Calder Valley Line Electrification proposal

[ZakCreaser2003]

CALDER VALLEY ELECTRIFICATION

The Calder Valley Line is a rail line in the North of England that connects the cities of Leeds and Manchester as well as towns such as Blackpool, Preston and Burnley. At present time it is the slower of the two rail routes that connects Leeds and Manchester. The other being the Huddersfield Line. Currently two operators use this line, Northern provides express and stopper services that cover the entirety of the route and Grand Central operate from Bradford/Halifax to London King's Cross via Wakefield Kirkgate.


PRESENT TIME

As of October 2024, the only sections of the line that have seen electrification upgrades is the line between Blackpool North and Preston which was completed in 2018. As of present times 1 service per hour operated by a 3 car Northern Class 195 works between Blackpool North and York via Preston and Leeds. Meanwhile 3 services per hour between Manchester and Leeds on the Calder Valley.


PROPOSAL

I firmly believe that the entire of the Calder Valley Line should be electrified. Currently electrification ends at Farrington Curve which is just outside of Preston. Like an overwhelming majority of routes operated by Northern, the hourly Blackpool to York service gets overcrowded. Especially on a weekend. A 3 car Class 195 is fitted with 204 seats. If the line was electrified and the service was operated by a 331 set, more seats could be introduced. Ultimately this will support the increase on demand on these services. By adding more seats to the market, the CPP will be reduced which will lead to a cheaper rail fare. The same goes for the Manchester to Leeds via Bradford services. By electrifying the Calder Valley Line, operators will be less dependant on the Huddersfield Line (Once TRU is complete)

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

On the line from Manchester Victoria, the station of Walsden is shown, but not the station of Smithy Bridge. Is Smithy Bridge under threat?

 

[507020]

I firmly believe that the entire of the Calder Valley Line should be electrified.

You are likely correct, but try getting that to happen.

The main issue for the next few years is it has to be kept open for TPE diversions for electrification of the other route. You can’t close both at the same time.

 

[ZakCreaser2003]

On the line from Manchester Victoria, the station of Walsden is shown, but not the station of Smithy Bridge. Is Smithy Bridge under threat?

Data from 2022/2023 shows Smithy Bridge had 350 scheduled services per week with a daily average passenger count of 384. I firmly believe the future of Smithy Bridge is in safe hands.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 1 Oct 2024 ==

You are likely correct, but try getting that to happen.

The main issue for the next few years is it has to be kept open for TPE diversions for electrification of the other route. You can’t close both at the same time.

100% agree. For the next few years at least the Calder Valley is critical to support TPE diversion operations while the TRU is taking place. In the Intergrated Rail Plan 2018, the Government at the time wanted to electrify the full Calder Valley Line. However in 2021, that plan was changed to only electrifying the Leeds - Bradford corridor.

 

[fishwomp]

A 3 car Class 195 is fitted with 204 seats. If the line was electrified and the service was operated by a 331 set, more seats could be introduced. Ultimately this will support the increase on demand on these services. By adding more seats to the market, the CPP will be reduced which will lead to a cheaper rail fare. [..]

You can put DMUs together and that adds seats tomorrow, but electrification is 5+ years away if you started tomorrow - and someone would have to pay for it - so let's say that's a decade away

 

[ZakCreaser2003]

You can put DMUs together and that adds seats tomorrow, but electrification is 5+ years away if you started tomorrow - and someone would have to pay for it - so let's say that's a decade away

Firmly agree with you. It is not only the the track that will need upgrading. Vital infrastructure such as Platforms etc. Electrification is not an easy task or a cheap one.

 

[td97]

The line via New Pudsey between Bradford & Leeds is to be electrified as part of NPR, and Manchester to Rochdale is to be electrified as a standalone proposal.
Otherwise, the unfortunate reality is that the rest of the line will remain unelectrified in the long term, and hybrid trains (with diesel/battery capability) will be utilised for the unelectrified sections.

 

[Transilien]

CALDER VALLEY ELECTRIFICATION

The Calder Valley Line is a rail line in the North of England that connects the cities of Leeds and Manchester as well as towns such as Blackpool, Preston and Burnley. At present time it is the slower of the two rail routes that connects Leeds and Manchester. The other being the Huddersfield Line. Currently two operators use this line, Northern provides express and stopper services that cover the entirety of the route and Grand Central operate from Bradford/Halifax to London King's Cross via Wakefield Kirkgate.


PRESENT TIME

As of October 2024, the only sections of the line that have seen electrification upgrades is the line between Blackpool North and Preston which was completed in 2018. As of present times 1 service per hour operated by a 3 car Northern Class 195 works between Blackpool North and York via Preston and Leeds. Meanwhile 3 services per hour between Manchester and Leeds on the Calder Valley.


PROPOSAL

I firmly believe that the entire of the Calder Valley Line should be electrified. Currently electrification ends at Farrington Curve which is just outside of Preston. Like an overwhelming majority of routes operated by Northern, the hourly Blackpool to York service gets overcrowded. Especially on a weekend. A 3 car Class 195 is fitted with 204 seats. If the line was electrified and the service was operated by a 331 set, more seats could be introduced. Ultimately this will support the increase on demand on these services. By adding more seats to the market, the CPP will be reduced which will lead to a cheaper rail fare. The same goes for the Manchester to Leeds via Bradford services. By electrifying the Calder Valley Line, operators will be less dependant on the Huddersfield Line (Once TRU is complete)

Under these proposals would you electrify the Colne branch too?

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

Firmly agree with you. It is not only the the track that will need upgrading. Vital infrastructure such as Platforms etc. Electrification is not an easy task or a cheap one.

Would I be correct in thinking that there were extension works carried out of the platforms at Hebden Bridge?

 

[fishwomp]

Under these proposals would you electrify the Colne branch too?

Careful now, that's perilously close to mentioning S*****n - and clearly you'd need to fill that gap to provide a diversionary electrified line.

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

Careful now, that's perilously close to mentioning S*****n - and clearly you'd need to fill that gap to provide a diversionary electrified line.

Just consider how much of the rail distance from the Preston area to Colne is now parallelled by the M65 motorway.

 

[zwk500]

more seats could be introduced. Ultimately this will support the increase on demand on these services. By adding more seats to the market, the CPP will be reduced which will lead to a cheaper rail fare.

More seats could be added quicker and for less cost by extending existing train lengths, rather than investing in an infrastructure enhancement which regularly tops £3m/stkm. Why electrify if the goal is simply more seats?

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

More seats could be added quicker and for less cost by extending existing train lengths, rather than investing in an infrastructure enhancement which regularly tops £3m/stkm. Why electrify if the goal is simply more seats?

Does the matter of cleaner air in the area of the railway line help with that criteria?

 

[fishwomp]

Does the matter of cleaner air in the area of the railway line help with that criteria?

No, there's plenty of fresh air at the stations. There will be orders of magnitude more pollution from the neighbouring cattle, humans, houses, vans, lorries, non-electric cars. The latter may disappear in 10+ years but the rest won't.

 

[zwk500]

Does the matter of cleaner air in the area of the railway line help with that criteria?

The OP made no mention of air quality in their proposal for electrification. They only talked about more seats and lower fares.

However, to answer your question - a railway will only make a difference to air quality where there is a high concentration of traffic (i.e., in Manchester and Leeds only - the already electrified bits). A modern 3-Car DMU at 1 or 2 tph will not be making a serious impact to air quality beyond the very immediate environs of the line.

FWIW I support electrifying out to Rochdale, and Leeds-Bradford-Huddersfield, on the basis of running a proper metro service for the Manchester and West Yorks commuter areas. Preston-Blackburn possibly sneaks in as well, but the rest I feel BEMUs/Bi-Modes would serve very well.

 

[YorksLad12]

Careful now, that's perilously close to mentioning S*****n - and clearly you'd need to fill that gap to provide a diversionary electrified line.

Fishwomp's Law

I refer my learned colleagues to this 'highlight' of one of my previous lives: Northern Sparks, the 2015 analysis of potential electrifications. How many classes of rolling stock on the cover have been or will shortly be retired...? https://www.transportforthenorth.com/reports/electrification-task/

 

[507020]

Careful now, that's perilously close to mentioning S*****n - and clearly you'd need to fill that gap to provide a diversionary electrified line.

It is the case that electrifying Farington Curve - Skipton via Colne to provide Preston - Leeds is a vastly shorter distance than even Farington Curve - Heaton Lodge, which would also necessitate doing Miles Platting - Todmorden, routes via Bradford Interchange and various curves.

Leaving Colne unelectrified isn’t actually an efficiency. It would also allow Skipton depot to be fed from the WCML as well as the ECML when either route is isolated.

 

[Halifaxlad]

Electrification of the Calder Valley if ever fully electrified will be done as an infill scheme!

Design work for Rochdale has been tendered for I believe.

Heaton Lodge to Leeds is being done as part of TRU.

Leeds - Bradford will no-doubt be done as part of Northern Powerhouse Rail, which will electrify the line as far as Wyke where this new line will be built.
Which will also see electrification extended Westwards towards Brighouse.

Once all that has been done, you will have a much better case for Brighouse - Rochdale.

As others have pointed out electrification of the Calder Valley wont be happening anytime soon and no-doubt will probably happen after other lines such as the Harrogate line.

 

[AndrewE]

It is the case that electrifying Farington Curve - Skipton via Colne to provide Preston - Leeds is a vastly shorter distance than even Farington Curve - Heaton Lodge, which would also necessitate doing Miles Platting - Todmorden, routes via Bradford Interchange and various curves.

Leaving Colne unelectrified isn’t actually an efficiency. It would also allow Skipton depot to be fed from the WCML as well as the ECML when either route is isolated.

Agreed, but I'm sure somebody will be along soon to tell us all that there is an "Economic Law" (even though to my mind these are mostly fabrications to justify the political stance or selfish wants of the proposer) which destroys the justification for any common-sense plan or obvious railway-operating benefit which might look attractive to anybody outside the Treasury or the road lobby.

We need an electrified network asap!

 

[Bald Rick]

Leaving Colne unelectrified isn’t actually an efficiency. It would also allow Skipton depot to be fed from the WCML as well as the ECML when either route is isolated.

err, what? The Aire valley is fed from, err, the Aire Valley (Bingley).

 

[AlastairFraser]

Just consider how much of the rail distance from the Preston area to Colne is now parallelled by the M65 motorway.

The difference is that the railway actually serves the centre of Blackburn, Accrington and Rishton (and is also close to the centre of the other towns in the M65 corridor that the M65 actually passes reasonably close to).

Local congestion, particularly around the central section between Blackburn and Burnley, is absolutely awful during peak times, and an electric stopper every 30 mins between Preston and Colne using something like a Class 323 to help with limited capacity on the closely spaced stops around Blackburn would really help with alleviating congestion and pollution in the area, as well as improving travel times and access to better paying jobs for a lot of areas of high deprivation.

This is why speed improvements, electrification and reinstatement of double track makes a lot of sense from Preston to Colne (with a short extension from Gannow Jcn to Burnley Manchester Road) and then you can extend from Bolton to Blackburn and Daisyfield Jcn to Clitheroe etc....

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

The difference is that the railway actually serves the centre of Blackburn, Accrington and Rishton (and is also close to the centre of the other towns in the M65 corridor that the M65 actually passes reasonably close to).

Local congestion, particularly around the central section between Blackburn and Burnley, is absolutely awful during peak times, and an electric stopper every 30 mins between Preston and Colne using something like a Class 323 to help with limited capacity on the closely spaced stops around Blackburn would really help with alleviating congestion and pollution in the area, as well as improving travel times and access to better paying jobs for a lot of areas of high deprivation.

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A computer problem beyond my ken occurred whist I was typing the response below which was NOT a response from @Alastair Fraser.

People normally do not live in the town centre locations of Blackburn, Accrington and Rishton but in satellite areas. Car use on the M65 motorway is an adjunct to car drivers driving direct from their home address to where they are travelling to and vice-versa. Strangely enough, this was a matter that cropped up during a meeting near to Blackburn Cathedral and this posting conveys the feelings of all involved in that discussion. Public transport follows set routes to travel which may be affected by local congestion, but a car driver facing this situation has the ability to take other routes to avoid it.

 

[AndrewE]

***

Actually I suspect that a lot of people do live "in the town centre locations of Blackburn, Accrington and Rishton" and a better train service will give them better mobility - and maybe even tempt others to move back in.
On top of that I would put money on improvements to intra- and inter-urban public transport being one of the key drivers underpinning gentrification.

 

[A S Leib]

I know they're a long way apart, but which out of the Calder Valley, Hope Valley and Tyne Valley lines is likely to be electrified first, if ever?

 

[AlastairFraser]

I know they're a long way apart, but which out of the Calder Valley, Hope Valley and Tyne Valley lines is likely to be electrified first, if ever?

Hope Valley. Greatest Intercity demand

People normally do not live in the town centre locations of Blackburn, Accrington and Rishton but in satellite areas. Car use on the M65 motorway is an adjunct to car drivers driving direct from their home address to where they are travelling to and vice-versa. Strangely enough, this was a matter that cropped up during a meeting near to Blackburn Cathedral and this posting conveys the feelings of all involved in that discussion. Public transport follows set routes to travel which may be affected by local congestion, but a car driver facing this situation has the ability to take other routes to avoid it.

Yes, it's true that there are a lot of journeys that are not just suburb to town centre journeys, but the whole point of electrifying the stopper is that enables easier suburb-suburb journeys that don't involve a car, especially in areas where the classic road network is at capacity or overcapacity (the M65 is rarely badly congested, but a lot of the less heavily upgraded A road network (like e.g. the A678 in Clayton le Moors) really struggle with the volumes and variety of road users on them, most of the same sections that struggle are in areas where it would be difficult to upgrade, because of lack of space, or because of geological difficulties.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 4 Oct 2024 ==

Does the matter of cleaner air in the area of the railway line help with that criteria?

(Tagging you here, because of the issue with responses - read the post above and reply to that.)