Bletchleyite
Veteran Member
No, you can actually enter the station to board the FW portion, it also runs as a regular day train between Edinburgh and FW in both directions.
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Caledonian Sleeper
- Thread starter Essexman
- Start date
No, you can actually enter the station to board the FW portion, it also runs as a regular day train between Edinburgh and FW in both directions.
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R
RailUK Forums
Indeed.
What has frustrated me in the past is that passengers aren't allowed to board the southbound Highland Sleeper at Edinburgh. I know people who have done the pretty farcical thing of getting a train from Edinburgh to Inverkeithing, to get on the Sleeper, to get back to Edinburgh, where the sleeper stops to wait for the Inverness and Fort William sections...
Because of this restriction, you can't buy a ticket from Edinburgh for the Highland Sleeper, but pragmatically, I don't know what would happen if you tried to get on at Edinburgh with a ticket booked from Inverkeithing (there's a risk a cabin would be reallocated, but a seat can't be)
Why should passengers be allowed to board the Southbound Highland Sleeper at Edinburgh? I assume your use case is travel to Preston or Crewe?
Waverley station is closed for entry before the passengers could board the relevant portion of the Highland sleeper. The last departure is the 2356 to Bathgate.
PG
Established Member
I'm assuming that in this modern age it isn't possible to detach 1 carriage and leave it in a platform for a few hours?
Nope - in the cases I've heard about it's because the lowland was fully booked and the people wanted to go all the way to London.
sure, but (as one example) there's a 00:22 arrival from Tweedbank. Why shouldn't someone from Galashiels be allowed to use the Highland Sleeper and connect at Edinburgh?
The last arrival into Edinburgh is 01:03, which is after the Sleeper arrives. Presumably the station needs staff until all passenger trains have arrived, so to say
is surely wrong?
PG
Established Member
And I'm guessing no shore supply exists within the confines of Waverley!
The key word is entry. Thats not to say it couldn't be facilitated but currently it isn't.
that's specifically why I wondered (semi-out-loud)
I didn't state that the passenger would enter the station, but what would happen if they made a connection
Falcon1200
Established Member
Fair points. Maybe it's just as well the Sleepers are now hauled by 92s rather than 90s!
Deepgreen
Established Member
Exactly my point from earlier about its exclusion from the main (Scotrail) timetable. Passengers on the route are denied sensible knowledge of the full service on offer on a sparsely-served route.
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I thought 92s had been used for years now.
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Scotrail84
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It has, 92s are the only compatible electric locos that can couple and provide enough ETS to power the coaches.
Falcon1200
Established Member
Since the Mark 5 stock replaced the Mark 3s, so 2019.
BRX
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The 92s started in use before the Mark 3s were gone and were used in parallel with the 90s for a while.
Falcon1200
Established Member
Fair enough. I had 90043 and 90044 in April 2019!
Scotrail84
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That would have been the last few months of the highlander and MK3s?
62484GlenLyon
Member
I have a note that says the Lowlander went over to mk5 operation in late April 2019. As for as The Highlander is concerned 1S25's last run with mk3 was the night of 8/9 October and 1M16 was the following night.
Scotrail84
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Lowlander started with MK5s on a Sunday night ECML run and it was a complete disaster of a 'launch', the Southbound train ended up being about 3 hours late into London.
The Highlander switch over occurred Wednesday night leaving London IIRC.
BRX
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Last ever mk3 service arrived in London morning of 10th October 2019.
Falcon1200
Established Member
Indeed, that was the reason for making a Sleeper trip, before the Mark3s went (although it was the Lowlander from Edinburgh I was on)!
xotGD
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I was on that final 1S25 / 1A25, shivering in the Mark 2 seated coach. It was a 90 that night. At least I got to enjoy a bit of thrash from an open droplight when the pair of 73s took over.
Sun Chariot
Established Member
I was surprised to see all the sleeping cars in the old "Barbie" FirstGroup livery. Some Mk3s made it into their final livery (in the video, one of the Mk2fs wears it)
Scotrail84
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I think only 5 or 6 made it into the green livery, they were used in a photo shoot for when Serco took over.
Scotrail84
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People wanting to stay on a train thats arrived at its terminating station that they've been on for 10-12+ hours is an absolute nonsense imo.
Run at 80mph all the way and everyone gets off on arrival, its a train, not a hotel with a late checkout option.
Sorry, I completely disagree. The lowland leaves Glasgow Central at 23.45 and I've been kicked off at around 06.15, that's not 10 - 12 hours. Personally I don't see anything wrong with being wakened upon arrival and enjoying my 'breakfast' then too, being able to have that, get dressed and leave the train at my pace.
Nothing else is open in the vicinity of Euston at 06.15. Even taking my time strolling to St. Pancras can see me standing outside their Wetherspoon's waiting on it opening up.
As we all know, Serco was at pains to let everyone know that the Sleeper was a "hotel on wheels".
Scotrail84
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They can get on at 22:00 in Glasgow, thats plenty time on board.
It's not a hotel on wheels. It never has been, and it never will be no matter how they dress it up. Its a train that gets you from A to B and nothing more.
You must presumably be unaware that their website (which most people book through) advertises a "vacate room by" time which is generally much later, usually 07:30. It is entirely reasonable to hold CS to this. If they don't want to abide by it, they shouldn't advertise it.
It's absolutely marketed and priced as a hotel on wheels and - supposedly - a luxury experience. Indeed their website explicitly notes that you are saving CO2 emissions compared to getting a hotel room.
There is an advertised checkout time. It's not a "late" checkout if you stay until then!
If boarding begins on time. In any event, not everyone will be able to board that early, and not everyone will be happy with getting less than 8 hours' sleep/rest (bearing in mind you will want to shower, eat, use the loo etc.)
It is marketed as a "unique way to travel". An alternative to a hotel, not a hotel in itself.
There is CS lounge at Euston.
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If you want “real” travellers to use, business people don’t want to be dumped into Euston at 6:15am after a short nights sleep on board. The railway is pretty poor at understanding and meeting customers needs and CS - through late check out - is one of the few operators that does try and “get it”.
This conversation has been had before - you have your opinion, I suspect most others will disagree. This doesn't change the material that CS publish that set expectations for their passengers.
The timetable clearly states the time that berths must be vacated. All those who chose to travel by sleeper train weigh this consideration into their choice of overnight train vs daytime travel and hotel.
Caledonian Sleeper has been marketed for a good few years (if not at the present moment), as a boutique hotel on wheels. It's always been the case that sleeper trains have an arrival time and a disembarkation time - so it's hardly unreasonable to expect the operator to honour them.