Caledonian Sleeper

[paul1609]

Yes, but then you have the inconvenience of changing train at Waverley in the middle of the morning peak while half awake and potentially sitting unwashed for an hour or more. It’s not much of an improvement IMHO.

Its not really like that, Train arrives at 07.23 don't need to get off till 08.00 Edinburgh station has good showers plenty of Breakfast options. OK Waverley has a scrum when the morning peak trains arrive around the Scotrail platforms but the outgoing trains aren't busy particularly in the winter. In fact Waverley is a nice station in a stunning location but not particularly major by South East England standards.

 

[marks87]

Also there is no option to select your seat any more. The only positive is the price is still reasonable.

Really? I just put in a random trip for a random day in May and can select a seat.

 

[swapmeetpete]

Really? I just put in a random trip for a random day in May and can select a seat.

Oops. Good point. Just found tiny 'select seat' link, thanks.

 

[185143]

Random question but how is the seated coach for travelling in?

Thinking about doing it between Edinburgh and London, anyone know the best seats to sit in for a good window view? They do have a seating plan but does not tell you if window view or not. Looking for 2 seats together. Thanks

Awful. Truly awful.

I was in physical pain when I reached Euston, from Glasgow and had a very poor sleep. Couldn't dissuade anyone from the seats highly enough. I was willing to attribute it to maybe being a dodgy seat, but I used the sleeper as a day train recently and after a couple of hours I started to go numb again. Noticeably not something that happened on the TPE 802 I went North on a few days earlier, bizarrely if they're the same seats.

Go for an even pair of seats and your view should be totally unrestricted. Avoid row 10 as they have that silly vinyl over the window.

 

[nlogax]

Waiting to board the nb Lowlander at Euston but we've been informed there's an issue with the 92 up front. Fingers crossed this can be sorted out.

 

[TimboM]

Waiting to board the nb Lowlander at Euston but we've been informed there's an issue with the 92 up front. Fingers crossed this can be sorted out.

It's still sat in P1 - 92028 I believe. I think 92010 is available at Wembley if needed, but would need a driver to head to Wembley to collect it (if not on their way already).

 

[nlogax]

It's still sat in P1 - 92028 I believe. I think 92010 is available at Wembley if needed, but would need a driver to head to Wembley to collect it (if not on their way already).

Great info, cheers Timbo. Shall remain optimistic!

 

[side effect]

Awful. Truly awful.

I was in physical pain when I reached Euston, from Glasgow and had a very poor sleep. Couldn't dissuade anyone from the seats highly enough. I was willing to attribute it to maybe being a dodgy seat, but I used the sleeper as a day train recently and after a couple of hours I started to go numb again. Noticeably not something that happened on the TPE 802 I went North on a few days earlier, bizarrely if they're the same seats.

Go for an even pair of seats and your view should be totally unrestricted. Avoid row 10 as they have that silly vinyl over the window.

Same here, 10 times worse than b4. My 14 year old son says he will never use the seats again opting to go less but pay for a berth. I took sleeping tablets and still woke with a stiff neck and a member of staff scaring people by slamming on the window telling us to get a move on.

 

[185143]

Same here, 10 times worse than b4. My 14 year old son says he will never use the seats again opting to go less but pay for a berth. I took sleeping tablets and still woke with a stiff neck and a member of staff scaring people by slamming on the window telling us to get a move on.

I used to sleep very well on the old seats, even missed the opportunity of breakfast one morning when I went to Inverness having just slept right through from Preston to Aviemore.

 

[jagardner1984]

Yes I used the seats on the old stock and it wasn’t a great nights sleep but it was ok. Dark carriage. Nice cosy chair. Warm. Reclining. It was sleeping in a chair which is generally crap. But it was cheap and it was fine for the price.

In almost every way, the new seats are a step backwards, and the situation regarding the lighting or air con makes them an actual laughing stock (see Twitter / Tripadvisor for details)

I’m sure there will be a resistance to admit there is a problem or to spend money on the solution, but it makes you wonder whether simple things like soft seat covers, turning the air handling to low or off except in extremes of temperature, and something ... anything to mute the lighting.

 

[Norther Monkey]

I back up everything that's been said about the new Caledonian Sleeper's seated coach. Uncomfortable and, in the small hours, cold. On the old stock I could get a reasonable amount of sleep, enough to function for a full day on arrival, albeit washed out by evening.
On the new stock, I rarely get any useful sleep due to a combination of comfort and temperature.
In addition the at seat catering fails yo deliver in a timely manner, with no option to go to the buffet yourself.
I'm now more likely to use flights or day trains if timings suit. It's still a good price, but is now a much less pleasant journey, to the extent that I suspect overnight coach may now be comparable. This would have been unthinkable on the old stock.

 

[jagardner1984]

My dragons den idea is to lease a decent quality tour bus (the kind bands etc use to travel) and run it Edinburgh, Glasgow London nightly.

some high quality reclining seating, some high quality beds. Generally they have a capacity of about 30-35. At sleeper prices that would cost about £5k per night. Personally I think there is a market between the megabus and the Sleeper train “luxury” product. Some kind of tie in with a gym / hotel for shower facilities either end. From my inexpert costing it can be done for a lot less than £150/160 per passenger per night with a decent margin.

At some point in rolling stock design, we need to be clear about the fact we still operate very slow railways and ageing poor quality P-way, so applying the principles of a Ryanair seat people sit in for an hour just doesn’t work. Comfort must be the absolute priority. I genuinely wonder whether the Seat was ever mocked up in Polmadie, and someone asked to sleep in it overnight. The longer the Mk5s are in service, the more I question the research, development and testing phases of the project. If the trains are in service for 30 years, as it stands the seats will deliver a lot of sleepless nights.

 

[nlogax]

Late boarding the Lowlander last night but we made it to GC almost on time. Can’t say it was the most comfortable sleep I’ve had in a club berth..I made the mistake of not bothering with whisky beforehand so spent the night keenly aware of every bump in the track and the glow around the lower and upper light switches.

Next time I’ll probably just fly.

 

[PG]

If the trains are in service for 30 years, as it stands the seats will deliver a lot of sleepless nights.

Maybe the only hope is mid-life refurbishment with someone sensible deciding on completely replacing the seats... roll on 2033+

 

[3rd rail land]

I considered taking my first ever trip on the Lowlander on Sunday as I need to be in Glasgow on Monday morning.

From what I have read on here and other places on the interweb I have decided to get the 1st flight out of London City Airport on Monday morning. Will mean a rather early start on Monday but at least I can have a peaceful sleep in my own bed and a shower before making the journey north of the border.

 

[BRX]

I'm yet to try the new seats, but remember that the old ones were a disaster temperature wise, had plenty of experiences of it being too cold or very overheated, or fluctuating between the two with the staff either unable or unwilling to control it.

 

[JonathanH]

My dragons den idea is to lease a decent quality tour bus (the kind bands etc use to travel) and run it Edinburgh, Glasgow London nightly.

some high quality reclining seating, some high quality beds. Generally they have a capacity of about 30-35. At sleeper prices that would cost about £5k per night. Personally I think there is a market between the megabus and the Sleeper train “luxury” product.

That market doesn't exist, certainly not year and week round - proved by the Megabus Sleeper service which no longer runs - and if you can't use the coach year and week round the investment isn't going to be recouped.

 

[Norther Monkey]

That market doesn't exist, certainly not year and week round - proved by the Megabus Sleeper service which no longer runs - and if you can't use the coach year and week round the investment isn't going to be recouped.

I always thought the Megabus sleeper wasn't particularly well publicised in addition to undoubtedly suffering some prejudice against coach travel. I'm rather sad it's gone as the poor seats and eye watering cabin prices on the train mean I would definitely now try it.

 

[Mathew S]

Comfort must be the absolute priority.

After safety, accessibility, affordability, reliability, maintainability, and cleanliness to name a few things. Comfort is important, but it's at least 7th on the list.

 

[jagardner1984]

After safety, accessibility, affordability, reliability, maintainability, and cleanliness to name a few things. Comfort is important, but it's at least 7th on the list.

Well obviously safety first, but a lot of the others are interlinked with Comfort.

Personally, as much I was staunchly against Brexit, if there is a regulation that means I must arrive at my destination massively less comfortable than I am in, for example, a perfectly safe robust modern clean Pendolino 1st Class Seat, I am fully supportive of that regulation being changed.

 

[Train368]

Thanks for everyone on the opinion of overnight sleeper on seated seats.

I did the Megabus M11 last year and it was not fun... No service breaks and the air con was on all night blowing freezing air. I thought the train would be better as least you would have a decent toilet to use and it's a bit faster, but no good if the air vent blows cold air and if the window views are restricted by a light above the windows

 

[Train368]

I see the twitter page says the lights are dimmed, is that true? As most of you say they are still bright? is that them dimmed or do they not bother?

 

[JonathanH]

I see the twitter page says the lights are dimmed, is that true? As most of you say they are still bright? is that them dimmed or do they not bother?

Main lights are dimmed but not the ones above the windows.

 

[JonathanH]

I did the Megabus M11 last year and it was not fun... No service breaks and the air con was on all night blowing freezing air.

Who wants a service break? The best thing is to get on and fall asleep (and if you do fall asleep not be woken up by a stop).

At least with cold air, it is possible to put another layer of clothing on. Worse is when coach drivers don't put the air on at all.

The leg room on the new coaches for the M11 is a bit tight but the seats are soft.

 

[Train368]

Who wants a service break? The best thing is to get on and fall asleep (and if you do fall asleep not be woken up by a stop).

At least with cold air, it is possible to put another layer of clothing on. Worse is when coach drivers don't put the air on at all.

The leg room on the new coaches for the M11 is a bit tight but the seats are soft.

I can get you're point about the service break, but this bus departed at 23:45 from Glasgow and didn't arrive till 11:30 the next morning hence why a morning service break would have been nice to stretch the legs. I know there is a earlier faster service though (it was just because of timing reasons I couldn't make the 22:30 service and had to take the slow one although a lot of other passengers travelled full way too)

 

[computerSaysNo]

Main lights are dimmed but not the ones above the windows.

Is there not a law which prevents them turning off the lights completely or substantially dimming them?

 

[Struner]

The same goes for the Night Riviera I suppose?
How does that compare?
(Just on the lighting in the seated coaches please?)

 

[route101]

I can get you're point about the service break, but this bus departed at 23:45 from Glasgow and didn't arrive till 11:30 the next morning hence why a morning service break would have been nice to stretch the legs. I know there is a earlier faster service though (it was just because of timing reasons I couldn't make the 22:30 service and had to take the slow one although a lot of other passengers travelled full way too)

I seen that bus on the booking system and wondered why it takes so long . Hits the morning peak?

 

[route101]

I back up everything that's been said about the new Caledonian Sleeper's seated coach. Uncomfortable and, in the small hours, cold. On the old stock I could get a reasonable amount of sleep, enough to function for a full day on arrival, albeit washed out by evening.
On the new stock, I rarely get any useful sleep due to a combination of comfort and temperature.
In addition the at seat catering fails yo deliver in a timely manner, with no option to go to the buffet yourself.
I'm now more likely to use flights or day trains if timings suit. It's still a good price, but is now a much less pleasant journey, to the extent that I suspect overnight coach may now be comparable. This would have been unthinkable on the old stock.

£30 with a railcard on less busy services , didnt realise there was at seat catering.

 

[route101]

Thanks for everyone on the opinion of overnight sleeper on seated seats.

I did the Megabus M11 last year and it was not fun... No service breaks and the air con was on all night blowing freezing air. I thought the train would be better as least you would have a decent toilet to use and it's a bit faster, but no good if the air vent blows cold air and if the window views are restricted by a light above the windows

One advantage of the coach is they dim the lights .