Cab rides

[jon0844]

Yes, although I am sure the risk is quite small, there would be the chance that someone who wanted to potentially hijack a train might seek to innocently gain access. Mind you, it can't be that hard to gain access from the inside of the train anyway (smash the glass for the emergency handle) yet I am not sure I can recall any story of anyone doing that.

It's pretty fair to say that there's not much you could do on a train that you could if you took over a plane but the press would have a field day, even if it was nothing more than some journo getting access to 'expose' how easy it might be to take over a train full of hundreds of innocent women and children (oh, and possibly some men - but who cares about them!).

 

[saracen43]

I know that there are a number of videos on youtube from driver's cabs. Is it possible to get cab rides without being a driver? Has anyone on here done so/attempted to get a cab ride? It would be something I would be interested in seeing. Is it worth contacting TOCs?

I remember reading that Wrexham and Shropshire offered a competition to win your dad a ride in the cab on Father's Day for two years. I tried contacting Wrexham and Shropshire by email suggesting that they allow people to buy cab rides for a higher price than normal travel, but got no reply. (I thought this would be a good way for them to make some extra money, especially now they have had to reduce the number of trains per day from four to three. It would be a similar sort of thing to a driving experience on a heritage railway, but you would not get to drive here, just be in the cab).

Anyway, does anyone know if it is possible to contact TOCs to arrange cab rides?

As stated before it would not happen due to health & safety regs,but in the late 80s when i worked for the Post office i missed the last train back to L/SPA from Oxford.Having to be at work for 5.30 the next morning this left me in a bit of a pickle,so i got talking to the posties loading a mail train which was a double headed 31,they talked to the driver and he agreed to let me travel in the cab of the second loco,they even ran it along the platform at L/SPA as apposed to the middle road just to drop me off,this would be unheard of today.

 

[33056]

^^^
I experienced something similar in the late 1980s whilst trying to get to work quite late at night during bad weather (snow!). As I worked on the railway, I phoned the local signal box up to see where my train had got to, no sign of any passenger trains but there was a parcels service going that way, which was stopped to pick me up (which was the "way of the world" in those days).

It turned out to be a class 31 towing a DPU and as I climbed aboard a young man came rushing up but stopped with a look of disappointment when he saw that it was not a passenger train. The driver asked him if he worked for the railway, but, despite him answering in the negative took pity on him and agreed to drop him off when he replied that he only wanted to go two stops up the line. He was most grateful and even offered the driver £5 when he got off

 

[notadriver]

As an RPI i am not even aloud in the front cab. I wouldnt dream of asking as i wouldnt want to risk either my or my drivers job's. This is not to say i wouldnt like to see what goes on up front but its just not worth it

If you were an RPI in my job (on the buses) you have authority over the driver and can order he/she to turn off the engine, book them for not wearing a tie, and even stop them from driving if you see fit!
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

It's not the drivers they are worried about! atleast not directly.

You have to be quiet in the cab and some people just dont stop talking. I believe in some TOCs even other drivers aren't allowed to ride in the cab unless in the course of their duties (route learning) not travelling (passing)
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

Yes, although I am sure the risk is quite small, there would be the chance that someone who wanted to potentially hijack a train might seek to innocently gain access. Mind you, it can't be that hard to gain access from the inside of the train anyway (smash the glass for the emergency handle) yet I am not sure I can recall any story of anyone doing that.

Only underground trains certain units have the glass which you can break. On Networkers or Class 375s for example there is no access.

 

[GB]

If you were an RPI in my job (on the buses) you have authority over the driver and can order he/she to turn off the engine, book them for not wearing a tie, and even stop them from driving if you see fit

An RPI on the buses and an RPI on the trains are quite different. Your kind of RPI sounds more like a TOCs driver standards manager.

 

[notadriver]

An RPI on the buses and an RPI on the trains are quite different. Your kind of RPI sounds more like a TOCs driver standards manager.

I would agree except a TOCs driver standards manager doesn't check tickets and knows how to drive a train (of course). The buses RPI's job primarily is to check tickets on the bus. They can issue penalty fares (tfl) in the same way a railway RPI can. But despite not necessarily holding a PCV licence (to drive a bus) they can 'book' the driver for all manner of things from not wearing a tie to looking at him in the wrong way. I hate them.

 

[JoeGJ1984]

I have a couple of stories that should give you some hope.

About two years ago I was offered the opportunity to ride in the cab from Kings Cross to Leeds, and back. HST on the down, and 91(DVT) for the up trip. There were three people in the cab, driver, driver manager and me. I did sign some paperwork and had a 'do's and don'ts' chat before we departed. It was all very professional. Both the driver and driver manager could not have been more welcoming (even bringing a spare chair so that we could all sit down). They answered all my questions and providing we weren't running under caution were happy for me to take as many photos as I wished (including the money shot with the speedo at 125). I can confirm that it was a wonderful experience, one that I will never forget.

More recently I was returning from London and the FCC driver kindly left the door between first and the cab open on a 365. My 6 year (ok, and his dad) had an excellent time. And at no point did we distract the driver or did he divert his attention from the job in hand; other than a BIG thank you once we arrived at our final station. I did a thread on this about 5 months ago if you want to search.

Finally, a friend of mine wrote to what was GNER and asked for a cab ride. He quickly got a letter back and he had a similar experience to me but went to Newcastle instead.

There are a lot of good people who work on the railways and in my experience if they can, they will, no matter what the request is; including cab rides.

Good luck, I waited 36 years for mine and it was worth every second.

With the first of these stories, how did you get offered the cab ride? Did you just contact the TOC? Do you think I will have any joy if I write to three or four TOCs near me and ask for a cab ride? (I might try it in the new year).

 

[theblackwatch]

There was an accident in 1986 where passengers travelling in the cab of a DMU were cited as a secondary cause. Full details can be found at http://www.railwaysarchive.co.uk/eventsummary.php?eventID=1171

 

[4SRKT]

With the first of these stories, how did you get offered the cab ride? Did you just contact the TOC? Do you think I will have any joy if I write to three or four TOCs near me and ask for a cab ride? (I might try it in the new year).

I wrote to NIR last year asking for a cab pass and citing that I'd had one in 1986, and they basically said 'on your bike'.

 

[ralphchadkirk]

With regards to cab rides, you're very unlikely to get one.

I was very lucky this year, getting a cab ride on HS1 to Ashford and back - but then again, I was on work experience with Southeastern at the time!

 

[Peter Mugridge]

There was an accident in 1986 where passengers travelling in the cab of a DMU were cited as a secondary cause. Full details can be found at http://www.railwaysarchive.co.uk/eventsummary.php?eventID=1171

I seem to recall another accident - can't remember which one though - in recent years where a unit was involved in a fatal collision involving a SPAD and it was later found that the guard was not only in the cab but was being allowed by the driver to drive the train.

 

[kentuckytony]

That was on the Uckfield line - at Cowden on 15-10-1994.

BTW - for a Yank - I kind of get the "on your bike" slam, but where did that come from?
Sounds like someone telling a kid to get lost. Gave me a chuckle anyway.

 

[Peter Mugridge]

"On your bike".... just Google the phrase and "Norman Tebbit"

 

[E&W Lucas]

There's been a number of operating incidents put down to the presence of extraneous people in driving cabs. Authorised or otherwise. As a result, there is essentially a presumption against any form of unnecessary cab access. It's absolutely hammered into drivers that people in cabs = operational risk.

No matter how fascinating the prospect of a footplate trip is, please recognise that this is a work environment, and one that does not tolerate mistakes. It's absolutely not appropriate to use it as an "entertainment venue." From the driver's perspective, it's what pays my mortgage and allows me to support my family. As such, I would probably be unwilling to have someone there who was on a "jolly".

To the o p who started the thread - fair enough, write in, but do not expect a positive answer.

 

[kentuckytony]

I shall now always have the link to http://www.effingpot.com/slang.shtml at hand!
And now in possession of TMI about Norman Tebbit.

 

[4SRKT]

Good lord! A Yank who's knowledgeable enough about railways in Britain to know about incidents on such obscure corners of the network as the Uckfield line! Welcome to the Forum!

 

[Lee_Again]

With the first of these stories, how did you get offered the cab ride? Did you just contact the TOC? Do you think I will have any joy if I write to three or four TOCs near me and ask for a cab ride? (I might try it in the new year).

For my cab ride, the first story, I arranged a charity event and the winner of our star auction prize just happened to be a GNER driver and also a friend of a friend. He was so pleased with his purchase he offered me the ride (once my other friend told him of my interest). Took about 2-3 months to arrange.

The last story, my friend just wrote directly to GNER. He is disabled and yet they still arranged it. I say that because he needs a wheelchair and cabs aren't the best places to be if that's your situation.

 

[37401]

Preserved lines are your best bet, and you can ride in something "proper"

 

[chris89]

As many others have said the easiest and best way is on a Preserved Railway.

Rather the driving experience course's or driver for a fiver type thing that is on a lot of them.

Or the other way is to become a volunteer and get to know the drivers, footplate crew or become Rostered and work your way up.

Chris

 

[jgwilliams2009]

when i was at thornaby mpd on a fortnights work experience back in 1981 i got a legal cab ride thornaby to york skelton yard and back in 40199

 

[12CSVT]

These days you need a cab pass to travel in the cab, and these are only issued to people whose duties involve travelling in the cab (ie drivers, driver instructors, fitters, etc)

 

[Pumbaa]

These days you need a cab pass to travel in the cab, and these are only issued to people whose duties involve travelling in the cab (ie drivers, driver instructors, fitters, etc)

Not necessarily - a DM in certain TOCs has the power to supervise you with the filling in of some simple paperwork, or depending on how they're feeling, no paperwork.

 

[Striker]

I really don't understand why having someone in the cab is considered a dangerous distraction. I'm an air traffic controller and I can quite happily chat to someone whilst as in front of the radar of what is the second busiest piece of airspace in Europe. I can talk and do my job easily because I'm not being stretched to my limits. When it does get too much I recognise this fact and adjust my working method appropriately. Either I'm superhuman (not really) or the dangers of having someone in the cab is exaggerated and comes under 'elf and safety mate.

And yes, I am aware that there have been accidents attributed to having someone in the cab. It's my belief that this is more a lack of concentration and the presence of someone in the cab is just how it happened rather than one of the other twenty or so ways somebody could lose concentration. It's just an inbuilt statistic that you're never going to remove.

 

[LE Greys]

I really don't understand why having someone in the cab is considered a dangerous distraction. I'm an air traffic controller and I can quite happily chat to someone whilst as in front of the radar of what is the second busiest piece of airspace in Europe. I can talk and do my job easily because I'm not being stretched to my limits. When it does get too much I recognise this fact and adjust my working method appropriately. Either I'm superhuman (not really) or the dangers of having someone in the cab is exaggerated and comes under 'elf and safety mate.

And yes, I am aware that there have been accidents attributed to having someone in the cab. It's my belief that this is more a lack of concentration and the presence of someone in the cab is just how it happened rather than one of the other twenty or so ways somebody could lose concentration. It's just an inbuilt statistic that you're never going to remove.

Was there an increase in accidents after they abandoned the second driver for HSTs? I don't think so. I've never been quite sure why they needed two drivers for a while, then suddenly they didn't.

EDIT:
Come to think of it, Southall didn't happen until after they abandoned double-manning.

 

[E&W Lucas]

I really don't understand why having someone in the cab is considered a dangerous distraction. I'm an air traffic controller and I can quite happily chat to someone whilst as in front of the radar of what is the second busiest piece of airspace in Europe. I can talk and do my job easily because I'm not being stretched to my limits. When it does get too much I recognise this fact and adjust my working method appropriately. Either I'm superhuman (not really) or the dangers of having someone in the cab is exaggerated and comes under 'elf and safety mate.

And yes, I am aware that there have been accidents attributed to having someone in the cab. It's my belief that this is more a lack of concentration and the presence of someone in the cab is just how it happened rather than one of the other twenty or so ways somebody could lose concentration. It's just an inbuilt statistic that you're never going to remove.

Train driving is an exercise in concentration management too, but I think it's more the behaviour of the third party that they're worried about. No deliberate, but more a case of not recognising what's appropriate at a given time. People in cabs has been a contributory factor in incidents historically.

Southall was a little different. A HST was running about at line speed with AWS isolated. Subsequently banned by the Rules, and of course we have TPWS fitted across the network now as well. Double manning at high speed looks to have been an ASLEF job protection exercise, and was abandoned in exchange for £££.

 

[Hydro]

Some things you take for granted a bit I suppose, I can get up right now and go and sit in the cab for a while, if it wasn't already rather crowded with the driver and the DM that's rocked up. Did the majority of the West Highland up front. Had the vestibule doors wedged open on the 950 and driver, crew and engineers enjoying the scenery.

 

[kentuckytony]

And I am, 4SRKT, also a Thumper fan!

[I can thank Peter Middleton for his fine V125 production of the "Uckfield Thumper" for my initial knowledge about the Cowden incident.]
I am into all things train-related in the UK and Ireland.
Blame it on having a Scottish mother and having lived in Margate for about 3 years long ago.

 

[The Planner]

Get yourself to Stourbridge and do the PPM, you're about 6 inches from the driver on that thing.

 

[GNER 373]

In around 1998 I was at that stage of my life where you need to decide on career paths! As my most of my family worked (or works) in the Railway Industry and Fire Brigade these were my natural choices...I decided to write to GNER to see what was available to me as a school leaver but couldn't find a person to address it to....So I rewrote it and sent it to Mr. Christopher Garnett (CEO of GNER). Maybe it was fate but at the time GNER were about to begin a Marketing method to get more people from the Sunderland Area to travel to Newcastle Central to use their services! One of these methods was to invite a local DJ from Sun FM along for a day on board and report back to his listeners how good the services were! Not that this mattered any to me as I received a letter from Mr Garnetts PA informing me there was very little they could offer me at such a young age, but how about a Cab Ride up to Edinburgh with First Class return! I must have read that letter 88 times before it sunk in and there I was on Platform 2 on a Tuesday morning waiting for a 10.00am service to Edinburgh with my mum, DJ, GNER Chief PA (really good looking aswell - think Michelle Pfiffer in her prime!) and the Driver Manager, Bob Gunn who happened to be my friends dad!!! Small World!! Travelled up to Edinburgh on 91012 and came back on the same train (after I'd checked out the DVT) in First Class with the DJ, My Mum and 'Michelle' with a 3 Course Meal (first time I'd had Taglitelle) and on alighting two GNER staff waiting for our arrival with free T-Shirts, Badges etc etc! To this day only the day I got married topped this! And the DJ mentioned me on his evening show too! God I miss GNER! Other times I used to wait on Platforms 2 & 3 at Central Station for services and ask the Driver for a quick look in the cab! For my recent 28th Birthday I was with my family and a Super Voyager came in before our Train to York with the cab door opening next to us my young nephew was asked by the driver if he'd like a look around! Guess who fought off my grandparents, his mum and my wife to 'help him'!!! And he let us blast the horn which made around 350 people inside of central station jump ou of their skins great times but doubt many people will get a chance like this!

 

[Striker]

Great story!