BTP struggles to justify ECML closure for nearly 5 hours

[Bittern]

The needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few.

This is one of the many times I disagree with the OP and one of the few where I agree with the majority. The need to find out just what happened and to inform next-of-kin outweighs the need to run trains. At the end of the day (as this was), traveling passengers can wait (as they did), the evidence and the family of the victim cannot.

 

[boing_uk]

From what has been posted, I agree that the closure was entirely justified; what I do not agree is passengers being "stuck" on trains for the alleged time they were. An hour or two is understandable, but four? That is unacceptable, as it is not physically impossible to move a train back up the line to a convenient place to alight the passengers.

I understand it is not desireable to do so in every event, but the eventuality that it may be necessary on occasions to do so has surely been taken in to account, and I should think that this would have been one of those occasions.

 

[jw]

Have we really become so cosseted that to be delayed for 5 hours is treated as some abominable and degrading breach of our human rights? I realise that it was a gross inconvenience, but no-one on the trains was in danger. No-one on the trains suffered injury. It was an inconvenience.

I think even the most frustrated commuter can see past the end of their own nose in such circumstances. If you can't, you really need to adjust your perspective on life.

 

[GB]

Yes. Britain is bankrupt. We simply can't afford all the niceties we used to think were ours by right, now we know it was all bought on the never-never.

In a small way, not bringing the ECML to a screeching halt for 5 hours would symbolise that it's a tough world we're in and we can't afford all the elf'n'safety, box-ticking, jobsworths standing about for hours palaver. People need to wake up to the reality that the next decades will be harsh, frugal and no room for sentiment.

:roll::roll:

 

[Hydro]

I'm starting to think that as soon as the term "'elf'n'safety" is used, it's usually worth switching off.

 

[Greenback]

Yes. Britain is bankrupt. We simply can't afford all the niceties we used to think were ours by right, now we know it was all bought on the never-never.

In a small way, not bringing the ECML to a screeching halt for 5 hours would symbolise that it's a tough world we're in and we can't afford all the elf'n'safety, box-ticking, jobsworths standing about for hours palaver. People need to wake up to the reality that the next decades will be harsh, frugal and no room for sentiment.

This is all getting a bit silly. Do you really think that investigating what has happened when a dead body has been found is simply a palaver? Or sentimental? There really is no reason tobring in such terms as jobsworths, which are much over used here in any case.

It would be far better to debate what vsn be done for the passengers in these circumstances, such as whether they could be taken back to a station and detrained.

 

[tsubaki]

TBH five hours from the first call to fully forensicating a crime scene and removing a body, inside a tunnel which is miles from civilization (or at least BTP civilization) and on a Sunday, is pretty quick work.

 

[passmore]

Yes. Britain is bankrupt. We simply can't afford all the niceties we used to think were ours by right, now we know it was all bought on the never-never.

In a small way, not bringing the ECML to a screeching halt for 5 hours would symbolise that it's a tough world we're in and we can't afford all the elf'n'safety, box-ticking, jobsworths standing about for hours palaver. People need to wake up to the reality that the next decades will be harsh, frugal and no room for sentiment.

How is that relevant to the BTP doing their jobs to ensure that the area was safe and secure?

You may not like health and safety jobsworths, neither do I, but, as someone said above, the BTP really are finding themselves in a 'damned if they do, damned if they don't' scenario.

 

[185]

I think the longer than usual block time was due to the 700m tunnel environment. Was a pain that they had to keep both sides shut but needs must.

My last one at Woodlesford was done and dusted in 1hr 40, which was quite quick tbh.

 

[whhistle]

At that time on a Sunday, BTP could easily have stood off until rail services had closed for the night.

Priorities need to be set by the tax payers who pay these guys wages\massive pensions, not their own sense of self importance

(Y) Good one. Then if it was a murder, all the evidence would have been ruined by the passage of trains.

While it could have probably been quicker to resolve, it's just hard luck no those people stuck in it. I can't stand people who wander through life thinking they will never have any bad luck or get annoyed (and show it!) when things don't go their way. YES - even if you have paid money. Assess the risks and choose whether to say yes or no.

 

[mallard]

Yes. Britain is bankrupt. We simply can't afford all the niceties we used to think were ours by right, now we know it was all bought on the never-never.

In a small way, not bringing the ECML to a screeching halt for 5 hours would symbolise that it's a tough world we're in and we can't afford all the elf'n'safety, box-ticking, jobsworths standing about for hours palaver. People need to wake up to the reality that the next decades will be harsh, frugal and no room for sentiment.

What utter nonsense. Britain is not bankrupt. Sure, the economic situation is difficult, but compared to other countries (e.g. Greece, Ireland, Portugal), Britain is actually doing quite reasonably.

Even if the economic situation was as dire as you seem to believe, basic law-enforcement and criminal investigation should be among the last things to be sacrificed! The line was closed because it was necessary to facilitate the investigation. There is no evidence that health and safety, box-ticking or standing around for hours were present, that's just your agenda. In fact, I'm impressed that the BTP managed to perform a proper forensic examination in a hostile and remote environment in such a short time!

The enforcement of law is not "sentiment". Treating potential crime-scenes properly is vital to maintain a functioning civilised society.

Are you really saying that if, say, this turned out to be the early work of a serial killer, it would be acceptable for the BTP to say "Yeah, we could have investigated the crime scene properly and maybe found evidence that could have prevented further murders, but in difficult economic there is no room for such sentimentalism. At least we kept the trains running." Of course not!

Please, engage your brain before spouting such nonsense.

 

[leedstraindude]

One can only assume that the OP and people supporting him would be more than happy if this were to happen to them for the police to turn around and say they were to busy trying to keep things running and look after the needs of the many to investigate a suspicious death properly and they will have to live with not knowing and not everything that could be done was done if it involved one of there loved ones?
Time to lock this one down?