Caledonian Sleeper

[Scotrail84]

Inverness NB 114 late arriving this morning owing to a broken rail at Pitlochry.

 

[greatkingrat]

These are interesting figures but I do wonder if there is missing data. The Highlander runs south approximately 310 times a year which, based on the numbers above, suggests only an average of 11 people per night board at Fort William? That figure seems remarkably low. Even if you take the total of all the stations listed between Fort William and Helensburgh, this only increases the nightly average to 13 people. That doesn't really tally with my experience on the CS where securing a berth, particularly in the height of the Summer season, can be a nightmare. It would also suggest the train is running almost empty which certainly isn't how it appears when the passengers offload at Euston (the FW portion is normally at the rear upon arrival).

Perhaps the above figures exclude tickets purchased via the CS website?

I suspect the figures probably don't include the sleeper flexipasses, so will miss out many of the regulars. Tourists using BritRail passes may not be included either.

 

[Scotrail84]

I suspect the figures probably don't include the sleeper flexipasses, so will miss out many of the regulars. Tourists using BritRail passes may not be included either.

Plus a few people opt to get off at other stations instead of whats on their ticket as its the same price no matter what your destination is.

 

[Shrop]

Plus a few people opt to get off at other stations instead of whats on their ticket as its the same price no matter what your destination is.

This is one reason why we take the CS from London rather than boarding at Crewe which is a whole lot closer to home. And ... we can get to London in the afternoon for barely any more cost than of getting to Crewe, thanks to railway pricing, and have a meal there before boarding. Not so much fun boarding around midnight either as it still takes a while to settle down, but boarding at London allows much more time to relax before bed

 

[route101]

I know this has probably been asked in the last 500 pages of this thread, but why are the seated passengers not allowed to go to the bar car?

Do they still do the at seat service in the seats?

 

[Scotrail84]

Do they still do the at seat service in the seats?

Yes they do.

 

[185143]

These are interesting figures but I do wonder if there is missing data. The Highlander runs south approximately 310 times a year which, based on the numbers above, suggests only an average of 11 people per night board at Fort William? That figure seems remarkably low. Even if you take the total of all the stations listed between Fort William and Helensburgh, this only increases the nightly average to 13 people. That doesn't really tally with my experience on the CS where securing a berth, particularly in the height of the Summer season, can be a nightmare. It would also suggest the train is running almost empty which certainly isn't how it appears when the passengers offload at Euston (the FW portion is normally at the rear upon arrival).

Perhaps the above figures exclude tickets purchased via the CS website?

I think I counted 8 off at Fort William on a Monday in January 2020.

So that's only just below the claimed average year round. I certainly share your scepticism of those figures.

 

[Peter Mugridge]

Also, now that Corrour has accommodation in the former signalbox, plus cottages, I'm surprised at the figure of 56. I'd expect the 2023/24 figures (out soon I believe) to show quite a bit of post-Covid growth.

Wouldn't anyone booking the accommodation at Corrour be more likely to use one of the daytime ScotRail services to get to and from there?

 

[Shrop]

Wouldn't anyone booking the accommodation at Corrour be more likely to use one of the daytime ScotRail services to get to and from there?

Put it this way, most people go to Corrour are there to explore the peace and beauty of the area by walking in it, and what better time to start than at 9am when the sleeper arrives? There are only four trains arriving each day (from each direction), and the two later trains don't give much time to explore the area, although I'm only guessing. It would be interesting to know the actual figures ...

 

[Peter Mugridge]

Put it this way, most people go to Corrour are there to explore the peace and beauty of the area by walking in it, and what better time to start than at 9am when the sleeper arrives? There are only four trains arriving each day (from each direction), and the two later trains don't give much time to explore the area, although I'm only guessing. It would be interesting to know the actual figures ...

When I said booking the accommodation, I meant as in staying in the converted signalbox and the cottages - not the train getting them there...

 

[Scotrail84]

.

 

[norbitonflyer]

Put it this way, most people go to Corrour are there to explore the peace and beauty of the area by walking in it, and what better time to start than at 9am when the sleeper arrives? There are only four trains arriving each day (from each direction), and the two later trains don't give much time to explore the area, although I'm only guessing. It would be interesting to know the actual figures ...

Surely if you are staying at Corrour you would arrive by a daytime train, at a time when you can get in to your acommodation.

 

[Shrop]

Surely if you are staying at Corrour you would arrive by a daytime train, at a time when you can get in to your acommodation.

Each to their own. Suppose you're coming up from London (or most other parts of England and Wales) to enjoy the complete change of scenery, yes you could use most of a whole day to travel to Corrour. Or you could travel up overnight and have the whole of your first day exploring the area. Depends how you want to use your time

 

[MatthewHutton]

These are interesting figures but I do wonder if there is missing data. The Highlander runs south approximately 310 times a year which, based on the numbers above, suggests only an average of 11 people per night board at Fort William? That figure seems remarkably low. Even if you take the total of all the stations listed between Fort William and Helensburgh, this only increases the nightly average to 13 people. That doesn't really tally with my experience on the CS where securing a berth, particularly in the height of the Summer season, can be a nightmare. It would also suggest the train is running almost empty which certainly isn't how it appears when the passengers offload at Euston (the FW portion is normally at the rear upon arrival).

Perhaps the above figures exclude tickets purchased via the CS website?

They feel like the number of normal tickets. i.e if you book an off peak return and a sleeper supplement for one direction. Then 11 average to Fort William seems reasonable.

 

[Bald Rick]

Each to their own. Suppose you're coming up from London (or most other parts of England and Wales) to enjoy the complete change of scenery, yes you could use most of a whole day to travel to Corrour. Or you could travel up overnight and have the whole of your first day exploring the area. Depends how you want to use your time

I speak from limited experience (only been there three times), but a good number of people in the accommodation at Corrour arrive under their own power.

 

[Shrop]

I speak from limited experience (only been there three times), but a good number of people in the accommodation at Corrour arrive under their own power.

Very commendable if they don't use trains, given that they can't use roads either. (Or boats )

 

[D6130]

Very commendable if they don't use trains, given that they can't use roads either. (Or boats )

Unfortunately it is now possible to reach Corrour by road....if you have access to an off-road 4x4 vehicle and permission to use the estate's private track. That's how the supplies for the Station House bar and restaurant are brought in.

 

[paul1609]

Each to their own. Suppose you're coming up from London (or most other parts of England and Wales) to enjoy the complete change of scenery, yes you could use most of a whole day to travel to Corrour. Or you could travel up overnight and have the whole of your first day exploring the area. Depends how you want to use your time

A lot of the clientele of the Corrour estate fly in to Inverness or Glasgow airports in their private jets and transfer by helicopter. The station area is very much the peasants end of the estate, trainspotting, yoof hostel, etc.

 

[Bald Rick]

Very commendable if they don't use trains, given that they can't use roads either. (Or boats )

It’s a day’s walk from Dalwhinnie or Fort William, and half a day from Spean Bridge. Plenty do it.

Unfortunately it is now possible to reach Corrour by road....if you have access to an off-road 4x4 vehicle and permission to use the estate's private track. That's how the supplies for the Station House bar and restaurant are brought in.

It’s been accessible by 4x4 for a while.

 

[paul1609]

It’s a day’s walk from Dalwhinnie or Fort William, and half a day from Spean Bridge. Plenty do it.

I've walked to Corrour from Fort William via Glen Nevis, even at my peak fitness it would have been beyond a days walk for me. Although it's marked as a continuous path on the os maps it's pretty rough and includes 2 serious river crossings that even mid summer are boots off in wild country. I stayed at one of the bothies midway. Beyond Steall Waterfall where all the walkers turn off for the Mamores you don't meet many people until you hit the track at the end of Loch Treig.

 

[Shrop]

It’s a day’s walk from Dalwhinnie or Fort William, and half a day from Spean Bridge. Plenty do it.

Time was that I'd have been one of them too - it's a beautiful part of the country . But these days I'd go by train and walk whilst there, in which case I'd be one of those who arrives on the sleeper to maximise my time there, at times when I don't want too long away from home.

 

[Bald Rick]

I've walked to Corrour from Fort William via Glen Nevis, even at my peak fitness it would have been beyond a days walk for me. Although it's marked as a continuous path on the os maps it's pretty rough and includes 2 serious river crossings that even mid summer are boots off in wild country. I stayed at one of the bothies midway. Beyond Steall Waterfall where all the walkers turn off for the Mamores you don't meet many people until you hit the track at the end of Loch Treig.

I should perhaps have said ‘a decent day’s walk’, but it’s definitley doable in a day. (depends how early you start of course!)

 

[paul1609]

I should perhaps have said ‘a decent day’s walk’, but it’s definitley doable in a day. (depends how early you start of course!)

I think my biggest concern would be people turning up at the crossing of the Abhainn Rath at Meanach or to maybe a lesser extent Tom an Eith expecting a park type walk. They are two of the most strenuous river crossings that I've experienced at low level. I'd certainly not attempt them after rain or in snow melt. I'd also not attempt the walk without some sort of bivvy or tent. The walk can be shortened somewhat by being dropped off or picked up at the Glen Nevis road end but is not a station to station walk that should be taken lightly IMHO.

 

[endecotp]

I think my biggest concern would be people turning up at the crossing of the Abhainn Rath at Meanach or to maybe a lesser extent Tom an Eith expecting a park type walk. They are two of the most strenuous river crossings that I've experienced at low level. I'd certainly not attempt them after rain or in snow melt.

Corrour to Kinlochleven is an alternative that doesn’t require the difficult river crossings, IIRC. I did it 30 years ago:

 

[paul1609]

Corrour to Kinlochleven is an alternative that doesn’t require the difficult river crossings, IIRC. I did it 30 years ago:

Is that the standard or club cabin?

 

[endecotp]

Is that the standard or club cabin?

The tent was an 18th birthday present I think! Or maybe that was the sleeping bag. I probably slept OK; no vibrations or snoring cabin-mate. En suite? Yes, I could step out into my own (snow) shower! So “Hiking Club Class” I reckon.

 

[pitdiver]

I think I prefer two weeks on Fuerteventura sitting by the side of the pool.

 

[Sleepy]

Sunday 20th revised timings due forecast storm conditions showing on Cal Sleeper website including departure from Fort William at 1645 !! https://www.sleeper.scot/travel-updates/

 

[JamieL]

Sunday 20th revised timings due forecast storm conditions showing on Cal Sleeper website including departure from Fort William at 1645 !! https://www.sleeper.scot/travel-updates/

Looks like the train will have a long wait at Helensburgh:

Helensburgh Upper - 2000
Dumbarton Central - 2254

Credit to CS for planning the service though. Far too many TOCs would just say "do not travel".

 

[ld0595]

Sunday 20th revised timings due forecast storm conditions showing on Cal Sleeper website including departure from Fort William at 1645 !! https://www.sleeper.scot/travel-updates/

Seems pretty sensible given the forecast. Certainly beats cancelling the service altogether.