Caledonian Sleeper discussion

[ScottDarg]

1H19 (last EDB-INV) has taken an hour to travel Newtonmore to Kincraig-attributed now to "a broken down train".

There's an engineers in front of that service that dropped a similar amount of time in the same area: http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/O41665/2017/11/06/advanced

 

[Far north 37]

There's an engineers in front of that service that dropped a similar amount of time in the same area: http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/O41665/2017/11/06/advanced

i seen that was held up must be a track machine i would imagine

 

[TimboM]

Based on the state of play currently, a prediction for Friday night's Euston - Glasgow/Edinburgh service

92033 to Carstairs with 92014 to Edinburgh, because my luck with getting required 92s is terrible!

92014 has apparently dropped on to the Highlander tonight with 92028 taking over Carstairs portion, however, 92028 is due a B Exam in a couple of days, so will likely head South tomorrow night, meaning one of 90042 or 92033 heading North tonight may take over Carstairs... if it's 90042, it needs to go back South towards the end of the week (possibly) for exam.

Add into the mix 92010 could appear from Craigentinny (possibly) before the week's out and/or 90047 currently "spare" at Willesden may get in on the act at some point when 92028 is stopped for its exam (especially if 92010 isn't ready by then...)

And still time for half the fleet to get wh**lf**ts again...

So I think predictions for Friday night are a tad challenging!

 

[ScottDarg]

i seen that was held up must be a track machine i would imagine

I believe it is, SB Rail to be specific based of the 6T40 ID.

 

[Far north 37]

seems all services on the highland mainline were running well behind time before the sleeper was even due to leave tonight

 

[ScottDarg]

1M16 has finally been given an arrival report at Aviemore; 22:25 51L, no departure report for obvious reasons.

1B01 running 16L at Dumbarton Central.

1B16 running 37L at Dundee.

1S25 arrived at Crewe 6E.

1S26 running ok as is 1M11 and associated 1C11.

 

[Far north 37]

i wonder what happens when one of the class 67s limps into inverness cant imagine theres much up there fitter wise with experience of dealing with these locos did they manage to fire it up today and just decide to chance getting it south couldnt even see a path for a replacement loco at waverley tonight to even swap it over

 

[GW43125]

Given the now extreme delay (looking at well over 3 hours' worth), what are the chances do we reckon of 1M16 electric leg running with only fort bill and Aberdeen portions, turfing the Inverness punters onto the first day train when they eventually get to Edinburgh, and sending the stock empty to Euston?

 

[Qwerty133]

Given the now extreme delay (looking at well over 3 hours' worth), what are the chances do we reckon of 1M16 electric leg running with only fort bill and Aberdeen portions, turfing the Inverness punters onto the first day train when they eventually get to Edinburgh, and sending the stock empty to Euston?

That is how I read the statement on the website in the first place (with them attempting to source road transport to Edinburgh for passengers south of Aviemore awaiting the Inverness portion).

 

[GW43125]

That is how I read the statement on the website in the first place (with them attempting to source road transport to Edinburgh for passengers south of Aviemore awaiting the Inverness portion).

I just read it as "hopefully we can get you on a bus and in Edinburgh before 1:30"

 

[TimboM]

i wonder what happens when one of the class 67s limps into inverness cant imagine theres much up there fitter wise with experience of dealing with these locos did they manage to fire it up today and just decide to chance getting it south couldnt even see a path for a replacement loco at waverley tonight to even swap it over

There's a TMD at Inverness and they've had 67s on the Sleeper for a long while, not to mention the one that's there at the moment for RHTT, so I imagine they'd have a bit of knowledge.
Probably irrelevant now with the other delays, however 66731 was due to attach to the front at Perth and give the 67 a leg-up for the remaining stretch into Edinburgh.

 

[TimboM]

Given the now extreme delay (looking at well over 3 hours' worth), what are the chances do we reckon of 1M16 electric leg running with only fort bill and Aberdeen portions, turfing the Inverness punters onto the first day train when they eventually get to Edinburgh, and sending the stock empty to Euston?

The 'sending the stock empty to Euston' is far easier said than done...!

Would need a loco sourced (bearing in mind there isn't a 'spare' one in Scotland currently with 92010 and 86401 crocked at Craigentinny and 47749 in Doncaster); and find drivers (at least two - not easy to find at very short notice in the middle of RHTT season...); and paths; and get the stock to Euston in time for it to be prepped and turned round for tomorrow night's service. Not impossible, but a very big ask/headache. Realistically, if the Inverness portion doesn't make it down with the 1M16 electric loco, it probably isn't getting down to London and the northbound service tomorrow will also be disrupted for certain passengers.

 

[Far north 37]

i wonder what happens when one of the class 67s limps into inverness cant imagine theres much up there fitter wise experience with dealing with these locos did they manage to fire it up today and just decide to chance getting it south couldnt even see a path for a replacement loco at waverley tonight to even swap it over

There's a TMD at Inverness and they've had 67s on the Sleeper for a long while, not to mention the one that's there at the moment for RHTT, so I imagine they'd have a bit of knowledge.
Probably irrelevant now with the other delays, however 66731 was due to attach to the front at Perth and give the 67 a leg-up for the remaining stretch into Edinburgh.

yes but the sleeper locos were never maintained there locos havent been maintained at inverness since 1994 they were only ever fueled there.
been a very long time since inverness tmd looked after any locos the rhtt locos are stabled in network rails sidings in millburn yard not the tmd

 

[BRX]

Earlier this evening I waved off some friends to get on the northbound lowlander at Euston...meanwhile a family member is on the southbound from Inverness, and it sounds like she might not be about to have such a good night...oh dear.

 

[marks87]

The 'sending the stock empty to Euston' is far easier said than done...!

Would need a loco sourced (bearing in mind there isn't a 'spare' one in Scotland currently with 92010 and 86401 crocked at Craigentinny and 47749 in Doncaster); and find drivers (at least two - not easy to find at very short notice in the middle of RHTT season...); and paths; and get the stock to Euston in time for it to be prepped and turned round for tomorrow night's service. Not impossible, but a very big ask/headache. Realistically, if the Inverness portion doesn't make it down with the 1M16 electric loco, it probably isn't getting down to London and the northbound service tomorrow will also be disrupted for certain passengers.

Doesn’t the stock rotate, meaning that a short-formed up Highlander tonight is a short-formed down Lowlander tomorrow (assuming no other shunting at Wembley)?

Or has that been relaxed now that there’s no requirement for each half-set to visit Inverness at least once a week?

 

[Far north 37]

Doesn’t the stock rotate, meaning that a short-formed up Highlander tonight is a short-formed down Lowlander tomorrow (assuming no other shunting at Wembley)?

Or has that been relaxed now that there’s no requirement for each half-set to visit Inverness at least once a week?

the stock from the inverness service will make its way to london before tommorow nights service i would imagine if possible

 

[TimboM]

Doesn’t the stock rotate, meaning that a short-formed up Highlander tonight is a short-formed down Lowlander tomorrow (assuming no other shunting at Wembley)?

Or has that been relaxed now that there’s no requirement for each half-set to visit Inverness at least once a week?

You're right, so it would be the Lowlander impacted - a whole 8 coach set missing would be a significantly short-formed train!

 

[TimboM]

the stock from the inverness service will make its way to london before tommorow nights service i would imagine if possible

Yes - I believe as part of a very late 1M16. Running it separately ECS really isn't feasible as per my above post.

 

[Mag_seven]

Well 1M16 is just a mere 235 down leaving Carlisle! Will be a challenge to get to Euston before midday, given that it will probably have to run slow line where available. Plenty of opportunity for daytime photos though!

 

[GW43125]

Both SB sleepers have failed PPM tonight. 1M11 came in aboit 15 late, 1M16 as we know is worse. Last time I checked it was 230L at Madeley Jn, some two hours after it should have been in London.

NB Aberdeen failed PPM too, but an hour's worth of radio silence on the NB fort bill. So far the only one that's made PPM is the NB Inverness...

 

[berneyarms]

One of those rare occasions today when both Highlanders have been in Edinburgh simultaneously?

 

[Caleb2010]

There may not be a requirement for an eight coach set to visit Inverness for exam etc but, they still have to rotate for the planned maintenance at Polmadie Depot.

 

[gordonjahn]

One of those rare occasions today when both Highlanders have been in Edinburgh simultaneously?

Looks like it:

1S25: Edinburgh [EDB] arr 0359¼ dep 0448¾
1M16: Edinburgh [EDB] arr 0416½ dep 0445¼

 

[TimboM]

Well 1M16 is just a mere 235 down leaving Carlisle! Will be a challenge to get to Euston before midday, given that it will probably have to run slow line where available. Plenty of opportunity for daytime photos though!

Here it is having gained a massive 5 minutes and 'only' 230 Late at Acton Bridge:

 

[TimboM]

Looks like it:

1S25: Edinburgh [EDB] arr 0359¼ dep 0448¾
1M16: Edinburgh [EDB] arr 0416½ dep 0445¼

The northbound 1S25 A/C loco (90042) was used for the southbound 1M16 as well, so had to be both in Edinburgh at the same time...

Can anyone recall that happening before? - over 800 miles in one night for the trusty Skoda.

 

[ScottDarg]

ETA at Euston is now 11:49, currently running 243L at Hillmorton Jn.

I'm surprised they held the Aberdeen and Fort Bill portions for 3 hours, even changing the Inverness passengers to the 0540 VTEC service would've got them to London 2 hours earlier than their current ETA.

 

[TimboM]

ETA at Euston is now 11:49, currently running 243L at Hillmorton Jn.

I'm surprised they held the Aberdeen and Fort Bill portions for 3 hours, even changing the Inverness passengers to the 0540 VTEC service would've got them to London 2 hours earlier than their current ETA.

The main issue/reason would be the stock - if they sent the other two portions away, there'd be pretty much no realistic way of getting the Inverness portion stock to London for tonight's (Lowlander) service back North tonight. They could probably cope with not sending the three Fort William coaches, say, and short forming the Lowlander on a Tues night in November (depending on Loadings) - but not really possible to run a Glasgow/Edinburgh service with one of the two 8-coach portions missing.

 

[berneyarms]

Looks like it:

1S25: Edinburgh [EDB] arr 0359¼ dep 0448¾
1M16: Edinburgh [EDB] arr 0416½ dep 0445¼

Yes that’s what I’d looked at too!

 

[Kite159]

Looks like it has just past Wembley, so depending on platform availability at Euston might be able to arrive before midday!

 

[Tim R-T-C]

The main issue/reason would be the stock - if they sent the other two portions away, there'd be pretty much no realistic way of getting the Inverness portion stock to London for tonight's (Lowlander) service back North tonight. They could probably cope with not sending the three Fort William coaches, say, and short forming the Lowlander on a Tues night in November (depending on Loadings) - but not really possible to run a Glasgow/Edinburgh service with one of the two 8-coach portions missing.

Do we know if passengers from the other two legs were allowed to change to the VTEC service at Edinburgh?

What is the standard procedure for the CS, do they knock on the cabins and tell people, or leave them to wake up at Carlisle when they are expecting to be at Rugby?