Brexit matters

[class ep-09]

I’ve got loads of stamps. I’m in the middle of a sub-24h stay in Amsterdam right now.

7-10 min average is codswallop.

Tell that to my mate.

 

[ainsworth74]

As a seasoned traveller / former overseas resident well versed in this problem - the best way is to be prepared: seek out the entry stamp that the officer is going to be looking for before you arrive at the desk, and point it out. Doh!

I tried that, the officer skipped straight onto all the other pages and then asked me where I entered Germany. Which explained why they'd gone wrong as I'd entered the EU in Prague so looking for a German entry stamp wasn't going to go well

On the other hand, on a different journey, the French border person at Gare Du Nord seemed to appreciate having the right page open for them to stamp me out. Or at least they gave me a big smile and a cheery "Merci"!

 

[SteveP29]

Must say. I haven’t travelled on Eurostar since the passport rule change, due to Covid etc. I have now & I was expecting the worst.

What a complete exaggeration the stories around Brexit causing delays have been. The guy waiting to stamp the passports looked utterly bored, perhaps because he had no queue for his section. The bottle necks are where they have always been. I’m shocked at how much fake news we are fed. The main problem is the passport gates are awful. I’m sure these are different gates to when I used to use the service often.

I've never seen a train crash live, so therefore, by your logic, trains don't crash

 

[AlterEgo]

How many of them were acquired on entry to the EU before February 2020?

None of them, it’s a 2 year old Brexit Blue jumbo passport that’s nearly full with about 70 EU stamps.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 30 Aug 2023 ==

Tell that to my mate.

If your mate exists he’s talking nonsense. 7-10 minutes average processing is pure balderdash. No way it takes that long, ever.

 

[birchesgreen]

7-10 minutes seems a bit excessive to me, never had any passport check take that long even when going to places like mainland China and SE Asia.

 

[Howardh]

Haven't used Eurostar since we left the EU, but have flown to EU/Schengen countries and in my experience the stamps have ended up all over the place. I would have thought, logically, that they put the stamp out adjacent to the stamp in. Oh, no, not at AGP (Malaga), they just find a random page and stamp it there. So if anyone wants to check my dates in - out they will have quite a job, seeing as there's now over a dozen stamps and they're all over the place.

Mind you, I'ven never come across any official interested in checking if I've overstayed or not. So....what's the point of it all???

 

[najaB]

None of them, it’s a 2 year old Brexit Blue jumbo passport that’s nearly full with about 70 EU stamps.

And how many EU entry/exit stamps did your previous passport contain?

 

[birchesgreen]

Haven't used Eurostar since we left the EU, but have flown to EU/Schengen countries and in my experience the stamps have ended up all over the place. I would have thought, logically, that they put the stamp out adjacent to the stamp in. Oh, no, not at AGP (Malaga), they just find a random page and stamp it there. So if anyone wants to check my dates in - out they will have quite a job, seeing as there's now over a dozen stamps and they're all over the place.

Mind you, I'ven never come across any official interested in checking if I've overstayed or not. So....what's the point of it all???

I've found most immigration staff the world over just put the stamps where they like to be honest.

 

[AlterEgo]

How many of them were acquired on entry to the EU before February 2020?

I don’t see how that’s relevant, I was making the point that I enter the EU very many times in a year and don’t recognise the “7-10 minutes on average” another poster quoted. It’s nonsense. I’ve had, maybe, a 2 minute screen before in Berlin while they totted up my 25+ entries at the time.

Brexit is causing slowages and capacity constraints at St Pancras, but 7-10 minutes per UK frequent traveller on average isn’t reality.

 

[najaB]

Brexit is causing slowages and capacity constraints at St Pancras, but 7-10 minutes per UK frequent traveller on average isn’t reality.

Fair enough. I read your post as trying to support the earlier claim that it is "fake news" that passport checks are causing issues that didn't exist previously.

 

[edwin_m]

7-10 minutes seems a bit excessive to me, never had any passport check take that long even when going to places like mainland China and SE Asia.

Just wait until they start checking biometrics. If their fingerprint machines are like those I've seen elsewhere, 7-10min is in the right ball park.

 

[Gloster]

I read recently, I think it was related to problems at Dover, that the average time has risen from something like forty seconds to seventy-five seconds. (I think that this may only apply to straightforward checks.) However, multiply that by the number of people travelling on a busy day, plus that more complicated checks may take longer, and you can be building up the queues. I believe there is also the problem that with parties of children they did little more than check that the number of passports agreed with the number of heads: now each one has to be checked. And those coming from abroad have to have passports: ID cards no longer suffice.

 

[Mojo]

Just wait until they start checking biometrics. If their fingerprint machines are like those I've seen elsewhere, 7-10min is in the right ball park.

What countries have you been to where biometrics takes 7-10 mins per person? Let me know so I can avoid them! I have never had a fingerprint and photograph take anywhere near that. It is also worth mentioning that these will only routeinely be taken on your first entry.

 

[Richard Scott]

What countries have you been to where biometrics takes 7-10 mins per person? Let me know so I can avoid them! I have never had a fingerprint and photograph take anywhere near that. It is also worth mentioning that these will only routeinely be taken on your first entry.

Turkey do photographs, certainly had to look at a camera when arrived in Istanbul (and when I left Turkey). No fingerprints taken, though.

 

[AlterEgo]

Fair enough. I read your post as trying to support the earlier claim that it is "fake news" that passport checks are causing issues that didn't exist previously.

Oh no, certainly not. As I said upthread, there are still capacity controls at St Pancras which is driving more travel to air and raising fares. That’s a direct consequence of the additional infrastructure and time. (It’s not 7-10 mins, is all!)

 

[DC1989]

Things being pretty much as they were for 90% of the population but slightly worse pretty much sums brexit up

 

[Mojo]

Turkey do photographs, certainly had to look at a camera when arrived in Istanbul (and when I left Turkey). No fingerprints taken, though.

That wasn’t the question I asked though; there are plenty of countries that take fingerprints and or photographs but I have never heard of them taking 7-10 minutes per person!

 

[edwin_m]

What countries have you been to where biometrics takes 7-10 mins per person? Let me know so I can avoid them! I have never had a fingerprint and photograph take anywhere near that. It is also worth mentioning that these will only routeinely be taken on your first entry.

Saudi Arabia. Taken on every entry and exit including second and later entries.

 

[najaB]

That wasn’t the question I asked though; there are plenty of countries that take fingerprints and or photographs but I have never heard of them taking 7-10 minutes per person!

I agree that 7+ minutes on average would be extremely unlikely, but I can definitely believe that as an outlier.

 

[class ep-09]

In reply to anyone spitting feathers about time it takes to check passports - where in my posts I said 7-10min on average per each person ?

I said that person , who I know , travels to EU regularly ( 2-3 times a week) has passport checked (thoroughly most of the times) , for entry and exit stamps that prove he had not stayed more than 90 days in the last 180 days in the EU and it takes 7-10min at times to get that done .
What is so strange about that ?

 

[Richard Scott]

That wasn’t the question I asked though; there are plenty of countries that take fingerprints and or photographs but I have never heard of them taking 7-10 minutes per person!

Oh, OK! Yes, just reread; I really should take more time to read posts!

 

[AlterEgo]

In reply to anyone spitting feathers about time it takes to check passports - where in my posts I said 7-10min on average per each person ?

I said that person , who I know , travels to EU regularly ( 2-3 times a week) has passport checked (thoroughly most of the times) , for entry and exit stamps that prove he had not stayed more than 90 days in the last 180 days in the EU and it takes 7-10min at times to get that done .
What is so strange about that ?

Like I said, I have a passport almost completely full of EU stamps that is sometimes checked, and 7-10 minutes is balderdash. Takes about 1-2 minutes if they need to flick through, and usually they don't bother. In 18 months I have filled a jumbo passport mostly with EU stamps.

Your friend, who I "won't know as they go to a different school", is telling you "porkies". I don't think I have ever even seen a UK passport holder take 7-10 minutes at a booth.

Then you tried to extrapolate the same time for - in your words - "multiply by a large number of passengers". So if anyone has misinterpreted that then it's on you. "Couple of hours' queues are nowhere near normal and I have never ever waited more than maybe 20 minutes, anywhere in the EU, and that's a sample of probably 25-30 entry points since Brexit in maybe a dozen countries. It's invented nonsense which discredits the reality of UK passport holders travelling to the EU - yes, it is a bit less convenient, yes, it can be annoying to justify your stay for 30 seconds to an officer, and yes this is leading to capacity issues - but no, you will not routinely have to wait for "hours" and no, it does not take 7-10 minutes for frequent travellers to prove their stay limits.

Most delays at "all passports" controls in my experience are due to passengers on flights from places which require visas to enter the EU and which require stringent checking and questioning upon entry. Getting stuck behind them can be a pain.

 

[najaB]

I don't think I have ever even seen a UK passport holder take 7-10 minutes at a booth.

I haven't seen a total solar eclipse, so I guess they don't happen.

 

[AlterEgo]

I haven't seen a total solar eclipse, so I guess they don't happen.

Yes, but you’re not responding to a claim they happen all the time either.

 

[najaB]

Yes, but you’re not responding to a claim they happen all the time either.

Good thing that nobody made that claim then.

 

[Richard Scott]

Yes, but you’re not responding to a claim they happen all the time either.

About every 1.5 years one occurs somewhere on the planet, perhaps the frequency of a 7-10 minutes check? Knowing my luck I'll still get in the queue when that one happens, though!!

 

[AlterEgo]

Good thing that nobody made that claim then.

It’s happening to this guy’s friend all the time. And - “Now multiply that by a large number of passengers” to result in hours of waiting.

Hallucinogenic would be the kindest way to describe this kind of story.

It’s just nonsense, and it discredits rational people who are trying to make the point that the controls are having a real economic and political impact even if it doesn’t look spectacular if you only stand in a queue for 5 minutes longer.

 

[najaB]

It’s happening to this guy’s friend all the time.

He didn't say it happens every time. "Often" and "Always" don't mean the same thing.

 

[Cloud Strife]

and 7-10 minutes is balderdash.

I've got dual British and Polish citizenship, but I tend to use my British passport to enter/exit Schengen because I like stamps. I've never been held up for 7-10 minutes, the longest wait so far was on the Hungarian-Romanian border where both sets of border police were checking my passport and the car registration documents, then inserting details manually into the computer. It took around 5 minutes for both controls, and that was only because they'd had some failure. Otherwise, the only place I've even 7-10 minute delays is on the road crossings from PL into BY/UA/RU, and that's simply because of very thorough customs controls which has nothing to do with passport checks.

(on the other hand, 7-10 minutes is nothing abnormal on the BY/UA/RU borders, but that's caused by strange laws regulating the temporary import of vehicles)

I said that person , who I know , travels to EU regularly ( 2-3 times a week) has passport checked (thoroughly most of the times) , for entry and exit stamps that prove he had not stayed more than 90 days in the last 180 days in the EU and it takes 7-10min at times to get that done .

This is not normal on most crossings. Most of the time, they're just looking for an empty space and stamping it. I've been in and out of Schengen about 20 times this summer, and not once did they bother looking at the entries and exits, not least because there were plenty of other stamps there. It's definitely not the norm to be checking passports thoroughly, because UK citizens are low risk.

Actually, the biggest problem I've ever had was in Zurich Airport in the transit hotel. I was transiting through Zurich overnight, and I had a ridiculous 22 hour layover. The logical answer was to use the transit hotel, but coincidentally, a friend was also coming into Zurich that evening, so we sat in the Schengen area with drinks bought from the duty free as everything shuts down there after about 8pm. The exits from the airport are open 24/7, so not a problem there. Unfortunately, the passport control is only open until 23:00, and I'd completely forgotten about the need to go back through.The time came to go to bed, and oops, passport control is shut.

Fortunately, I found a cleaner who took me to some security checkpoint that's open 24/7 for staff, and they phoned through to the Swiss Federal Police who gave permission for me to leave Schengen over the phone, and so they could let me through some doors that led into the non-Schengen area.

 

[ainsworth74]

Some positive Brexit news for once:

The UK is to rejoin the EU's flagship scientific research scheme, Horizon, the government has announced.
UK-based scientists and institutions will be able to apply for money from the £81bn (€95bn) fund from today.
Associate membership had been agreed as part of the Brexit trade deal when the UK formally left the EU in 2020.
However, the UK has been excluded from the scheme for the past three years because of a disagreement over the Northern Ireland Protocol.
Prime Minister Rishi Sunak said: "With a wealth of expertise and experience to bring to the global stage, we have delivered a deal that enables UK scientists to confidently take part in the world's largest research collaboration programme.
"We have worked with our EU partners to make sure that this is the right deal for the UK, unlocking unparalleled research opportunities, and also the right deal for British taxpayers."
Thursday's announcement also states that the UK will associate to Copernicus, the EU's £8bn (€9bn) Earth observation programme. Britain will not, however, be rejoining a nuclear research alliance known as Euratom R&D, although there is an agreement to cooperate specifically on nuclear fusion.
In a press release, the European Commission said that the decision would be "beneficial to both" and stated that "overall, it is estimated that the UK will contribute almost €2.6bn (£2.2bn) per year on average for its participation to both Horizon and Copernicus.

UK rejoins EU science research scheme Horizon

UK-based scientists and institutions will have access to the £85bn fund from today.

www.bbc.co.uk

Of course I hope everyone is ready for similar drip drip drip realignments to bring us back closer to Europe and regain everything we already had because you can settle in for us to re-negotiate our way back to where were bit by bit I'm sure over the next decade or so.