 1st will determine which train gets to cross 1st (providing next section of track is clear). After 1st train passes the crossing re-opens for cars and pedestrians for 15 seconds, after the 15 seconds the warning lights and sirens start again for 2nd train.

About the driver telling the kids off for holding open doors, this is because when the signal has cleared you get 3mins to cross before signal will revert back to danger and crossing re-open to cars and pedestrians-so there is a risk of a SPAD if you were delayed on the platform for instance. Kingston park station can get very busy because of the Newcastle Falcons matches, some drivers will stop short of activating treadle, allow on the masses of fans, close doors and then shunt forward to activate treadle-thus ensuring they cross well before the 3mins.

As for the blame when a car hits a train on a metro crossing, the car driver is at fault. Because of the systems in place, speed magnets on approach, danger signal when arriving-plus if the warning lights and sirens failed a driver wouldn't get the signal to cross.

With regards to this collision at Howdon, this is a brief eye witness account I have copied and pasted from Evening Chronicle's story, the comment was posted at the bottom of page after story by "7Jonny".

"I was onboard the Metro at the time of this incident.

As the train left Howdon Station the lights/sound were activating and the Metro driver sounded his horn as he started moving. It appears as if the Taxi driver has chanced it to save a couple of minutes of his journey. The train hit the back of his vehicle sending it spinning around, coming to rest on the other track. The damage sustained to the Metro was an extremely bent buffer.

When the incident happened the train jolted forwards and everyone onboard the train got to their feet in shock, some kids/drunk students appeared to be in shock.

It looked as if the driver got arrested, but don't know if that is usually the case in incidents like this".

Regards

 

[DannyBoy]

Thanks for the info Frankfurt. We had been at the crossing a while because of late comers (which the driver can see running up the path adjacent), so when the kids held the doors open, it was getting pretty close to time limit.

Well, if it was a taxi driver, he should know better. I honestly cannot see the logic in trying to beat a Metro crossing, it only stays closed for about 30 seconds! Idiots!

 

[spoony]

Im sorry but the drivers of the cars must be retarded or something. Every time a metro crosses an un-barrierd crossing like Howdon it crawls across the crossing at about 10-20mph. Its unfortunate there are far too many people who are not fit to drive with licences on our roads in this country.

 

[142094]

Taxi driver in a rush apparently. Wouldn't be surprised if he had a Berwick licence plate as well.

 

[WatcherZero]

A lot do go unreported in the media, the Manchester Metrolink network by comparison manages just over 1 RTA incident a month on average, though often it doesnt directly involve their vehicles e.g. bus breaks down on the line, two cars crash on the line, etc.

One annoying cause of delays is paramedics, they have a habit of parking their vehicles on the track when attending emergencies in the city centre.

 

[Person A]

Taxi driver in a rush apparently. Wouldn't be surprised if he had a Berwick licence plate as well.

My guess is that he was mucking about under seat, or on his mobile.

 

[142094]

Has this been referred to the RAIB?

 

[Person A]

Has this been referred to the RAIB?

For the terminally silly maybe

 

[455driver]

My guess

Some FACTS to back this up would be nice or are you somebody that THINKS me knows everything but actually KNOWS very little!

 

[Person A]

Some FACTS to back this up would be nice or are you somebody that THINKS me knows everything but actually KNOWS very little!

I actually know more about this than you'd think, chum.
I couldn't have been MORE closer to this little event.
But as for what was going on in the driver of the car's mind - the words you need to study is "MY GUESS"

 

[455driver]

In that case I GUESS you are making it all up and know nothing!
Questions-
Were you in the car with the taxi driver,
Were you talking to him the moment he ran the light,
Did you see him playing with the mobile,
Did you see him mucking about under the seat,
Were you actually looking at him at the time.

If you answer "yes" to any of the above question then you may KNOW what he was doing, if not then you are only guessing, the same as anybody else whether they were there or not. The fact you have put 2 possibilities leads me to believe you do not KNOW at all but are just guessing and putting any possibility you can think of on here.
Just because you happen to be in the area, I GUESS you were on the tram, did you see the collision happen or did you just hear a BANG.
See how easy it is

Oh I aint your "chum" either pal, just so we are clear on that and KNOW where we stand!

 

[Person A]

In that case I GUESS you are making it all up and know nothing!
Questions-
Were you in the car with the taxi driver,
Were you talking to him the moment he ran the light,
Did you see him playing with the mobile,
Did you see him mucking about under the seat,
Were you actually looking at him at the time.

I never said he WAS doing any such thing. "MY GUESS IS..." seems to be a foreign language to you doesn't it ?
He SAID (I heard with my own ears at the time) he was blinded by the sun going down in his face. Yet didn't see a train, which isn't small
I saw him get out of the car, yes, the car pushed across the IN line and clear of that line. The rear door caved in a little, and above the rear wheel arch.
And odd isn't it.
You know NOTHING about what happened yet you're lecturing me.
For the last time then - "my guess is" is supposition. I haven't a clue what he did. He may have been distracted by the antics of a dozen monkeys he had in the rear of the car, while downing a bottle of vodka while juggling hedgehogs. I don't know. I can have wild suppositions though, as you see. The monkeys and hedgehogs were carefully concealed from the police later, obviously.
Back to definates, though - I noted what happened. And it really isn't unusual you know. It happens sometimes through brainless stupidity, sometimes bloody mindedness (Ive had several near things in the past at Fawdon & Kingston Park in paticular) and occasionally, people do really do things they wouldn't normally do and this kind of thing happens. Since this, kids on bikes have whizzed across the front of my train at this same station. Far more than normal.
You're full of it, but could you say for certain he DIDN'T do what (wait for it - get the English to Purposefully Confused translator out......) "I AM GUESSING" at ? :Now THAT is more common than juggling hedgehogs or misbehaving monkeys. eh ?

 

[142094]

Has the camera installed at Callerton had any impact there? Been a few stories in the Chronicle about people they have caught already.

Also, seems strange to not have some sort of barrier, or were they not installed due to the fact that the train is going at a slow speed anyway?

 

[Person A]

Has the camera installed at Callerton had any impact there? Been a few stories in the Chronicle about people they have caught already.

Its been on the front of the Chronicle, yes.
Personally, I never had any problems at Callerton.
Kingston Park* and Fawdon are the worst.
Couple of months ago on my last trip to the Airport, some loony ran across the front of me and I had to slam the brakes on. NOT the track brake, though but from the looks of him with his idiot grin and bulging eyes, he was on another planet anyways. So it's not just cars.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

Also, seems strange to not have some sort of barrier, or were they not installed due to the fact that the train is going at a slow speed anyway?

Actually, I don't remember if the old BR railway had a barrier here. I actually think they DID in 1980 or so just before the Metro opened. Its because the actual station is just before the crossing at both IN and OUT lines

 

[flymo]

Actually, I don't remember if the old BR railway had a barrier here. I actually think they DID in 1980 or so just before the Metro opened. Its because the actual station is just before the crossing at both IN and OUT lines

Sorry the thread is a little confused, or more than likely just me..

If you are talking about Callerton Parkway then that is not quite correct. The station is after the crossing on the IN line. If you are talking about Howdon then yes I agree the station is before the crossing on both lines and yes there were barriers before the Metro came along. Hmmm the must be some photos out there somewhere.

Actually looking at this photo the BR platform were at one time both on the UP (Wallsend) side of Howdon crossing. I do kind of remember this from my young years and using the North Tyne Loop DMU's. The memory does fade over time but I do remember both platforms being next to the gas tower there.

 

[142094]

Think I've seen a picture of the Fawdon crossing when it still had Coxlodge box there, and it had barriers at that time.

As an aside, what kind of ECS moves happen on the Metro in the early morning?

 

[Person A]

Sorry the thread is a little confused, or more than likely just me..

If you are talking about Callerton Parkway then that is not quite correct. The station is after the crossing on the IN line. If you are talking about Howdon then yes I agree the station is before the crossing on both lines and yes there were barriers before the Metro came along. Hmmm the must be some photos out there somewhere.

Actually looking at this photo the BR platform were at one time both on the UP (Wallsend) side of Howdon crossing. I do kind of remember this from my young years and using the North Tyne Loop DMU's. The memory does fade over time but I do remember both platforms being next to the gas tower there.

Thats actually what I was getting at. We were talking about Howdon by the way, quite understand jumping from Callerton to Howdon tho !.
Can't recall which side the old platforms were on at Howdon.
Good info. We should show a lot more old pics of the line and the old Riverside - I'm desperate for some pics of Walker, St Anthony's Point Pleasant Willington etc. Ive got very few in a book I got off Amazon by Alan Young (ironically the name of my minder driver when I started !)

As for ECS just the empty run to the likes of Benton sidings, Regent Centre sidings - half the time told to change on platform anyway, Stoneyhurst siding between South Gosforth and Ilford Road (was there sidings here with BR ? I'd say there were some just down from South Gosforth just in front of the building, gone now) and the run down to St James via Old Jesmond Station - closed 78 I think - past the big Northumbria uni building towards old Manors, and a sharp left angle 10kph onto new Manors platform, onto Stoddart St sidings watching out for an annoying 15k speed limit magnet just before, and another 15k entering sidings - two little interesting facts here. The 4 sidings have reds that DON'T bring down the track brake going past them. No magnets. Only one other place is like this on the whole system. There is an old tunnel that was used when going down the Quayside, we only use for remarshalling. I personally have only used it once. Different. then change ends in siding, take out towards St James, there'll be a little signal in a small theatre box, you're out across to the other platform at Manors, and up empty (I used to pick up, we aren't allowed to now) to St James.
This is done during match days now, and theres some down to Sunderland sidings to do the same for Sunderland matches.
A few rare ones, running empty to start here or there, unscheduled I suppose.
Then theres the ones where we have to use the "avoiding line" behind the depot to get from Longbenton line to Regent Centre line, although we've even taken passengers through there too.
And of course changeovers for a problematic train !