Cable Thefts, can anything be done?

[Bald Rick]

Yeah, then they'd prob just nick the solar panels and batteries instead......

Probably not, as Solar Panels and batteries are so ridiculously cheap there‘s little in the way of a 2nd hand market.

 

[Technologist]

Yeah, then they'd prob just nick the solar panels and batteries instead......

..... and in some parts of GB (i.e. the west), we can have several days with rain and no sun.

TPO

I did use a winter insolation figure and gave the device 3 days battery. It would cost another £100 to give it another 3 days more battery. It would be possible to work out the balance between storage and the cost to charge up the odd unit which is running low.

I should also add that I expect that given likely production runs it would be possible to design our locally powered signalling systems to have essentially zero re-sale value. Who are you going to sell whole units to, and the parts can be designed to for that specific device.

Of course said systems would also have a 4-5G radio and a satellite connection so giving them a bit of memory and a camera means you also have a surveillance system. All these things are pennies on the pound to add to the cost of typical rail systems.

The consumer market in electronics have given us marvels of technology to the point where the mobile phone owned by the world’s richest man is essentially an impulse purchase for someone on the median salary.

It shouldn’t cost millions of pounds per mile to signal railways in a world where an iTag costs £28 and I get alerted when one is following me for free.

 

[Halifaxlad]

I recently wondered if BTP carried out any undercover work in relation to stopping this issue.

 

[Bald Rick]

I recently wondered if BTP carried out any undercover work in relation to stopping this issue.

If they do, and for obvious reasons, it’s not obvious!

 

[HSTEd]

Solution would be to locally power points with a solar panel and battery.

Typical motors are around 500w. If we assume a 10 second cycle and 10 moves an hour we need about 0.33 of a KWh a day assuming 24hr operation. Average insolation in UK in December is 0.52KWh per day so accounting for efficiency we’d need about 2-3m2 of solar panels and probably about 1Kwh of battery to deal with a few dull days in row.

The battery would be about £100 including the charger and the solar panels would be £400-600.

The most basic question at that point would be why have we even got the signal cables?

4/5G connections are £’s to add to the device and satellite connections are pretty cheap too, I don’t see why you wouldn’t have both. Also if the battery starts running low in an unseasonably murky winter the system could call for a charge and someone(thing) could go out there with a booster battery.

Local power and wireless connections are taking over most cost conscious applications, rail should be going in this direction. It’s not like we have wired connections in ATC so it’s not like there isn’t precedent.

I once stumbled upon a powerpoint from a rail conference where people were suggesting GSM-R radios in all trackside equipment.

I lost the URL and I've not managed to find it since. But a GSM-R radio chip probably costs not much at all given the size of production runs.

Also 330Wh per day is about 15W.
At 400Vdc (~40mA per point machine), you could use a steel wire and still get acceptable volt drops!

AC would be a bit dicier but with a non magnetic grade you could even use more conventional feeder gear.