Caledonian Sleeper

[Speed43125]

if anyone has been on CS within the last week or so, what have the loadings been like? I can’t imagine the trains will have been at all busy.

Haven't been on it, but from trackside, the Inverness portion noticeably seemed to have noone in the seated carriages pulling in to Dunblane the night before last. All long distance trains here are noticeably emptier, especially the Chieftain which is a far cry from the normal packed train.

 

[TimboM]

That doesn’t surprise me in the light of the advice not to travel and the fact that GWR have canned the Night Riviera for the foreseeable future- if anyone has been on CS within the last week or so, what have the loadings been like? I can’t imagine the trains will have been at all busy. I don’t think there’s much point running the Fort William train, in particular, until the advice not to travel is lifted.

On the whole been sparsely populated as you'd expect. Reports of Lowlanders with around 20-30 passengers on; Only 2 passengers on the Fort William the other night, etc. I'd say <20% of originally booked passengers are showing up and that's only likely to decrease as the govt. cranks up the 'enforcement' of social distancing.

The amended timetable is about ensuring a service of sorts to the main destinations can still run for the few who need it to and has resilience as and when crews and support staff go off ill / need to self-isolate etc.

 

[theironroad]

I just about got the jist of it reading it yesterday, though tbh overlooked the issue that only one train will run between Euston and Edinburgh and vv rather than 2.

I guess by CS cancelling all the lowlander reservations, then all current ticket holders (Inc fixed) will get a full refund.

I'm not really sure who would be classed as an 'essential worker ' that regularly needs to use the sleeper.

 

[JonathanH]

I'm not really sure who would be classed as an 'essential worker ' that regularly needs to use the sleeper.

Members of parliament, military, people employed by utilities, operation of the country - they may well not need to use it regularly but some of them might need it from time to time.

 

[snakeeyes]

I noticed today that there were 9 sleeper carriages in the sidings at Aberdeen.

 

[JonathanH]

I noticed today that there were 9 sleeper carriages in the sidings at Aberdeen.

It will have been 8 - they sent two 73s to Aberdeen this morning as the Fort William portion wasn't detached.

 

[gingerheid]

It's probably good that they haven't rebooked lowlander passengers. I can't see this service lasting long; hanging around concourses of otherwise closed up stations in the middle of the night probably isn't what people would have had in mind.

 

[PG]

The amended timetable is about ensuring a service of sorts to the main destinations can still run for the few who need it to and has resilience as and when crews and support staff go off ill / need to self-isolate etc.

Not entirely convinced on the resilience angle since CS don't seem too good on that front at the best of times!

Who's available to step in if a few Inverness staff aren't available? Not like the FTW or ABD crews are closeby...

 

[theironroad]

With the Scottish government and various Highland MPs and MSPs and an assortment of other bodies telling people in no uncertain terms they are not currently welcome to visit the Highlands/Islands and rural areas I imagine even the revised one train service will be carrying very limited numbers. Can't imagine it will continue for too long.

 

[Airline Man]

Not much chance of leisure traffic on the Sleeper. All the pubs and restaurants shut and the Hotels are virtually empty.

 

[al78]

I am booked on the sleeper on the 30th April for a guided backpacking weekend trip (in an unpopulated area), is there a good chance that the service will be terminated?

 

[Bletchleyite]

I am booked on the sleeper on the 30th April for a guided backpacking weekend trip (in an unpopulated area), is there a good chance that the service will be terminated?

Stay at home.

 

[MrEd]

Not much chance of leisure traffic on the Sleeper. All the pubs and restaurants shut and the Hotels are virtually empty.

A number of hotels in and around Inverness have closed their doors this weekend and will remain closed indefinitely until it is safe for folk to travel again. I get the impression that the service is being retained for as long as it is necessary, as a way to ensure that *essential* workers (and only *essential*) workers can still get from London to places in and north of the Central Belt efficiently. It could possibly be of use in transporting urgently needed medical staff/support staff, for instance, or even perhaps urgently needed medical supplies to Inverness? Admittedly loadings will be negligible, but perhaps the powers that be feel it is too important a link between London and Scotland to scrap during the crisis?

A plea from all my good friends and family in the Highlands- please do not even think of using it (the same goes for any train service in Scotland and the wider UK at present) unless your journey is *absolutely essential*, until the government decree that it is safe to travel again. The powers that be may well look to can it if it seems to be abused by influxes of tourists seeking ’isolation’ in rural Scotland. Thankfully many accommodation providers in the highlands have now closed their doors, and usage statistics for the sleeper are not suggesting that this is the case.

The current emergency timetable supposedly lasts until 30 May, but I wouldn’t like to bet on how long it will be before we see a Fort William or Aberdeen sleeper again. Hopefully not too long, if we’re all sensible and follow all the precautions now.

 

[MrEd]

I am booked on the sleeper on the 30th April for a guided backpacking weekend trip (in an unpopulated area), is there a good chance that the service will be terminated?

Unless a miracle happens, I honestly don’t think a guided backpacking trip will be going ahead then, and please, please don’t travel to any part of the highlands until the government gives the all-clear. If you’re booked on the Fort William service (or the Aberdeen for that matter), then that portion will undoubtedly be cancelled then, so your ticket will have been cancelled by default (and your money refunded). If you’re booked on the Inverness service, that portion will still be running but you’re asked to avoid non-essential travel; I believe that even if you have a fixed advance ticket, CS have made it so that you will be able to postpone your journey to a later date this year, so you won’t lose out financially.

CS have suggested that their emergency timetable will continue until 30 May, but the government advice against non-essential travel may last much longer than that and it may well be extended- I like to think that restrictions will be lifted and we will see a Fort William and an Aberdeen service before the summer is out, but this relies on us playing our part now and staying at home until we’re told otherwise.

P.S. I’m afraid your observation that your planned trip is to an unpopulated area is irrelevant in the current climate, as a simple trip/fall could result in a mountain rescue callout and your being hospitalised when the already limited hospitals in northern Scotland are working at full stretch. I wouldn’t recommend going, and would ask to postpone the trip (postpone, though, rather than cancel, as CS and lots of outdoor/tourism businesses will be glad of your business once this ordeal is over).

 

[al78]

Unless a miracle happens, I honestly don’t think a guided backpacking trip will be going ahead then, and please, please don’t travel to any part of the highlands until the government gives the all-clear. If you’re booked on the Fort William service (or the Aberdeen for that matter), then that portion will undoubtedly be cancelled then, so your ticket will have been cancelled by default (and your money refunded). If you’re booked on the Inverness service, that portion will still be running but you’re asked to avoid non-essential travel; I believe that even if you have a fixed advance ticket, CS have made it so that you will be able to postpone your journey to a later date this year, so you won’t lose out financially.

CS have suggested that their emergency timetable will continue until 30 May, but the government advice against non-essential travel may last much longer than that and it may well be extended- I like to think that restrictions will be lifted and we will see a Fort William and an Aberdeen service before the summer is out, but this relies on us playing our part now and staying at home until we’re told otherwise.

P.S. I’m afraid your observation that your planned trip is to an unpopulated area is irrelevant in the current climate, as a simple trip/fall could result in a mountain rescue callout and your being hospitalised when the already limited hospitals in northern Scotland are working at full stretch. I wouldn’t recommend going, and would ask to postpone the trip (postpone, though, rather than cancel, as CS and lots of outdoor/tourism businesses will be glad of your business once this ordeal is over).

My trip is through a guided walking/mountaineering company, so postponing the journey to a later date may not be much use unless I can book the same guided trip at a later date. If I do cancel the sleeper ticket, is there any chance of getting a refund given the circumstances, evenb though I bought the cheaper non-refundable/transferrable ticket? I can get the money back for the guided trip itself.

 

[alistairlees]

My trip is through a guided walking/mountaineering company, so postponing the journey to a later date may not be much use unless I can book the same guided trip at a later date. If I do cancel the sleeper ticket, is there any chance of getting a refund given the circumstances, evenb though I bought the cheaper non-refundable/transferrable ticket? I can get the money back for the guided trip itself.

Well, the policy and guidance are here: https://www.sleeper.scot/coronavirus-covid-19/

 

[al78]

Well, the policy and guidance are here: https://www.sleeper.scot/coronavirus-covid-19/

Thanks for that. I am booked on an Inverness service (going to Dalwhinnie), and it looks like they have relaxed their terms and conditions, so I have a good chance of a refund if I cancel. My original plan was to walk to Corrour to get the sleeper home, but that is out of the window now, fortunately I hadn't booked a return journey yet. I have got in touch with the mountain adventures company to get their advice.

I normally book a walking holiday in Scotland in the summer, but that is not happening until we get through this.

 

[Hadders]

It would be completely irresponsible to make a leisure journey to Scotland in April.

 

[al78]

It would be completely irresponsible to make a leisure journey to Scotland in April.

You are probably right, and I have been informed it is likely to be cancelled, and I can get a full refund or rebook for a later date, so we can safely assume I am not going now.

 

[al78]

I have just contacted them to ask for a refund (fingers crossed).

 

[47271]

I've just been forwarded an email sent to customers. The reason that they're cancelling bookings on the Lowlander is that they're having a massive no show rate. Apparently people who really need to travel can't get on because the train appears to be full, and then it runs half empty.

That's what they're saying anyway. At least the email makes sense, although it doesn't attempt to explain the service pattern information that's so garbled on the website.

 

[Chrism20]

I have received the email today and whilst it makes sense I don't believe much of the content in it.

This is an organisation that over the last ten days have wilfully blanked customers desperate to get a resolution for their travel plans, expected them to fork out hundreds of pounds a second time to switch dates before claiming a refund, suggested passengers were gaming the system, put out numerous incoherent messages and suggested passengers try travel insurance rather than offer any solutions of their own.

This is the third time I have booked with them over the last twelve months and on each occasion it has been shambolic - mainly due to the lack of communication rather than the actual product.

Had they been willing to assist passengers with reservations for these allegedly booked out services they may well have been able to free up space.

It clearly isn't going to happen at this very moment in time due to current events but the atrocious levels of customer service within this franchise need investigating and it needs to change.

 

[PG]

I do wonder if Serco will be tempted to reject the government Emergency Measures Agreement (https://www.gov.uk/government/news/...s-for-passengers-with-rail-emergency-measures) and hand back the keys with the OLR taking over the CS?

It seems like a 'get out of jail free card' in the case of the sleeper.

 

[MadCommuter]

5S26 noted on Traksy rolling back to Polmadie at 07.10. Everyone must have disembarked very early. Assuming anyone was on it.

 

[hwl]

I do wonder if Serco will be tempted to reject the government Emergency Measures Agreement (https://www.gov.uk/government/news/...s-for-passengers-with-rail-emergency-measures) and hand back the keys with the OLR taking over the CS?

It seems like a 'get out of jail free card' in the case of the sleeper.

It is a Tranport Scotland rather than DfT issue, hence no OLR

 

[Bald Rick]

I do wonder if Serco will be tempted to reject the government Emergency Measures Agreement (https://www.gov.uk/government/news/...s-for-passengers-with-rail-emergency-measures) and hand back the keys with the OLR taking over the CS?

It seems like a 'get out of jail free card' in the case of the sleeper.

Why would they? Leaving aside that it’s TS not DfT, the choices are:

1) hand back the keys and forefeit the value of all the performance bonds etc (which is millions), and continue making substantial losses until that is agreed

2) sign up, and from the moment of signature stop losing money and retain the value of the bonds.

It’s really rather a simple decision.

 

[mcmad]

Why would they? Leaving aside that it’s TS not DfT, the choices are:

1) hand back the keys and forefeit the value of all the performance bonds etc (which is millions), and continue making substantial losses until that is agreed

2) sign up, and from the moment of signature stop losing money and retain the value of the bonds.

It’s really rather a simple decision.

Unless they have calculated the expected losses up till now and from when things return to normal until the end of the franchise are likely to exceed the bond.

 

[hwl]

Unless they have calculated the expected losses up till now and from when things return to normal until the end of the franchise are likely to exceed the bond.

There are other franchises closer to matching /exceeding the bond than the sleeper...

 

[mcmad]

There are other franchises closer to matching /exceeding the bond than the sleeper...

quite possibly but what happens to those franchises south of the border is irrelevant to this discussion.

 

[AY1975]

The Glasgow and Inverness portions are joining at Edinburgh. Passengers from Edinburgh can join there. It will then run as one combined train to Euston in the highlander path.

Only the Fort William and Aberdeen portions are completely cancelled. Glasgow has revised timings; Edinburgh is just using the Glasgow coaches (so late boarding / early alighting) and Inverness is unchanged. It is using the highlander path from Edinburgh to London (and vice versa).

According to Real Time Trains, this morning's (and yesterday's and Monday morning's) Glasgow portion ran early. The CS website says the train is booked to arrive at Edinburgh at 03.54 and Edinburgh passengers (who presumably travel in the Glasgow portion) must vacate their berths (or seats) by 05.30, and the Glasgow portion is booked to leave Edinburgh at 05.44 but actually left at 05.10 on Monday, 04.22 yesterday and 05.19 today. I'm guessing that this was because there were no Edinburgh passengers so it was decided to let the Glasgow portion run early rather than have it taking up platform space at Waverley.