Caledonian Sleeper Class 92's

[GW43125]

I was rolling one or two up in my mind into one, but as JonathanH has kindly referenced, there were a few pretty bad failures involving 028 in April 2015 before it finally got banished to Loughborough.

The one on 15 April ended up with passengers getting turfed off at Milton Keynes and 92032 rescuing to take the ECS (and 028) on to Wembley. There's a few photos/videos around if you have a 'google'; for example this one on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dDcMfdnN1wU

Then a week later - on its first passenger-hauling run after the above event - there was another spectacular failure and rescue via a Freightliner 66, with the train finally terminated at Crewe c.7 hours late - this Flickr post by 'The Railway Journal' gives a decent account of the main events of that night.

https://flic.kr/p/rXxBNZ

92028 went to Brush (possibly after time for one more failure) fairly soon after that... and is still there! Must be coming up to its second anniversary pretty soon.

That's not gone well.

 

[BRX]

032 just spotted in south London, heading wembley direction DIT behind a 66.

 

[leomartin125]

032 just spotted in south London, heading wembley direction DIT behind a 66.

It went to Tonbridge West Yard yesterday from Dollands Moor behind a 66, could be a positioning move for a trip to Brush perhaps? Especially with it recently on the China Clay tanks, believe it hasn't had it easy, so about time to get it modified!

However it doesn't appear to have left Tonbridge yet...

 

[TimboM]

032 just spotted in south London, heading wembley direction DIT behind a 66.

It went to Tonbridge West Yard yesterday from Dollands Moor behind a 66, could be a positioning move for a trip to Brush perhaps? Especially with it recently on the China Clay tanks, believe it hasn't had it easy, so about time to get it modified!

However it doesn't appear to have left Tonbridge yet...

92032 was taken to Tonbridge Yard late yesterday pm by 66772 - arrived just before midnight. I thought possible positioning move for Loughborough too at first, although Tonbridge is one of the main places they send 66s from to collect "imports" from Dollands Moor (66772 had been delivering 700s) so could've just been a handy staging post to catch a lift to and save a driver/path...

As BRX reported at 16:47 today it was "just spotted" en route to Wembley, I strongly suspect this was the VSTP working 0Z66 16:00 Tonbridge West Yard GBRf to Willesden TMD (arrived Willesden 17:38).

So seems it was just a round-about route to get it back to Willesden - but possibly for some attention as you say as has had a couple of costly failures recently.

You'd think they'd want/need 92043 and/or 92028 out of Loughborough before they sent another one in. They need two to bring the China Clay tanks through the tunnel most weeks (plus 700 deliveries at the moment too), so would be one short if 032 went in as well (and assuming they didn't take one off the Sleepers/Dagenham cars).


EDIT: 92032 now showing as being at Willesden TMD this evening (Thurs night).

 

[leomartin125]

92032 was taken to Tonbridge Yard late yesterday pm by 66772 - arrived just before midnight. I thought possible positioning move for Loughborough too at first, although Tonbridge is one of the main places they send 66s from to collect "imports" from Dollands Moor (66772 had been delivering 700s) so could've just been a handy staging post to catch a lift to and save a driver/path...

As BRX reported at 16:47 today it was "just spotted" en route to Wembley, I strongly suspect this was the VSTP working 0Z66 16:00 Tonbridge West Yard GBRf to Willesden TMD (arrived Willesden 17:38).

So seems it was just a round-about route to get it back to Willesden - but possibly for some attention as you say as has had a couple of costly failures recently.

You'd think they'd want/need 92043 and/or 92028 out of Loughborough before they sent another one in. They need two to bring the China Clay tanks through the tunnel most weeks (plus 700 deliveries at the moment too), so would be one short if 032 went in as well (and assuming they didn't take one off the Sleepers/Dagenham cars).


EDIT: 92032 now showing as being at Willesden TMD this evening (Thurs night).

I see, thank you. After recent events, I would hope that 92032 would be due to go to Loughborough Brush next, or as soon as 92043 reappears. Regarding 92028, it's been there for years without any signs of movement, unless it actually leaves, I'm just going to stick with 'its going to be there for a while still'. GBRf have plenty of sheds to cover the lack of 92's, so if they wanted to take multiple locomotives out of action I wouldn't be surprised.

 

[43096]

I see, thank you. After recent events, I would hope that 92032 would be due to go to Loughborough Brush next, or as soon as 92043 reappears. Regarding 92028, it's been there for years without any signs of movement, unless it actually leaves, I'm just going to stick with 'its going to be there for a while still'. GBRf have plenty of sheds to cover the lack of 92's, so if they wanted to take multiple locomotives out of action I wouldn't be surprised.

They can't take many locos out. They need five electrics for the sleepers (on top of ECS locos) and two for 6S94 through the tunnel. That's seven locos from a nominal fleet of ten, of which two (92028/043) are already in works. No scope to stop any more really.

 

[TimboM]

They can't take many locos out. They need five electrics for the sleepers (on top of ECS locos) and two for 6S94 through the tunnel. That's seven locos from a nominal fleet of ten, of which two (92028/043) are already in works. No scope to stop any more really.

Agreed, although it's really six needed on the sleeper as there's the five operating each night and then a 'spare' as at any given time there'll be a loco needing to be stopped for a routine exam, minor repair, wheel-turning etc.

The sleeper 'fleet' is currently augmented by the two on-hire F/L 90s, but I expect GBRf would want to see the back of them (and their cost) before filling Brush up with even more 92s - bearing in mind there's also a lot of 73/9s going through Loughborough at the moment too, so GBRf are certainly keeping them busy (and also no doubt liaising as to what the priorities are). Assuming 92032 is serviceable and doesn't have a major issue, it's better off out and about working than sitting in a fairly long queue at Brush.

Realistically the Dagenham-Garston Ford car train is the only one currently worked by a 92 regularly that could switch to a 66, but I suspect there's reason(s) why a 92 is preferred (e.g. fuel costs).

I do agree with Leo that 92032 would seem the candidate for going in next (once one or both of 043/028 are out) given its recent problems. The other two "unmodified" operational 92s (92038 and 92044) - ironically perhaps - appear to be two of the most reliable in the fleet, so I think "if it ain't broke, don't fix it" would apply to these two (for now at least).

 

[43096]

Agreed, although it's really six needed on the sleeper as there's the five operating each night and then a 'spare' as at any given time there'll be a loco needing to be stopped for a routine exam, minor repair, wheel-turning etc.

The sleeper 'fleet' is currently augmented by the two on-hire F/L 90s, but I expect GBRf would want to see the back of them (and their cost) before filling Brush up with even more 92s - bearing in mind there's also a lot of 73/9s going through Loughborough at the moment too, so GBRf are certainly keeping them busy (and also no doubt liaising as to what the priorities are). Assuming 92032 is serviceable and doesn't have a major issue, it's better off out and about working than sitting in a fairly long queue at Brush.

Realistically the Dagenham-Garston Ford car train is the only one currently worked by a 92 regularly that could switch to a 66, but I suspect there's reason(s) why a 92 is preferred (e.g. fuel costs).

I do agree with Leo that 92032 would seem the candidate for going in next (once one or both of 043/028 are out) given its recent problems. The other two "unmodified" operational 92s (92038 and 92044) - ironically perhaps - appear to be two of the most reliable in the fleet, so I think "if it ain't broke, don't fix it" would apply to these two (for now at least).

I suspect that GBRf prefer a 92 on the car train to free up a 66. They keep winning more work, so need more traction. No more 66s can be built so using 92s wherever possible is another option. The Felixstowe - Trafford Park intermodal is another possibility: it was a 92 for a while but went back to 66.

 

[Sarahs_Railway]

92 033 in CS livery on the buffers opposite Platform 7 yesterday evening, Photos of same loco in same location approx 3 weeks ago at link below.

https://www.flickr.com/photos/149563882@N07/

 

[TimboM]

Looks like some Class 92 / Loughborough action tomorrow...

92023 was moved to Crewe Holding Sidings on Tue night after spending best part of a month stopped at Willesden and an STP (0Z52) has gone in now for a diesel-hauled light engine move from there to Loughborough Brush tomorrow [Fri 19th] (d.07:39 / a.10:26). Seems very much like 92023 is going back in for more attention/mods. (Has already had one extra visit back to Brush after its main mods.)

There is then a return light engine working (0Z51) leaving Brush at 12.10 arriving Crewe Basford Hall at 15:23 - however via a drop off at the Crewe Holding Sidings (spot where GBRf stable 92s when having short spells at Crewe).

Now assuming they're not planning to fix 023 in the space of a couple of hours, could the 66 (or whatever is giving 023 a lift) be bringing back 92043 and/or 92028??

Anyone got any info on this?

 

[leomartin125]

Looks like some Class 92 / Loughborough action tomorrow...

92023 was moved to Crewe Holding Sidings on Tue night after spending best part of a month stopped at Willesden and an STP (0Z52) has gone in now for a diesel-hauled light engine move from there to Loughborough Brush tomorrow [Fri 19th] (d.07:39 / a.10:26). Seems very much like 92023 is going back in for more attention/mods. (Has already had one extra visit back to Brush after its main mods.)

There is then a return light engine working (0Z51) leaving Brush at 12.10 arriving Crewe Basford Hall at 15:23 - however via a drop off at the Crewe Holding Sidings (spot where GBRf stable 92s when having short spells at Crewe).

Now assuming they're not planning to fix 023 in the space of a couple of hours, could the 66 (or whatever is giving 023 a lift) be bringing back 92043 and/or 92028??

Anyone got any info on this?

I bet bottom dollar 0Z51 is operated by 92043. I highly doubt they will let 92028 go, no matter what state it's in. But lets wait and see.

 

[TimboM]

I bet bottom dollar 0Z51 is operated by 92043. I highly doubt they will let 92028 go, no matter what state it's in. But lets wait and see.

The path's not been activated yet (4 hours post scheduled departure)... [EDIT/UPDATE: the STP path (0Z50) for the assisting diesel loco to come up from Bescot has been Activated, but doesn't appear to be any movement of it yet (5 hours post scheduled departure... 0Z51 (return working to Crewe) now Activated, but not 0Z52 yet)]

If indeed it does run and something comes back it'll need a tow to Crewe in any respect (assuming it's electric!)

 

[TimboM]

I bet bottom dollar 0Z51 is operated by 92043. I highly doubt they will let 92028 go, no matter what state it's in. But lets wait and see.

I agree my money would be on 043 (if there is indeed a 92 coming the other way and if it's just one).

However, assuming nothing's changed to the plan that 028 is one of GBRf's 10 operational 92s, it's got to come out at some point - presumably will need some decent amount of mainline testing which it can't get at/from Loughborough.

 

[43096]

I bet bottom dollar 0Z51 is operated by 92043. I highly doubt they will let 92028 go, no matter what state it's in. But lets wait and see.

I bet 0Z51 will not be "operated" by 92043 - it won't get very far.

As for 92028 it depends if it is ready or not. If it is ready then it will come out.

 

[TimboM]

The moves to (possibly) take 92023 to Loughborough don't appear to have run (yet), however...

0Z51 Loughborough to Crewe is on the move c.90 mins late. Not seen any info on what it is yet.

http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/R00480/2017/05/19/advanced


UPDATE: Seen info it's 66717 on 0Z51, but no indication it's hauling anything...

 

[TimboM]

Well, that was all a bit of a damp squib. As far as I'm aware, 92023, 028 and 043 are all where they were (Crewe/Loughborough/Loughborough respectively) and the only thing it seemed happened in the end was a 66 (66717) light engine move from Brush to Crewe.

EDIT: Not a damp squib at all!! See below...

 

[Mag_seven]

Well, that was all a bit of a damp squib. As far as I'm aware, 92023, 028 and 043 are all where they were (Crewe/Loughborough/Loughborough respectively) and the only thing it seemed happened in the end was a 66 (66717) light engine move from Brush to Crewe.

Just viewed 92028 tucked in behind 66717 in the sidings just south of Crewe station. 92014 has also just been viewed on the southbound Garston - Dagenham car train.

 

[BRX]

What's been going on with the China Clay train recently? I don't think I've seen it run to Dollands in its allotted path (ie. leaving Wembley just after 7pm) for the past 2-3 weeks.

 

[leomartin125]

Well, that was all a bit of a damp squib. As far as I'm aware, 92023, 028 and 043 are all where they were (Crewe/Loughborough/Loughborough respectively) and the only thing it seemed happened in the end was a 66 (66717) light engine move from Brush to Crewe.

It turns out, I'm wrong, and so are you! FINALLLYYYYYY!!!

https://flic.kr/p/TEZATm

 

[TimboM]

It turns out, I'm wrong, and so are you! FINALLLYYYYYY!!!

https://flic.kr/p/TEZATm

So very pleased to be wrong!!

Not entirely sure why whoever recorded they'd seen 66717 on 0Z51 didn't also note the rather obvious bright orange and blue 92 strapped to the back!! It's not like you cannot see it's number either...

Might just need to nip down to Crewe tomorrow


Next question... what livery is 92043 in...??

 

[TimboM]

Just viewed 92028 tucked in behind 66717 in the sidings just south of Crewe station. 92014 has also just been viewed on the southbound Garston - Dagenham car train.

Damp squib no more!!

92014 and 92018 swapped over last night/early this morning - I think when the car train stopped off at Willesden/Wembley. 92018 is now at Willesden presumably for a stint on Sleeper duties.

 

[TimboM]

What's been going on with the China Clay train recently? I don't think I've seen it run to Dollands in its allotted path (ie. leaving Wembley just after 7pm) for the past 2-3 weeks.

I may be wrong, but I don't think it's even run last couple of weeks. Last one seems to be 19 April (which was heavily delayed - I believe due to 032 failing in/near the tunnel).

Assuming it hasn't run since, not sure if it's because there's no requirement (e.g. factory shutdown or whatever) or it's because due to 92032 misbehaving that without it and 92044 they can't bring it through the tunnel as needs 2x 92s for that. My hunch would be the former - I'm sure they'd work out some way of getting it through if there was a service to run.

 

[TimboM]

Vaguely related to the china clay question... I believe quite a lot of the "modifications" to the 92s have been removing/isolating over-zealous electronics/systems designed for tunnel running to make them more reliable on the Sleeper.

Does anyone know if that means some/all of the "sleeper" 92s cannot work the tunnel anymore, or are they still able to?

Do the operational pools have any relevance (or not)? 92014/28/33 are "GBSL" - GBRf 92 Sleeper, whereas the rest of the non-stored ones (92010/18/23/32/38/43/44) are "GBST" - GBRf Sleeper/Channel Tunnel, suggesting they should at least be able to work the tunnel.

 

[BRX]

I may be wrong, but I don't think it's even run last couple of weeks. Last one seems to be 19 April (which was heavily delayed - I believe due to 032 failing in/near the tunnel).

Assuming it hasn't run since, not sure if it's because there's no requirement (e.g. factory shutdown or whatever) or it's because due to 92032 misbehaving that without it and 92044 they can't bring it through the tunnel as needs 2x 92s for that. My hunch would be the former - I'm sure they'd work out some way of getting it through if there was a service to run.

Fri 21st April was the last southbound one I definitely remember seeing run, I think. I too wondered if there was a factory shutdown or similar.

 

[TimboM]

Fri 21st April was the last southbound one I definitely remember seeing run, I think. I too wondered if there was a factory shutdown or similar.

There's no photos of it on Flickr after that working (and it's usually well photographed). 92044 doesn't appear to have moved North of Dollands Moor since then either and 92032 was taken to Willesden shortly after where it's been since (with a few forays on Sleeper ECS duties and one "test" run to Northampton). I'm 95% sure the china clays haven't run since then.

 

[Far north 37]

90047 worked the lowland sleeper into euston this morning 92033 arrived with the highland sleeper

 

[TimboM]

90047 worked the lowland sleeper into Euston this morning 92033 arrived with the highland sleeper

Did you see what took the Lowlander ECS back to Wembley? I think it would've been 87002. (90047 was detached and then ran round to take the Highlander ECS + 92033.)

I believe 92010 was on the Northbound Highlander and 92038 was on the Northbound Lowlander.

 

[TimboM]

Only 7 seconds from a passing LM 350/1 and hiding in the bushes, but here's 92028... https://youtu.be/p3lwOvy6mSM

...92023 was no longer there (was where 028 is on Wed/Thu), so maybe it did go to Loughborough yesterday after all?

 

[Far north 37]

Did you see what took the Lowlander ECS back to Wembley? I think it would've been 87002. (90047 was detached and then ran round to take the Highlander ECS + 92033.)

I believe 92010 was on the Northbound Highlander and 92038 was on the Northbound Lowlander.

yeah it was 87002 on the lowlander ecs seen it as i was coming in

 

[TimboM]

yeah it was 87002 on the lowlander ecs seen it as i was coming in

Thanks