Bradford/Leeds To Bolton Abbey

[Eric]

Just reading in the T&A that the plan first mooted 30 years ago to connect the heritage line with the network line is looking like coming to possible fruition now that the economic benefits have been digested not only from the people who would use such a service but to the freight that would use the line through to Thresfield quarry etc.

The major hurdle that stands between this happening isn't the 40/50 yards to link the two lines as this would be done with relative ease, but the technical integration of the signals proving to be the major cost as these would come under the control of York.

Network Rail and the Yorkshire Dales National Park are backing this.

 

[blackfive460]

This is the reinstatement of the turnout off the Grassington Branch (just in case anyone was thinking it might be about a connection at the other end!). The story is on-line here.

 

[Eric]

This is the reinstatement of the turnout off the Grassington Branch (just in case anyone was thinking it might be about a connection at the other end!). The story is on-line here.

Does anyone on here know how much this signal problem would cost?

 

[43167]

This is the reinstatement of the turnout off the Grassington Branch (just in case anyone was thinking it might be about a connection at the other end!). The story is on-line here.

yes. Lots of houses, shops and schools now stand on much of what was the line between Ilkley and Addingham.

 

[4SRKT]

This would be good news, as I've never actually been on the Embsay line even though I live pretty near it. Lack of connectivity puts me right off. The picture in the T&A shows an industrial saddle tank though, which had better not be running when I go there! Does the line have much in the way of proper locos (especially diesels)?

 

[Vulcan]

There is a class 14 at Embsay, and last time I was there a 20 and 31, but passenger trains are hauled usually by their collection of industrial tank engines.

However, I wouldn't take what the T&A says too seriously.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

their collection of industrial tank engines.

Which are 'proper' engines

 

[4SRKT]

There is a class 14 at Embsay, and last time I was there a 20 and 31, but passenger trains are hauled usually by their collection of industrial tank engines.

However, I wouldn't take what the T&A says too seriously.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---


Which are 'proper' engines

You know what I mean! Don't worry, your collection of weird and wonderfuls down at Kirkstall is fine by me!

 

[43167]

This would be good news, as I've never actually been on the Embsay line even though I live pretty near it. Lack of connectivity puts me right off. The picture in the T&A shows an industrial saddle tank though, which had better not be running when I go there! Does the line have much in the way of proper locos (especially diesels)?

Industrial Saddles are the bulk of the lines steam fleet, though in recent years they have had couple of GWR panniers on hire 1 at a time. On diesels the line is home to 37294, 31119, 31435, 47004 & afew shunters aswell.

 

[Vulcan]

Thinking about it, does a class 14 count as a 'proper' engine? Although they were mainline diesels, they spent more time working in industry.

Over to you 4SRKT!

 

[4SRKT]

Do they use the diesels much? I imagine it's a family oriented set-up, with KWVR taking the lion's share of the serious enthusiast market. Doesn't leave a lot of room for peds and tractors (although they can leave the duff in the shed with the Hunslets and Hudswells as far as I'm concerned!).

 

[John Webb]

Interesting that the Telegraph and Argus talks about trains 'running straight through from Leeds and Bradford' as they'd actually have to reverse at Skipton to get onto the branch.

On the signalling side I understand they are already looking at how they would interface with York from Embsay box.

 

[4SRKT]

Thinking about it, does a class 14 count as a 'proper' engine? Although they were mainline diesels, they spent more time working in industry.

Over to you 4SRKT!

I've never been into hydraulics much myself, and don't consider them as 'proper' as diesel electrics. A hydraulic with six coupled wheels and looking like an overgrown 07 is really pushing things. As you can see I'm a bit of a loco snob!

<waits for hordes of pitchfork-wielding West Country yokels to come into view, irate at someone slagging their beloved hydraulics>

 

[142094]

Interesting that the Telegraph and Argus talks about trains 'running straight through from Leeds and Bradford' as they'd actually have to reverse at Skipton to get onto the branch.

They probably mean running there without terminatign short at Skipton. Doubt if Northern would take this line on, what more than likely would happen is that they could run to Skipton to connect with the mainline without sharing Northern's platforms (as at Keighley).

 

[4SRKT]

Pretty much everything the T&A ever writes is wrong in some way or another.

 

[142094]

The KWVR wanted through trains to Leeds, and seemed to have a good case but at the time I didn't think it would happen and looks as if I was right. Haven't heard any more about it since last year.

 

[4SRKT]

The KWVR wanted through trains to Leeds, and seemed to have a good case but at the time I didn't think it would happen and looks as if I was right. Haven't heard any more about it since last year.

Pathing at Shipley is difficult enough as it is without sending any slow running KWVR trains through there.

 

[142094]

One of the main reasons was that it was judged that the area already had good enough transport provision (buses and not just trains), and anyone who wanted to get the train to Leeds could join at Keighley.

 

[Vulcan]

I'<waits for hordes of pitchfork-wielding West Country yokels to come into view, irate at someone slagging their beloved hydraulics>

I may live in the West Country now, but I am by no means a yokel!

Now, back to my roadkill squirrel sandwich...

 

[Ploughman]

An interchange at Skipton would be possible, as the Rylstone branch runs in on the former Ilkley line platform (4 I Think) however clearances were improved during the 94 remodelling so may need readjusting. The subway would require refurbishment as well.
The only bugbear may be the gradient, meaning either top and tail working or runround north of the road bridge as the stone trains do now.

 

[142094]

It it could not use platform 4 it would have to reverse to use one of the current platforms, and I bet there isn't the pathing to allow that to happen.

 

[blackfive460]

Platform 4 at Skipton is the outer edge of the island platform. The Ilkley platforms were 5 & 6. The single track remains of the Ilkley line goes nearest to Platform 5 but, I think, not quite near enough for it to be used by passenger trains. Try this Google Street view.

 

[bluenoxid]

I don't know if it (Platform 5) has changed much but it is lit and the subway is still in existence.

Any trains would be likely to run by the Embsay Steam Railway when the branch is closed. The issue would be the installation of some form of signalling system. It would have to be changed from one train on branch system to a system that makes the junction-Rhylstone one train working from the junction and a token system where the Embsay box and the York box have access to the line but only one train at the time.

I would expect that it would require cables to be laid upto Embsay

 

[142094]

Platform 4 at Skipton is the outer edge of the island platform. The Ilkley platforms were 5 & 6. The single track remains of the Ilkley line goes nearest to Platform 5 but, I think, not quite near enough for it to be used by passenger trains. Try this Google Street view.

That's me getting mixed up, apologies.

 

[Ploughman]

I don't know if it (Platform 5) has changed much but it is lit and the subway is still in existence.

The issue would be the installation of some form of signalling system. It would have to be changed from one train on branch system to a system that makes the junction-Rhylstone one train working from the junction and a token system where the Embsay box and the York box have access to the line but only one train at the time.

I would expect that it would require cables to be laid upto Embsay

After working on the remodelling at Skipton way back. As far as I can remember the S+T cabling goes out of Skipton towards Rhylstone only as far as the protecting signal for the junction approx at the East end of the old platforms.
Any new connection would require cabling etc provided upto and beyond Embsay Jcn probably clear of Brackenley Lane bridge. As wellas connections onto the Steam railway towards Embsay itself.
It may have implications to the current use of the Embsay - Embsay Jcn stretch as a run round during the normal end to end run.

 

[John Webb]

Would cables be required? Possibly Optic Fibre or even a radio link as the distance to be bridged isn't enormous. I assume the current system is 'One engine in steam' - or do the stone trains pick up a staff from Skipton Station?

 

[sprinterguy]

This sounds like an excellent opportunity for the Embsay and Bolton Abbey to raise their profile and make the line more accessible for a greater number of visitors. It would be great to see the Embsay and Bolton Abbey able to interchange directly with Northern rail services at Skipton. I see no reason why the old Ilkley platforms 5 and 6 couldn't be renovated to act as a perfect terminus for the steam railway. I wish the line the best of luck in completing this link!

And 4SRKT, in my opinion industrial saddle tanks are the "properest" of locomotives I really must go and have a look at the Embsay and Bolton Abbey railway sometime, it's one I've yet to visit.

 

[4SRKT]

And 4SRKT, in my opinion industrial saddle tanks are the "properest" of locomotives I really must go and have a look at the Embsay and Bolton Abbey railway sometime, it's one I've yet to visit.

They do what looks like an excellent diesel gala that I've not managed to do yet despite living so close. It's pretty cheap and includes a barbecue and beer-ex. Great if you like 31s! They put on a 'heritage bus' (presumably from the Keighley Bus Museum) to get the drinkers back to Skipton station afterwards

 

[Eric]

On page five in todays T&A it says that only 20 yards of track with signalling would reconnect Embsay & Bolton with the mainline network.

The cost of this scheme has been put at £2 million by transport planner JMP after they have carried out the feasibility study with up to £2.9 million of employment benefits during construction.

JMP have considered using DMU's from Skipton to Embsay & Bolton and have found that even with a 50% increase in estimated costs or a 50% reduction in additional demand, each of the scenarios would still cover the operating costs.

 

[Ploughman]

Also in Yorkshire Post
http://www.yorkshirepost.co.uk/news/Twenty-yards-of-rail-track.6667005.jp

 

[tbtc]

On page five in todays T&A it says that only 20 yards of track with signalling would reconnect Embsay & Bolton with the mainline network.

The cost of this scheme has been put at £2 million by transport planner JMP

20 yards for only £2,000,000?

Bargain :roll: