can virgin staff refuse you to enter the train

[robert2000]

just looking on their timetables, some evening services say you may be told to use another service.

just wondering because ive only just noticed that.

 

[Lampshade]

If one service is going to be heavily loaded with another soon after then it makes sense.

 

[Fincra5]

If the train is overloaded then fair enough, sometimes the train wont more (or somtheing) until it isn't overloaded.

 

[Invincibles]

I remember a long time ago, probably 2001, the gaurd asking people to get off a London - Wolverhampton Virgin train at Birmingham New St because there were too many on it.

In the end a cross country train left first and so people would have been quicker getting that but it is tempting to always get on the first train you see that is going where you want to go.

Be interesting to see how they would do that at Euston, presumably with barrier controls counting how many have got on. Then there is the possibility people with advance tickets for that train can not get on it and that connections are missed etc. Volunteers to get off at New St was much simpler to implement.

 

[Keele13]

I've been on a very busy Virgin service at Manchester Piccadilly (destination was Euston) and people were asked to get off and switch to another train as it wouldn't move otherwise - I think there were so many people they physically couldn't shut the doors. The platform staff were stopping latecomers getting on the train, and directing them to another service which left soon after.

 

[Old Timer]

just looking on their timetables, some evening services say you may be told to use another service.

just wondering because ive only just noticed that.

Under the Byelaws they can move passengers from a train as and when necessary. They can also arrange the completion of a journey, even if already started, by train or by any other means, so for example in an extreme circumstance they could fly you from Glasgow to London, or send you by bus or taxi from London to Liverpool.

Overloaded trains present a more difficult problem these days because the on train monitoring equipment will not allow the train to start if it senses it to be overloaded. In BR days, as long as we could shut the doors we were happy to let the train run and passengers were happyish to travel.

These days they dont want to travel standing, but then neither do they want to wait or travel on an alternative service.

I think in some instances Virgin are not so good at managing ovecrowding. For example when there is disruption out of Euston, many services which call at Milton Keynes or Rugby will be used by commuters to those destinations with the result that long distance passengers can be left behind. It has happened to me on a couple of occasions now. In these situations it would be better if the train was re-advertised as not calling from origin, e.g. MKC/RY passengers were sent to local services so as to allow the long distance passengers to get moving.

 

[bnsf734]

I remember reading somewhere that the Pendelinos have weight sensors in the coaches so if the train is overloaded the sensors will show this. Presumably they can see a read-out in the drivers cab or the train managers office. This is probably what would trigger the messages mentioned by the other posters.

Calv

 

[Failed Unit]

I think in some instances Virgin are not so good at managing ovecrowding. For example when there is disruption out of Euston, many services which call at Milton Keynes or Rugby will be used by commuters to those destinations with the result that long distance passengers can be left behind. It has happened to me on a couple of occasions now. In these situations it would be better if the train was re-advertised as not calling from origin, e.g. MKC/RY passengers were sent to local services so as to allow the long distance passengers to get moving.

I have had simular things happen under CT when the 153 turned up like a Sardine run they didn't give priority to anyone going beyond Lincoln (which is where the coach they used to supplement the journey was going to) So if you had an AP ticket to London for example you ended up 2 hours late and begging GNER (at the time) to let you travel without an fine. Although to be fair to GNER as soon as you mentioned you had come from Market Rasen on Central trains they just replied next time drive to Newark, at least you know you will make it and left it at that.

The next plan was to not stop at Market Rasen.

But East Coast often refuse people without reservations to board trains to Scotland at KX during the peaks (don't know what happens at Peterborough, I suspect that as long as the train isn't standing on leaving KX it won't be a major problem further north). Any TOC can refuse you if you appear under the influence.
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I remember reading somewhere that the Pendelinos have weight sensors in the coaches so if the train is overloaded the sensors will show this. Presumably they can see a read-out in the drivers cab or the train managers office. This is probably what would trigger the messages mentioned by the other posters.

Calv

Probably the same article but I understand if the coach is overwieght it won't tilt so staff may try to redistribute the wieght.

 

[robert2000]

what if the next service out of london was the LM to crewe, would you get that one or wait for the next virgin.

 

[Geezertronic]

I remember a long time ago, probably 2001, the gaurd asking people to get off a London - Wolverhampton Virgin train at Birmingham New St because there were too many on it.

It happened last year to me. The EUS-WVH train I was on was rerouted via the Trent Valley to Wolverhampton due to signalling issues on the Coventry-Birmingham line so it stopped at Rugby and any passengers for Coventry, Birmingham International and Birmingham New Street were advised to get off at Rugby and wait for the next VT service which was crammed. So the train departed Rugby and at Coventry would not depart because of weight issues in a couple of Standard coaches

 

[Lampshade]

what if the next service out of london was the LM to crewe, would you get that one or wait for the next virgin.

Get the next VT service, it'd get there first.

 

[Pumbaa]

yes - weight sensors are present in each car. If max weight is exceeded then train can run at non EPS speed, but that doesn't happen often as Manglement don't appreciate late running services. Football days this often happens as management are averse to telling drunken football fans to change train.

I remember reading somewhere that the Pendelinos have weight sensors in the coaches so if the train is overloaded the sensors will show this. Presumably they can see a read-out in the drivers cab or the train managers office. This is probably what would trigger the messages mentioned by the other posters.

Calv

 

[SignalEngineer]

just looking on their timetables, some evening services say you may be told to use another service.

just wondering because ive only just noticed that.

At Euston during the evening (especially Friday) they will have displayed at the bottom of the train destination board for particular trains 'Seat Reservation Holders Only'. In these instances passengers without reservations will be asked to queue until just before departure and allowed on if space permits.

It's usually the first 'off-peak' train where preak restictions are relaxed that tend to be the busiest. I did notice a few weeks ago while waiting at Euston that they actually made an announcement for a particulat train (I think it was the last 'peak' service to Manchester) that passengers with off-peak tickets could board this train. I think that was very sensible so as not to have space on one train then be sardines on the next.

 

[Trog]

Probably the same article but I understand if the coach is overwieght it won't tilt so staff may try to redistribute the wieght.

Ding Dong

"This is your train manager speaking."

"Would all passengers traveling in the vestibules please move to the Up side of the train, as we cross Concrete Cows Bridge."

"Then move to the down side as we cross the canal, before throwing yourselves back to the Up Side just north of Wolverton Station."

"Virgin Trains hope you have a pleasent journey, and ask that you all try to pick yourselves up off the floor before we get to Weedon."

 

[northwichcat]

Northern conductors do it all the time with Pacers, but then with Pacers they can't deal with excess weight unlike some other trains.

 

[142094]

Northern conductors do it all the time with Pacers, but then with Pacers they can't deal with excess weight unlike some other trains.

Don't think I've ever seen this before on a full Pacer, normally the conductor will tell people to move if they are blocking doors or the aisle. However I do agree that they can't deal with more passengers, was on a full one today and it struggled a bit on a small slope.

 

[ukrob]

Don't think I've ever seen this before on a full Pacer, normally the conductor will tell people to move if they are blocking doors or the aisle. However I do agree that they can't deal with more passengers, was on a full one today and it struggled a bit on a small slope.

It is a frequent occurrence for guards (and dispatchers where appropriate) to stop more people from boarding a 142 in the north west when it is rammed.

 

[northwichcat]

Don't think I've ever seen this before on a full Pacer, normally the conductor will tell people to move if they are blocking doors or the aisle. However I do agree that they can't deal with more passengers, was on a full one today and it struggled a bit on a small slope.

In the North West the Pacer policy seems to have changed in the last couple of years. It used to be the case that if there would be 70 standing the conductor refused a number entry to the train to some people and told them to wait for the next one. Now they seem to have realised the next train could be even fuller so if the doors can open and close and the train can move off then people don't need to be thrown off.

 

[dk1]

In the North West the Pacer policy seems to have changed in the last couple of years. It used to be the case that if there would be 70 standing the conductor refused a number entry to the train to some people and told them to wait for the next one. Now they seem to have realised the next train could be even fuller so if the doors can open and close and the train can move off then people don't need to be thrown off.

Last time is was at Manchester Victoria we had to ask the people nearest the toilet if they could pop in there for a second so the donkey's doors could close & we then get back on the step.

 

[shinkansen1966]

Not sure about Virgin.

But on Saturday had an unplesant experience with East Midlands Trains. Waited at Wellingborough with my push bike ready to board the delayed 16:11 back to St Pancras. Train of 125 stock arrived. Went to the back of the train, guard's van locked. Ran the length of the train with bike pass guard and station staff asking to hold the train. Got to front guards van, which was also locked. By which time, train doors were locked and train left without me. Not impressed with EMT staff at all.