Bye Bye Gadaffi (?)

[Old Timer]

All we need to do is get Magabe and we will have completed the whole set. Sadam-Bin Laden- Gaddafi- Magabe.

Ah but Mugabe has the benefit of being a black African Marxist and is thus absolutely immune to any criticism except from Right Wingers who are then accused of being racist :roll: :roll:

The last Goverment sat on the sidelines because they were instrumental in supporting him back in the late 70s, although it was Conservative Government that implemented self rule. Mugabe then set about destroying all and any opposition to him and defenestrated Nkomo.

The rest as they say is history

 

[Oswyntail]

Ah but Mugabe has the benefit of being a black African Marxist and is thus absolutely immune to any criticism except from Right Wingers who are then accused of being racist :roll: :roll:...

Oh dear, oh dear.

 

[Schnellzug]

i was just thinking, this has been a nice little bonus for Philip Hammond hasn't it, since he's now all over the knews saying what a great thing this is for humanity and how it vindicates the policy of the CameronCleggCoalition.

 

[Madge Wildfire]

I'm not sure that hauling Gadaffi up for trial in The Hague would have been quite the retribution filled event some people make out.

He would only have gone through the usual ritual thus:-

1. Refuse to recognise the legitimacy of the court.

2. Insist on defending himself.

3. Draw attention to the fact that a Muslim was being tried in a Christian country by a bunch of infidels.

4. And generally turn the whole event into a Gadaffi-centred circus which would have dragged on for years without him admitting to anything.

 

[AlterEgo]

Oh dear, oh dear.

Are you Paul or Barry Chuckle?

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

i was just thinking, this has been a nice little bonus for Philip Hammond hasn't it, since he's now all over the knews saying what a great thing this is for humanity and how it vindicates the policy of the CameronCleggCoalition.

....as well as not having to be asked any awkward questions about the HS2 project any more.

 

[90019]

Trouble is, we know Mugabe and Iran's bloke are still alive, Kim Jong-Il could have died a long time ago...

Nah, course he hasn't, he's forever submitting questions to Ask Rhod Gilbert

 

[Butts]

Watched both BBC 1800 News and ITV at 1830 tonight.

Interesting contrast the images of Gadaffi broadcast on ITV were a lot more graphic than those on BBC.

Another aspect was the fact most western commentators are obsessed about the way in which he met his end whereas the people of Libya are just pleased he is dead. They couldn't give two hoots if he was shot in crossfire or liquidated.

This brings me on to the type of images that should be broadcast - the middle eastern networks seem a lot less squeamish than western outlets on the censoring of the graphic images of war and catastrophe in general.

 

[Schnellzug]

Watched both BBC 1800 News and ITV at 1830 tonight.

Interesting contrast the images of Gadaffi broadcast on ITV were a lot more graphic than those on BBC.

Another aspect was the fact most western commentators are obsessed about the way in which he met his end whereas the people of Libya are just pleased he is dead. They couldn't give two hoots if he was shot in crossfire or liquidated.

This brings me on to the type of images that should be broadcast - the middle eastern networks seem a lot less squeamish than western outlets on the censoring of the graphic images of war and catastrophe in general.

Yes, and bearing in mind that the Terrorist Mastermind(TM), mr. bin L, met his end in a very similar manner, and the Western nations seemed quite pleased about that, can anyone dare to suggest hypocrisy? Or is it just that Bin L was an Outlaw, and so deserved to be rubbed out by U.S. Forces, but Gadaffi was a Head of State, however dodgy, and there might be a few UN members that wouldn't want to encourage their own people to get ideas ....

 

[kylemore]

The belief in what the BBC tells you all is very touching.
Unfortunately the facts get in the way eg. The majority of the Libyan people supported Gaddafi.
The so called "rebel freedom fighters" are mainly foreign mercenary scum.

 

[ralphchadkirk]

The majority of the Libyan people supported Gaddafi.

Can you support that statement with evidence?

 

[SS4]

The belief in what the BBC tells you all is very touching.
Unfortunately the facts get in the way eg. The majority of the Libyan people supported Gaddafi.
The so called "rebel freedom fighters" are mainly foreign mercenary scum.

I don't know what your vendetta against the BBC is, every domestic news channel has heavily implied that nobody supported Gadaffi which is ludicrous and when they begrudgingly admitted that people were fighting for him it was implied that they were somehow being coerced into it.
That being said I don't think the majority of the Libyan people supported Gaddafi (however you spell it!) any more than the majority of this country wanted Cameron as PM of this country

The NATO no-fly zone certainly kept Gadaffi's tanks from taking to the air though, thank goodness :roll:

 

[Kryten2340]

Finally, some justice for the 1985 attempted murder of Doc Brown by the Libyans in that mall parking lot.

 

[90019]

Finally, some justice for the 1985 attempted murder of Doc Brown by the Libyans in that mall parking lot.

I see you're using the American definition of justice there.

 

[Hydro]

Finally, some justice for the 1985 attempted murder of Doc Brown by the Libyans in that mall parking lot.

That was my Facebook status for a while

 

[ng1980]

Has anyone thought to ask the South Koreans if they want to unify the Korean Peninsular? Because if I was a South Korean I'm not sure I'd want to do it.

Yes, I have, on many occasions.

South Koreans will usually start talking about them being "brothers" or "cousins" and how they should reunite again. South Koreans will cite the sad stories of families which ended up being split by the border. South Koreans will talk of how they think they should reunite.

However, the South Koreans are very well aware that it will drain their wealth and be a huge burden for them, when they are trying to continue develop towards becoming a world power.

It's quite clear that most South Koreans know what they think they should do, and know what is best for the South.

Left-leaning parties tend to positively encourage the North (the proverbial carrot) but right-leaning parties (such as the current government) tend to punish the North (the proverbial stick).

Any further questions, please don't hesitate to contact a Brit who has lived for over 5 years in South Korea (ie, me)!

 

[Butts]

Yes, I have, on many occasions.

South Koreans will usually start talking about them being "brothers" or "cousins" and how they should reunite again. South Koreans will cite the sad stories of families which ended up being split by the border. South Koreans will talk of how they think they should reunite.

However, the South Koreans are very well aware that it will drain their wealth and be a huge burden for them, when they are trying to continue develop towards becoming a world power.

It's quite clear that most South Koreans know what they think they should do, and know what is best for the South.

Left-leaning parties tend to positively encourage the North (the proverbial carrot) but right-leaning parties (such as the current government) tend to punish the North (the proverbial stick).

Any further questions, please don't hesitate to contact a Brit who has lived for over 5 years in South Korea (ie, me)!

I imagine the relative poverty of the North would make the East/ West Germany unification look like "a walk in the park"

 

[ainsworth74]

It's quite clear that most South Koreans know what they think they should do, and know what is best for the South.

So it's basically that they think that the 'moral' thing to do would be to reunify the peninsula (and end that terrible regime up north) but that probably wouldn't be the best thing for South Korea as an independent country to do?

I imagine the relative poverty of the North would make the East/ West Germany unification look like "a walk in the park"

Absolutely. When you were reunifying West/East Germany whilst compared with the FRG (West) the GDR (East) was underdeveloped and much poorer, the GDR did at least have fairly well developed infrastructure in terms of roads, railways, telecommunications, hospitals, it had pretty good education systems (schools and universities) and some useful (if outdated) industry.

In North Korea you have absolutely nothing like that. Limited infrastructure, little or no real education (that is comparable with the South at least), poor healthcare and no usable industry.

The cost of unification in economic terms would be enormous and I would guess set back South Korea's development by a decade or more as they had to focus on developing the North almost from scratch.

 

[ng1980]

I imagine the relative poverty of the North would make the East/ West Germany unification look like "a walk in the park"

Yes, there is a huge difference in the wealth of North and South Korea. This will be a burden to South Korea upon unification.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

So it's basically that they think that the 'moral' thing to do would be to reunify the peninsula (and end that terrible regime up north) but that probably wouldn't be the best thing for South Korea as an independent country to do?

Yes, exactly.

Absolutely. When you were reunifying West/East Germany whilst compared with the FRG (West) the GDR (East) was underdeveloped and much poorer, the GDR did at least have fairly well developed infrastructure in terms of roads, railways, telecommunications, hospitals, it had pretty good education systems (schools and universities) and some useful (if outdated) industry.

In North Korea you have absolutely nothing like that. Limited infrastructure, little or no real education (that is comparable with the South at least), poor healthcare and no usable industry.

The cost of unification in economic terms would be enormous and I would guess set back South Korea's development by a decade or more as they had to focus on developing the North almost from scratch.

Exactly. Education, healthcare and infrastructure (roads, rail, telecommunications, etc.) will all need significant investment.

 

[SS4]

Would it be more likely for the north to become an autonomous region of China rather than join with the south? I can't see there being any sort of joint sovereignty (unless duly elected of course)

 

[ng1980]

Would it be more likely for the north to become an autonomous region of China rather than join with the south? I can't see there being any sort of joint sovereignty (unless duly elected of course)

I don't think (and I don't believe any experts think) that the North would ever willingly lose soverignty. I don't see it agreeing to be an autonomous part of China or Russia (the only allies it has), and joining with the South would definitely be out of the question!

I think it is almost unanimously believed by experts in the field that one day the regime will be toppled. The question is when.

In 2010, with Kim Jong Il's health deteriorating, his successor Kim Jong Eun being relatively unknown inside the country, currency revaluation problems, and whispers or restlessness and discontent coming from inside. Kim Jong Eun has now been promoted and much work appears to have gone into building him a reputation, currency problems appear to have improved, etc. resulting in the regime appearing stronger.

Whispers from insiders still show the discontent and growing impatience of the population, including, I understand, the middle-class businessmen. It is a country with great security over its population and little internal communication so it will be hard to co-ordinate much action, but when people have nothing except empty stomachs and they understand this, it's amazing what could be done at the right time.

 

[kylemore]

Attempts at de-stablilisation (the false flag gunboat sinking, the dodgy "artillery exchanges" etc) appeared to have not had the desired result.
N. Korea (unlike Libya) had the foresight to equip themselves with an effective deterrent and unlike Libya have been able to see off the "Great Satan" and associated lackies for the time being.