Budget 2020 - Anything for Rail?

[Cardiff123]

As usual, I see the government has gone with populist measures on transport and infrastructure in the budget. Fuel duty still frozen and "£27bn on over 4,000 miles of roads", "the biggest ever investment in strategic roads and motorways"

Climate crisis anyone?

 

[stuu]

£100bn on HS2?

 

[nlogax]

Trying to find some detail, seems CityAM has some bullet points;

"The Chancellor of the Exchequer Rishi Sunak has pledged £600bn in investment over the next five years for infrastructure and industry in today’s Budget.

Part of the deal will see £27bn pledged for the development of the UK’s roads, which will help improve 4,000 miles of roads and more than 100 junctions.

He also made a commitment to build the Manchester to Leeds high speed rail link as part of Northern Powerhouse rail, as well as fixing the A303.

The government will also invest £20m in developing the Midlands Rail Hub, as well as building a new station at Cambridge South, part of the Oxford to Cambridge transport corridor.

In addition, he announced a £4.2bn fund for the seven so-called metro mayors of England’s devolved city regions to develop transport links, as well as an additional £1bn for transport in cities such as Stoke."

 

[BigB]

The view from the BBC correspondents now the budget is over is "no, not much for Rail...."
But ther is still another budget to come in Autumn so there may be developments depending on how the operator of last resort pice pans out..

All the above is factual and addressed the OP question. Do I get a prize

 

[LNW-GW Joint]

Detail is always hard to find in a budget speech.
More may appear in the Red Book this afternoon, and in any case there are other spending reviews to come in July and November.
Some of the rail items he spoke about were already in train, and he only really announced the next phase of planning, not the start of work on site.
It's also usual for the minister responsible (ie Grant Shapps) to give more detail when the transport part of the budget speech gets debated in the Commons.

 

[Mikey C]

I imagine other politicians will want the glory of announcing (or re-announcing ) specific rail projects...

Or at the least the government will want a series of separate headlines rather than it all being buried in the budget announcement

 

[Dai Corner]

Here's a link to the full text of the Budget https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/budget-2020-documents/budget-2020

A significant part of the additional funding for the 'metro mayors' may end up being spent on railways.

Building on the Transforming Cities Fund, the government will also provide £4.2 billion from 2022-23 for five-year funding settlements for eight Mayoral Combined Authorities (in West Yorkshire, Greater Manchester, West Midlands, Liverpool City Region, Tyne and Wear, West of England, Sheffield City Region and Tees Valley). While it will be for elected Mayors to put forward ambitious plans, the government would welcome the opportunity to support a range of schemes, such as the renewal of the Sheffield Supertram, the development of a modern, low-carbon metro network for West Yorkshire and tram-train pilots in Greater Manchester. As a first step, the government will open discussions with Greater Manchester, Liverpool City Region and the West Midlands in the coming months.

 

[Nicholas Lewis]

This is jam tomorrow for rail but there is clear intent now to give the English cities more funding but from 2022 with a 4.2B investment fund

The government is investing £4.2 billion in the transport networks of eight city regions across England from 2022-23. Funding will be delivered through five-year, consolidated transport settlements agreed with central government and based on plans put forward by Mayors. Following the approach that has worked for London, these settlements will be published once they have been agreed, providing transparency and accountability while giving Mayors the flexibility and certainty to deliver their plans. As a first step, the government will open discussions with Greater Manchester, Liverpool City Region and West Midlands in the coming months. The new West Yorkshire Combined Authority, Sheffield City Region, Tyne and Wear, West of England and Tees Valley will also receive settlements, subject to putting in place appropriate governance to agree and deliver funding, including an elected Mayor for their city regions and transport networks.

So on equitable basis thats £500m / city but until the detail is worked out we wont know on what its going to be spent. Also not clear if this is annual budget or just additional funds in the future.

Other things ive spotted

The government is devolving over £160 million from the Local Growth Fund to West Midlands Combined Authority to accelerate progress on the Eastside Metro extension and phase one of the Sprint bus rapid transit network

£198 million for the North East, including £95 million for frequency and reliability improvements across the Tyne and Wear Metro system and to complement the government’s recent £337 million investment in new rolling stock

It was already flagged that big announcements on infrastructure have been deferred until later in spring but overall they are proposing significant capital budget increases year on year of £15-20B some of that will find its way into rail.

Scotland gets an extra £640m Wales £360m so we will have to see what they plan to do with that

 

[Grumpy Git]

He also made a commitment to build the Manchester to Leeds high speed rail link as part of Northern Powerhouse rail,

Hmm, sounds ominous for Liverpool & Hull?

 

[Ianno87]

Hmm, sounds ominous for Liverpool & Hull?

Does it? Nothing to stop a Liverpool-Hull train running high speed between Manchester and Leeds.

 

[Mag_seven]

Fuel duty frozen again - yet rail fares go up again!

 

[Grumpy Git]

Does it? Nothing to stop a Liverpool-Hull train running high speed between Manchester and Leeds.

I think its like redecorating your front room, but putting the threadbare carpet back down and not bothering to put the top coat on the skirting boards?

 

[ashkeba]

Climate crisis anyone?

"Ooh, yes please," said Boris. "Anything to distract from the disasters I've had more to do with making! Even death of the planet is preferable to me taking responsibility!"

 

[CaptainHaddock]

Fuel duty frozen again - yet rail fares go up again!

Unfortunately for us rail only accounts for 2% of travel so it would be unrealistic to expect the rail users to have greater priority than the road lobby.

https://www.railforums.co.uk/threads/rail-accounts-for-only-2-of-all-trips-made.178906/

 

[gg1]

I think its like redecorating your front room, but putting the threadbare carpet back down and not bothering to put the top coat on the skirting boards?

More like prioritising redecorating your front room and main bedrooms, but leaving alone the hall, stairs, landing and spare room as you'd see less benefit if you spent your finite amount of cash in those less used locations.

 

[ashkeba]

More like prioritising redecorating your front room and main bedrooms, but leaving alone the hall, stairs, landing and spare room as you'd see less benefit if you spent your finite amount of cash in those less used locations.

"Welcome to Liverpool: Manchester's spare room"

 

[HullRailMan]

As usual, I see the government has gone with populist measures on transport and infrastructure in the budget. Fuel duty still frozen and "£27bn on over 4,000 miles of roads", "the biggest ever investment in strategic roads and motorways"

Climate crisis anyone?

So, freezing a tax paid by the vast majority of households and investing in the transport network used by the majority of passenger and freight traffic is “populist”?
The govt is investing in rail and buses. It can’t just pretend that roads don’t exist.

 

[GRALISTAIR]

Fuel duty frozen again - yet rail fares go up again!

I know -disgusting and so green and carbon neutral. This bit really upset me.

 

[MotorcycleAlan]

So, freezing a tax paid by the vast majority of households and investing in the transport network used by the majority of passenger and freight traffic is “populist”?
The govt is investing in rail and buses. It can’t just pretend that roads don’t exist.

Indeed, but you have to accept that some people here, perhaps only a small minority, believe that rail is the only form of transport, and don't accept that an efficient economy requires all forms of transport to work well, and together. Sadly, however much money you throw at each, without a joined up system you will not get full benefit from spending.

Climate crisis anyone?

Actually, sorting some of the long standing bottlenecks like Stonehenge (A303) and Birdlip (A417) will reduce emissions because people will not be crawling along at 10 miles and hour in second gear. Also the A303 mess encourages traffic for the south west from London and the SE to go M4/M5 a very long diversion, again adding to emissions. No amount of spending on rail is going to encourage a family of 4 to ditch the car, and spend a fortnight touring around Cornwall by rail - except for a small number from here perhaps. Oh, 2 of us did try it once, never again.

 

[LancasterRed]

Cottam Parkway station being confirmed is pretty big for the local area - and much needed, given the poor performance of buses in the area

 

[DarloRich]

surely the investment in roads and the freeze on fuel duty will really help people get to the station.

 

[Dai Corner]

surely the investment in roads and the freeze on fuel duty will really help people get to the station.

Should also help rail replacement buses.

Rail should pick up some of the aggregate traffic for road building.

 

[DarloRich]

Should also help rail replacement buses.

Rail should pick up some of the aggregate traffic for road building.

Absolutely - got to take the positives.

 

[Dr Hoo]

Fuel duty frozen again - yet rail fares go up again!

Has there been an explicit budget announcement that “rail fares are going to be increased in real terms to help finance all the investment” or similar?

 

[squizzler]

"£27bn on over 4,000 miles of roads", "the biggest ever investment in strategic roads and motorways"

What exactly does that mean? Does he mean re-opening old highways, or upgrades to ones we already got ("smart motorways", bike lanes etc)?

 

[trebor79]

No amount of spending on rail is going to encourage a family of 4 to ditch the car, and spend a fortnight touring around Cornwall by rail - except for a small number from here perhaps. Oh, 2 of us did try it once, never again.

I don't know. Every year I get an little bit closer to persuading my wife that we should do just that. We don't usually stay far from the cottage we rent close to a beach and town, there's good buses and we could always rent a car for a day or two.
Every year she gives I more serious thought. It's a dreadful drive from East Anglia, and every single year our journey home is even worse. Last year it took us all day (setting off at 9am) to get from Fowey to my family in Marlborough where we stayed for a weekend.

 

[Fawkes Cat]

One which I know has been discussed on this forum:

In addition, the government will promote air quality improvement by removing the entitlement to use red diesel except for agriculture, fish farming, rail and non-commercial heating.

(my bold and underlining)

Source: https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/budget-2020-documents/budget-2020

 

[superkev]

I wonder if the government have finally lost patience with rail with its history of massively overbudget and late delivered schemes.
Having expensivly built up electrification teams, expertise and buying plant im sad to see it all ditched, until the next time of course.
What a way to run things.
K

 

[yorksrob]

Indeed, but you have to accept that some people here, perhaps only a small minority, believe that rail is the only form of transport, and don't accept that an efficient economy requires all forms of transport to work well, and together. Sadly, however much money you throw at each, without a joined up system you will not get full benefit from spending.

Actually, sorting some of the long standing bottlenecks like Stonehenge (A303) and Birdlip (A417) will reduce emissions because people will not be crawling along at 10 miles and hour in second gear. Also the A303 mess encourages traffic for the south west from London and the SE to go M4/M5 a very long diversion, again adding to emissions. No amount of spending on rail is going to encourage a family of 4 to ditch the car, and spend a fortnight touring around Cornwall by rail - except for a small number from here perhaps. Oh, 2 of us did try it once, never again.

My family of four (last year five) have spent 3-4 days out of a week touring around Cornwall every year by rail for the last ten. Admittedly, I'm the youngest out of that lot.

It all usually goes fine, until we try and get to Padstow using a rail/bus connection. When we try that it goes wrong.

This budget would have been a nice opportunity to announce that £5 billion fund for connecting communities to the rail network. Oh well, maybe next time.

 

[hwl]

I wonder if the government have finally lost patience with rail with its history of massively overbudget and late delivered schemes.
Having expensivly built up electrification teams, expertise and buying plant im sad to see it all ditched, until the next time of course.
What a way to run things.
K

Wait till the spending review in the summer...