Caledonian Sleeper

[PG]

So going by these posts we've spent £££s on fancy kit which is ill thought out and has worse ride quality then a 1970's design

Actually it proves that the Mk3 coach is the benchmark against which everything else is judged and that the good folk at Derby knew more than a thing or two.

Having travelled on the Mk5s several times now (I don't use the earplugs) there is certainly more noise on them regardless of where in the coach you are compared to the mk3s. The ride is rougher also.

Only used the Mk5 once but my perception was also that the ride definitely wasn't as smooth and was perhaps noisier than the Mk3 (I do use earplugs, even at home most nights).
The lack of noise insulation is puzzling.

Because it's cheaper, having the air con outlet next to your shoulder is a master stroke worthy of a sadist

 

[6Z09]

I see Serco appear to have retained the Northlink ferry contract. That’s another one the RMT appeared to want them off & Calmac on, will be interesting to see if this changes relations between the union & Caledonian Sleeper
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-north-east-orkney-shetland-49768127

As far as the Sleeper is concerned, the staff voted overwhelmingly in favour of taking action,hardly a case of the union imposing a ruling to its members,figures were something like 90 in favour of taking action 7 against.

 

[paul1609]

I can't picture anybody being confused by a mixer tap! As for the "silent ride", Euston to Glasgow is hardly a "Victorian alignment", it's a very much improved route where daytime trains offer silent rides at 125mph. If the sleeper is noisy at 80mph it can only be down to the trains being rubbish.

Take a 395 on HS1 into St Pancras then change on to any service out of Euston (or even worse out of Kings Cross) and you'll change your mind. When compared to javelin on hs1 a HST on the ECML is appalling.

 

[PG]

Take a 395 on HS1 into St Pancras then change on to any service out of Euston (or even worse out of Kings Cross) and you'll change your mind. When compared to javelin on hs1 a HST on the ECML is appalling.

The only way to put this to the test would be to sample the Mk5 ride on HS1... can't see that happening anytime soon!

 

[paul1609]

Because it's cheaper, having the air con outlet next to your shoulder is a master stroke worthy of a sadist

In times of delay the dellner couplings will be a hinderance rather than a help.
Currently a late running northbound Highlander is able to make up time at Waverley with a slick split,dont see that being the case with the new stock and dellners!

Can't see Delner couplings per se being a snag. 377s are allowed 4 mins from rear portion arrive to combined train departure and vice versa. Done multiple times an hour on the Brighton line with no probs. Obviously Multiple Units are easier than CS stock.

 

[mmh]

Take a 395 on HS1 into St Pancras then change on to any service out of Euston (or even worse out of Kings Cross) and you'll change your mind. When compared to javelin on hs1 a HST on the ECML is appalling.

I travel on the WCML a lot, and have a few times on 395s. Yes HS1 is notably smooth, but it would be. I think my point stands, if 125mph trains on the WCML are smooth and quiet (which they are, it's not the Victorian experience a poster suggested) then there's no reason brand new sleeper stock shouldn't be.

 

[route101]

The Twitter team seemed to disappear before the service departed Glasgow last night (this morning) and have been MIA all day!

Yeah , there was just one tweet saying boarding was delayed . No information from staff whatsoever . A few customers asked what was going on however ?

 

[route101]

I've just viewed it on the Preston Railcam and its a GBRf liveried version - possibly 92043 was used off the Edinburgh Carstairs portion and the delay was caused by swapping 92006 for 92043 there?

Yeah , the glasgow portion was on the rear , 73 came off and ran around . Very hard to tell if it was a 73 or 92 hauling as diesel loco haulage feels heavier to me on older stock .

 

[route101]

Away 0152 apparently and lost another half hour at Carstairs. Currently at Oxenholme when it should be south of Rugby

I awoke as we were going through Warrington..

We also were on the slows towards London , plenty pendos whizzed past us .
And went via Northampton.

 

[route101]

Oh well - looks like you may well beat the 0428 into London!

It beat us , infact the 530 nearly beat us. I wonder if we would been allowed to travel on that , id got on it and refused to buy a new ticket .

 

[route101]

Away 0152 apparently and lost another half hour at Carstairs. Currently at Oxenholme when it should be south of Rugby

Felt for the lady who boarded at Motherwell , she would been without information and by herself . Was surprised she looked to be travelling in business and another guy was too . Are the berths too dear for business traveller .

A guy was about to bail at Glasgow , but as convinced to stay on as we were about to depart .

 

[route101]

So my first ride on new sleeper was a wee bit of a disaster , arrived nearly 3 hours late . Luckily i had nothing important to attend to . Seats were busy , few Rangers fans heading home after the game . Few people were sleeping on the floor and in the luggage bit .
The seats were not as uncomfortable as i feared but i think they will get grubby quick . Vent was slightly annoying and was cold later on the journey . Was disappointed the lights are not turned out . There was two sets of lights , ones at the windows and the main ones. A guy asked if they could be turned off , got told no .

The toilet was out of action. Seated passengers had to go through the lounge car to get to the toilets . And you couldn't go through to the Edinburgh portion , doors were locked .
Staff were understandingly stressed . A drunk guy was getting very angry and demanded answers , almost got violent . No announcements were made over the PA ( Is there one?) about the problem. Seems to some sort of fitter whos onboard , wheres casual clothes but no hi vis .
In the morning , teas , juices etc were given out but no apology. Seemed that keeping us quiet was the way to go.
Would try a berth but price is too steep.

 

[JModulo]

The toilet was out of action..

The accessible toilets have been mostly out of use since the introduction of the MK5s, and are even less reliable than the standard ones.

 

[Kite159]

There was two sets of lights , ones at the windows and the main ones. A guy asked if they could be turned off , got told no .

If the lights above the windows are turned out it isn't so bad with the roof lights. When I did the new sleeper the window lights were right in my eye line

 

[route101]

Notice theres no tickets for seat reservations now , so now no way to work out any free seats

 

[route101]

It looks like the delayed Lowland Sleeper was overtaken by the first Virgin train of the day from Glasgow just south of Milton Keynes then arrived 30 mins later than it. That must have been a depressing sight.

I probably seen that train whizz past , i think the next Glasgow arrival would of been not far behind when we arrived at Euston. Reminds me to get my delay repay in. I would of wondered if we would of been allowed to travel on that early virgin.

 

[31160]

If the lights above the windows are turned out it isn't so bad with the roof lights. When I did the new sleeper the window lights were right in my eye line

There are round down lights in the roof next to the strips, but I assume they are emergency lights? They would be ideal to give ambient lighting without being too bright
Also the toilets (when working) are very badly designed for a sleeper train as in a sleeper the chance that someone will at some point be washing their face or cleaning teeth etc, and the design of the sink makes that impossible as you cant lean over it, just place your hands in, how noone spotted that one is amazing, this isn't a day train and shouldn't be designed as such, ie noisy aircon next to your head when your trying to sleep

 

[Bletchleyite]

TBH I find that modern train toilet sinks are poorly designed for any purpose. As a tall person I can't see where the tap is and have to keep feeling around for it. A simple push to operate tap would work better, if you're utterly paranoid about bacteria you could always push it using your elbow.

But yes, they do seem *particularly* bad for the needs of those washing more than just their hands as indeed people will do on sleeper trains.

 

[awsnews]

Looks like a test run for the FW portion is scheduled for Wednesday:
https://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/K03397/2019/09/18/advanced

The one scheduled for today has ran, currently running behind the normal service to Fort William.

 

[gingerheid]

While it's still totally the only way to travel, slightly disappointed by the number of snags that still exist months later, and slightly worried that they seem to be multiplying.

Sink had a card advising that it really had been cleaned but that it had been stained by detergent, standing in a particular place on the floor caused a creaking noise between the cabins (and from next door too), and the side had fallen off the device holder for the top bunk, leaving a very rough / slightly sharp edge beside people's head. Still a draft and noise from under the window. I think the train (GLC - EUS) was also missing a carriage?

Did notice that although people have said before that it can't be (and previously I'd have agreed with them), the ladder is actually removable.

 

[Bald Rick]

While it's still totally the only way to travel, slightly disappointed by the number of snags that still exist months later, and slightly worried that they seem to be multiplying.

Sink had a card advising that it really had been cleaned but that it had been stained by detergent, standing in a particular place on the floor caused a creaking noise between the cabins (and from next door too), and the side had fallen off the device holder for the top bunk, leaving a very rough / slightly sharp edge beside people's head. Still a draft and noise from under the window. I think the train (GLC - EUS) was also missing a carriage?

Did notice that although people have said before that it can't be (and previously I'd have agreed with them), the ladder is actually removable.

The ladder is definitely removable - I’ve done it myself!

Had a second trip on the new stock recently. Similar to the last one. Boarding easy, lounge car great, bed very comfy, arrived bang on time. Didn’t sleep much as there’s no escaping the fact you are on a vehicle moving at 80mph and sometimes accelerating / braking / going round curves. In that respect it is no different to the old stock, but the (much) comfier bed does help to make up for it. No issues with any of the facilities - all worked perfectly, and the staff were great.

Not sure I’ll use it again though; day train / Easyjet + Premier Inn is much more comfortable, avoids hanging around till late in the evening, and I don’t start the day feeling like I’ve been looking after a 6 week old baby.

 

[gingerheid]

The ladder is definitely removable - I’ve done it myself!

Had a second trip on the new stock recently. Similar to the last one. Boarding easy, lounge car great, bed very comfy, arrived bang on time. Didn’t sleep much as there’s no escaping the fact you are on a vehicle moving at 80mph and sometimes accelerating / braking / going round curves. In that respect it is no different to the old stock, but the (much) comfier bed does help to make up for it. No issues with any of the facilities - all worked perfectly, and the staff were great.

Not sure I’ll use it again though; day train / Easyjet + Premier Inn is much more comfortable, avoids hanging around till late in the evening, and I don’t start the day feeling like I’ve been looking after a 6 week old baby.

It suits me to not lose a day, so in that respect I'm their target market. True it's not the best place to sleep, but with the help of a certain amount of Lucozade and Irn Bru I can get through a full day at work afterwards!

I finished my journey on a GA Mk3 and yeah I was awake and sitting upright, but I'm pretty sure the suspension on them is better!

 

[nlogax]

Had a second trip on the new stock recently. Similar to the last one. Boarding easy, lounge car great, bed very comfy, arrived bang on time. Didn’t sleep much as there’s no escaping the fact you are on a vehicle moving at 80mph and sometimes accelerating / braking / going round curves. In that respect it is no different to the old stock, but the (much) comfier bed does help to make up for it. No issues with any of the facilities - all worked perfectly, and the staff were great.

Glad to hear your experience was positive and hope you managed to get a decent dram or two in the lounge car. I found that definitely helped with the sleep Am looking forward to booking another Sleeper trip later in the year - though not for £280 if I can find a cheaper night!

 

[Bald Rick]

It suits me to not lose a day, so in that respect I'm their target market. True it's not the best place to sleep, but with the help of a certain amount of Lucozade and Irn Bru I can get through a full day at work afterwards!

I finished my journey on a GA Mk3 and yeah I was awake and sitting upright, but I'm pretty sure the suspension on them is better!

In my opinion the new stock rides as well as, and possibly better, than the Mark 3s. Using the plane / hotel option means I don’t lose a day either. In both options I leave home mid evening and am in the right part of Scotland for 8/9am. Or coming south, I leave Scotland a bit earlier for the last plane (in what would be otherwise dead time), and get a solid 7hrs sleep in my own bed and see my kids before I go to work.

Glad to hear your experience was positive and hope you managed to get a decent dram or two in the lounge car. I found that definitely helped with the sleep Am looking forward to booking another Sleeper trip later in the year - though not for £280 if I can find a cheaper night!

I suspect that too much Schiehallion *may* have contributed to the poor sleep!

 

[PG]

In my opinion the new stock rides as well as, and possibly better, than the Mark 3s.

I'll admit I've not travelled on either Mk3 or Mk5 sleepers, and unless the pricing reverts to something akin to the old bargain berths it's unlikely I ever will.

However I'm definitely curious, given your opinion that the ride is better or at least no worse than the Mk3's, if any others are of the same opinion?? Perhaps the suspension settings have been 'tweaked' recently since they were first introduced?

 

[cambsy]

I’m doing on 4 nights on the sleeper Mk5’s next week as part of my ALR, so with approx 32 hours on them next week ill give a review of both Classic and Club berths, I’m really looking forward to seeing what they are like, and compare to the Mk3 sleepers, the new berths are expensive though as with one night on the Night Riviera as well, I have spent 660 for 5 nights on the sleepers next week, which definitely ouch.

 

[JModulo]

However I'm definitely curious, given your opinion that the ride is better or at least no worse than the Mk3's, if any others are of the same opinion?? Perhaps the suspension settings have been 'tweaked' recently since they were first introduced?

I travelled on them again last Friday and would still say the ride remains poor in my eyes. In comparision I would still say a mk3, even above a bogie, is more comfortable than a mk5 in the middle of the coach.

 

[47271]

Speaking to a few people who have used both old and new a lot, and had one run on the mk5s myself, the view is that mk5 ride and noise levels are an improvement in some respects, and a marked deterioration in others.

The Dellners and new gangways have done away with the awful forward and back snatching, and corridor wheezjng, you get on mk3s.

Sharp vertical movement is much worse on the mk5s, with some having a terrible rattling noise coming up from the bogie. You never get that lovely creamy smooth air suspension ride that you have in a mk3 in top condition at speed.

Ambient noise levels are definitely higher in mk5s, both from outside the coach, and from the badly placed aircon outlet whistling away under the window. This feature is raised as a regular criticism of the new trains, both in sleepers and seated coaches.

If they could consistently ensure that there's no rattles and sharp vertical movement, and tone down the aircon whistle, then overall they'd nearly be better than the mk3s.

Advice is still the same as it's ever been: always book a cabin as far from the wheels and as close to the centre of the coach as possible.

 

[D6975]

TBH I find that modern train toilet sinks are poorly designed for any purpose. As a tall person I can't see where the tap is and have to keep feeling around for it. A simple push to operate tap would work better, if you're utterly paranoid about bacteria you could always push it using your elbow.

But yes, they do seem *particularly* bad for the needs of those washing more than just their hands as indeed people will do on sleeper trains.

Bring back the old brass stud on the floor, a much better way of doing it.

 

[Jocques]

I went on the old one to FW and I have to say, the actual sleep was fantastic. I slept like a log, really comfy and the noise didn't bother me.

The ladder is really easy to remove, I just plonked it on the top bunk. There was a surfeit of towels (six!) and I was tempted to take one as a memento.