Caledonian Sleeper discussion

[Scotrail84]

Fort william barely achieves a 9 hr break on the normal timetable. But I think maybe staffing on that branch goes out and back in one night (along with lounge car and seated coach)?

Fresh crew on that each night.

Guard is either a Dalmuir or edinburgh based man, Edinburgh only cover when there’s shortages or after delays like last night.

 

[Scotrail84]

I suspect your gen is accurate Last night's 1S25 arrived in Inverness at 13:05 (and the crew would've still been working for a period after that whilst passengers alighted) - so c.13:30 + 9 hours = 22:30, i.e. the revised departure time.

Interestingly boarding will still commence at 20:00 and presumably some staff will be required for this, so does that mean additional cover has been obtained from Inverness-based CS staff to do the boarding?

I'm also wondering why the Fort William service doesn't appear to be delayed departing too, even though last night's service was similarly late arriving and presumably it uses the same crew back to London tonight? 1Y11 arrived at 13:53, so assuming a 9 hour break it would not be able to depart until after 23:00... (not 19:50)??

(Aberdeen is OK as arrived 11:12 and due to leave 21:43, so >9 hours.)

100% accurate mate.

The guard is there and they will probably use people from service centre up there until the crew book on.

Ft William is a fresh crew each night working to/from Edinburgh with one working right through to London on a Sunday, Tuesday and Thursday. One London crew member works to ft William on a Sunday, Tuesday and Thursday.

 

[TimboM]

Fresh crew on that each night.

Guard is either a Dalmuir or edinburgh based man, Edinburgh only cover when there’s shortages or after delays like last night.

Thanks for clarifying/confirming (and in your additional post - which answered my follow-up Q which I've not edited from this post!)

 

[BRX]

On nbound highlander. Aberdeen seated coach out of action yet again...passengers being transferred to berths.

 

[TimboM]

On nbound highlander. Aberdeen seated coach out of action yet again...passengers being transferred to berths.

Looks like a whole load of back-packers getting on to the seated coach behind the loco at Crewe (which I think is the Aberdeen one) - are they going to manage to fit them all in too, or time to get their warm sleeping bags out?!

 

[GW43125]

Looks like a whole load of back-packers getting on to the seated coach behind the loco at Crewe (which I think is the Aberdeen one) - are they going to manage to fit them all in too, or time to get their warm sleeping bags out?!

I thought it was the Fort Bill beds behind the loco?

 

[GW43125]

1M11 - 92043
1M16 - 92033

(both are working the reverse services tonight - i.e. 1S25 = 92033 / 1S26 = 92043)

Thank you.

 

[BRX]

Looks like a whole load of back-packers getting on to the seated coach behind the loco at Crewe (which I think is the Aberdeen one) - are they going to manage to fit them all in too, or time to get their warm sleeping bags out?!

They were putting them into one of the sleeper coaches actually (the aberdeen/ftw seats are 8 coaches back from the loco). In fact I thought they'd just been removed from the seats, might be wrong though).

 

[BRX]

I thought it was the Fort Bill beds behind the loco?

Yup (this message is posted from one of them!)

 

[bb21]

There does not appear to be a revised schedule in RTT for 1M16 so at this stage it looks as though they will run it 105 mins late on the existing schedule. Will be interesting to see how much of this gets made up en route.

You cannot have a planned revision on the day. If a revised schedule is put in the system, the original service would go down as a full cancellation.

 

[Highlandspring]

Well you can OV a schedule as long as it hasn't been called. You're not supposed to though.

 

[Scotrail84]

On nbound highlander. Aberdeen seated coach out of action yet again...passengers being transferred to berths.

Nah, you're totally wrong mate.

 

[Merseysider]

That happened to me the other night going up to Inverness; turned up with a seated ticket and was directed to a berth. What tends to be the issue with the seated carriage?

 

[ScottDarg]

1M16 left Inverness at 22:01, about 30 minutes earlier than previously stated.

Started off 76L but is now down to 61L at Perth.

 

[Scotrail84]

Looks like a whole load of back-packers getting on to the seated coach behind the loco at Crewe (which I think is the Aberdeen one) - are they going to manage to fit them all in too, or time to get their warm sleeping bags out?!

Nope, ft William given an extra sleeper coach tonight as a precaution due to issues with the seated vehicle to/from Edinburgh. Not the Aberdeen seated vehicle

 

[TimboM]

I thought it was the Fort Bill beds behind the loco?

Yup (this message is posted from one of them!)

Thanks for clarifying

 

[TimboM]

Nope, ft William given an extra sleeper coach tonight as a precaution due to issues with the seated vehicle to/from Edinburgh. Not the Aberdeen seated vehicle

Ah OK - so they may have been putting Fort Bill seated passengers in to the extra Sleeper coach (at Crewe) rather than having them sit in the Aberdeen seats then wake them up at Edinburgh to move to a coach which may not be working anyway?

 

[TimboM]

1M16 left Inverness at 22:01, about 30 minutes earlier than previously stated.

Started off 76L but is now down to 61L at Perth.

Looks like it may have missed out a couple of the (request?) stops to help gain time. Looking at the pathing allowances in the timings between Perth and Edinburgh could well be nearer 40L by then.

 

[Scotrail84]

Ah OK - so they may have been putting Fort Bill seated passengers in to the extra Sleeper coach rather than having them sit in the Aberdeen seats then wake them up at Edinburgh to move to a coach which may not be working anyway?

That would be my educated guess.

 

[Scotrail84]

That happened to me the other night going up to Inverness; turned up with a seated ticket and was directed to a berth. What tends to be the issue with the seated carriage?

Usually MA (Motor Alternator) failures which leave the coach with no power or toilets not working or not heating etc.

 

[Merseysider]

Usually MA (Motor Alternator) failures which leave the coach with no power or toilets not working or not heating etc.

Makes sense, thanks

 

[BRX]

Nah, you're totally wrong mate.

Oh well. That's what I'd understood from the lounge car attendant.

I was surprised there would be many berths free but your explanation clarifies.

 

[bb21]

Well you can OV a schedule as long as it hasn't been called. You're not supposed to though.

"Fire or evacuation due to fire alarm of Network Rail buildings other than stations not due to vandalism"?

I'm looking at an old definition possibly as I don't have the latest book in front of me. In any case still a cancellation. My point is that it can't go to a P-code (or not supposed to at least) for changes made on the day. A cancellation may well be more expensive than starting with a 105-minute delay but with plenty of opportunity to recover much of the delay.

 

[TimboM]

"Fire or evacuation due to fire alarm of Network Rail buildings other than stations not due to vandalism"?

I'm looking at an old definition possibly as I don't have the latest book in front of me. In any case still a cancellation. My point is that it can't go to a P-code (or not supposed to at least) for changes made on the day. A cancellation may well be more expensive than starting with a 105-minute delay but with plenty of opportunity to recover much of the delay.

I'm pretty sure Serco/CS will be pinning the delay on Network Rail as it's a direct consequence of the OHLE damage last night. So from that point of view it would end up being an NR cost and so I'm guessing the respective costs of the two options wouldn't really influence the decision?

I suspect the fact that it ended up leaving 76L (rather than the advertised 105L) and has already made up some time with likely more time to be made up is the reason it wasn't really worth sorting out a whole new path for it - i.e. expected to be some variability as to when it would actually run anyway. It is the Sleeper after all - it's not exactly the tightest timed path on the timetable

 

[Mag_seven]

Well after all that 1M16 is now just 7L at Nuneaton (effectively on time). Well done to everyone at Serco/GBRf for getting it back on time. It will be nice to see the last sleepers of 2017 run at or close to right time. (all are at time of posting).

 

[Highlandspring]

"Fire or evacuation due to fire alarm of Network Rail buildings other than stations not due to vandalism"?

I'm looking at an old definition possibly as I don't have the latest book in front of me. In any case still a cancellation. My point is that it can't go to a P-code (or not supposed to at least) for changes made on the day. A cancellation may well be more expensive than starting with a 105-minute delay but with plenty of opportunity to recover much of the delay.

OV as in the procedure to vary a schedule in TRUST rather than the delay code. You're right in that a P code shouldn't be used to cancel off a schedule after 02:00 on the day though there's nothing to actually stop you doing it. Similarly you shouldn't reinstate a P coded cancellation, it should be OA'd (another TRUST procedure). Personally I would reject a VSTP request for a later departure caused by previous late running; the train should be run late on its original schedule and the delay attributed to the incident that caused the inward working to run late.

 

[BRX]

73971 brought us into fort william on time.

As we were getting off, the train cleaning guys were not happy, telling the CS staff that no one had told them the train was 4hrs late yesterday and no one able to tell them what was happening.

I have to say, I had a similar experience at fort william the other year, when the train had been bustituted. There was no one from CS at the station until shortly before departure and the ticket office basically said nothing to do with us, and unable to give any info.

 

[cf111]

73971 brought us into fort william on time.

As we were getting off, the train cleaning guys were not happy, telling the CS staff that no one had told them the train was 4hrs late yesterday and no one able to tell them what was happening.

I have to say, I had a similar experience at fort william the other year, when the train had been bustituted. There was no one from CS at the station until shortly before departure and the ticket office basically said nothing to do with us, and unable to give any info.

This is poor and I did think it would be an issue when the franchise was split, at least someone in a ScotRail uniform would have been able to help before. In Inverness it's not so bad because the CS HQ is across the road from the railway station but at other stations I've no idea what the staffing is like when there is no train in the platform.

I have seen the Sleeper "information totem" at Dalmuir, so I'm assuming this will give some visual information on delays etc but I doubt this will be much help unless it has a button that can contact the CS control room (or whatever it's called) in case of disruption if you're sitting at an unstaffed station.

 

[TimboM]

As we were getting off, the train cleaning guys were not happy, telling the CS staff that no one had told them the train was 4hrs late yesterday and no one able to tell them what was happening.

The cleaners need to join this forum then they'd get a blow-by-blow account of every delay, the reasons why, ETAs and the colour of the guards' socks

 

[Bennybob]

Evening all, would anyone happen to know which loco will work 1S25 tonight please.

Thanks in advance.