Borders Railway - Now Open

[reb0118]

Will the new terminus of the Borders Railway still count as in the central belt of Scotland? I am just curious if and how far south the Central Scotland Rover will be valid for travel.

Good question. My guess would be:-

1) No extra validity,
2) Extended to Gorebridge, or
3) Extened to Tweedbank.

In that order. Midlothian is traditional Central Belt territory but the Borders is classified as South of Scotland.

 

[Rick1984]

where will the steam trains terminate in the North? What's to stop regular users getting on a steam train instead of their usual multiple unit?

 

[jopsuk]

I'd imagine that the service would run to Edinburgh. It's unlikely to be operated as a "Scotrail" service so standard tickets are unlikely to be valid, as with all other regular steam charters.

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

where will the steam trains terminate in the North? What's to stop regular users getting on a steam train instead of there usual multiple unit?

Call me a spoilsport if you will, but are there not other established routes for steam hauled excursion trains in Scotland that will not impinge upon the operation of a newly reopened railway line ?

 

[dcsprior]

Call me a spoilsport if you will, but are there not other established routes for steam hauled excursion trains in Scotland that will not impinge upon the operation of a newly reopened railway line ?

Call me an optimist if you will, but are there not other established routes for steam hauled excursion trains in Scotland that demonstrate how such a service can run alongside regular scheduled trains and bring tourism benefits to the area...

 

[DaveNewcastle]

. . . . . Midlothian is traditional Central Belt territory but the Borders is classified as South of Scotland.

Hah!

I'd say the Borders has normally been completely disregarded in terms of any classifications. By way of an example, I believe it is the only administrative region of the UK which doesn't have any railway stations at all (though it does have the ECML passing through it).

So to answer thealexweb's question about Rover validity, I'd expect that no one has given the question the consideration it deserves!

 

[Railsigns]

I'd say the Borders has normally been completely disregarded in terms of any classifications. By way of an example, I believe it is the only administrative region of the UK which doesn't have any railway stations at all (though it does have the ECML passing through it).

It isn't, although it may be the only administrative region on mainland Great Britain without any railway stations.

 

[dcsprior]

Hah!

I'd say the Borders has normally been completely disregarded in terms of any classifications. By way of an example, I believe it is the only administrative region of the UK which doesn't have any railway stations at all (though it does have the ECML passing through it).

So to answer thealexweb's question about Rover validity, I'd expect that no one has given the question the consideration it deserves!

When I grew up in Clackmannanshire, there were no railway stations there.

Did Alloa reopen before or after this Rover was launched? If it reopened when the product already existed, then presumably the process of deciding whether an area should be counted as 'Central Scotland' has been gone through at least once before.

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

Call me an optimist if you will, but are there not other established routes for steam hauled excursion trains in Scotland that demonstrate how such a service can run alongside regular scheduled trains and bring tourism benefits to the area...

Perhaps I may have mis-heard a comment being passed that any such steam-hauled operation would indeed cause a disruption to this soon-to-be introduced service with possible service cancellations. Your posting now reassures me that this will NOT occur.

 

[Altnabreac]

It isn't, although it may be the only administrative region on mainland Great Britain without any railway stations.

What everyone forgets is that there are currently 2 mainland GB top level local authorities without railway stations. Midlothian is of course the second one being reconnected by this project.

Technically I believe that Dudley may be a third as the only station is actually in Sandwell.

 

[IanXC]

What everyone forgets is that there are currently 2 mainland GB top level local authorities without railway stations. Midlothian is of course the second one being reconnected by this project.

Technically I believe that Dudley may be a third as the only station is actually in Sandwell.

Sandwell and Dudley station is indeed in Sandwell Metropolitan District, however Stourbridge Town, Stourbridge Junction, Lye and Coseley are all within the boundaries of Dudley Metropolitan District.

 

[Altnabreac]

Sandwell and Dudley station is indeed in Sandwell Metropolitan District, however Stourbridge Town, Stourbridge Junction, Lye and Coseley are all within the boundaries of Dudley Metropolitan District.

Well that does only leave Midlothian and Scottish Borders without stations until next year.

 

[Chris125]

Perhaps I may have mis-heard a comment being passed that any such steam-hauled operation would indeed cause a disruption to this soon-to-be introduced service with possible service cancellations. Your posting now reassures me that this will NOT occur.

Replacing a few off-peak services with charters is hardly the end of the world, the tourism benefits should easily outweigh any 'disruption'.

Chris

 

[billio]

What everyone forgets is that there are currently 2 mainland GB top level local authorities without railway stations. Midlothian is of course the second one being reconnected by this project.

Technically I believe that Dudley may be a third as the only station is actually in Sandwell.

Oldham and Bury do not have mainline railway stations, though they have trams.

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

Oldham and Bury do not have mainline railway stations, though they have trams.

Greenfield has a heavy-rail railway station and is part of the Oldham Metropolitan Borough.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

Replacing a few off-peak services with charters is hardly the end of the world, the tourism benefits should easily outweigh any 'disruption'.

Chris

Would this be acceptable in other parts of Britain, where the local users of the off-peak services so displaced would feel somewhat second-rate citizens. Are you sure that these locally affected people would happily give up their displaced services with a smile in the knowledge that the tourists were viewed as more important. ?

 

[Altnabreac]

Oldham and Bury do not have mainline railway stations, though they have trams.

Bury, North Tyneside and South Tyneside are the 3 authorities with Light Rail only but no National Rail station. As Paul says Oldham isn't on the list as Greenfield sneaks into the borough.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

Would this be acceptable in other parts of Britain, where the local users of the off-peak services so displaced would feel somewhat second-rate citizens. Are you sure that these locally affected people would happily give up their displaced services with a smile in the knowledge that the tourists were viewed as more important. ?

Tourism is an important part of the Borders economy and the new line is seen as a great opportunity to expand that offering both through conventional and steam excursion services.

I suspect it will be viewed fairly benignly in the area as many people in the Borders will know someone working in a tourist related job. The reaction in other less tourist related areas might vary but I'd have thought places like seaside resort towns for example would have an equally understanding view of such a service.

 

[PaxVobiscum]

Track work at Sherrifhall beginning to take shape now.

 

[Tobbes]

An optimistic question: given the works, how hard would it be to double the Borders Railway idc? I can see it being rather more successful than has been modelled, esp. in light of Alloa. Sorry if this has been answered before.

 

[fegguk]

An optimistic question: given the works, how hard would it be to double the Borders Railway idc? I can see it being rather more successful than has been modelled, esp. in light of Alloa. Sorry if this has been answered before.

Very hard (expensive)

Many new bridges under and over the line are single track. No consideration has been given to future doubling south of Tynehead. There are 4 new over bridges on the single track section between there a stow alone plus numerous under bridges. Its a similar story though Galashiels.

On the plus side platforms for 6 car trains have been provided, such trains if required should meet any likely demand south of Gorebridge. there has been passive provision for 4TPH north of Gorebridge, though I a have never seen an explanation for what exactly this means in terms of what they are building and what else would be required to achieve 4THP.

 

[Chris125]

Are you sure that these locally affected people would happily give up their displaced services with a smile in the knowledge that the tourists were viewed as more important. ?

I'm quite sure that failing to capitalise on the tourist potential of the line will negatively affect far more people than the loss of a few off-peak services - as compromises go this is a pretty minor one.

Chris

 

[oldman]

We are only talking, apart from the grand opening, about a feasability study announced for political reasons, and it may never happen. The First Minister has also talked glowingly about reopening to Carlisle, which may also never happen. A feasability study might conclude that the tourist market would be better served by ensuring that people arriving on service trains can get somewhere interesting (Melrose, Abbotsford) when they reach Tweedbank. Or it might come up with a solution to the problem of interrupting the half-hourly Midlothian service, which is where most of the passengers are likely to be, and where the interest in Borders tourism is limited.

 

[jopsuk]

in the reality check: isn't the proposal for one, return, service a week on a Saturday? Losing a single, Saturday, "normal" return service?

 

[najaB]

...isn't the proposal for one, return, service a week on a Saturday...

That's one proposal, others have proposed multiple services (three or more) per week.

 

[92002]

An optimistic question: given the works, how hard would it be to double the Borders Railway idc? I can see it being rather more successful than has been modelled, esp. in light of Alloa. Sorry if this has been answered before.

Any additional capacity would need to be by providing more loops.

Many new structures have build for a single line and would be expensive to alter.The current line will allow for 4 trains an hour, with 2 turning short of the end of the line. This probably will be more than enough capacity for growth.

 

[HarleyDavidson]

I guess you'll just have to wait until the line is open and the service has bedded in to see how things go and whether tthey have made a huge fudge of it, by underestimating patronage or whether the initial service levels will be more than adequate.

If Edinburgh ever introduces a congestion charge, patronage will go through the roof.

 

[matchmaker]

If Edinburgh ever introduces a congestion charge, patronage will go through the roof.

Edinburgh doesn't need a congestion charge - it's already the most motorist-unfriendly city I know!

 

[Photohunter71]

Just been up to Millerhill,what's happening at the farm steading there? I have noticed a new access road which if I can add 2+2,it goes over the Waverley route into the railway depot itself,is that part of the proposed EMU depot?

 

[fegguk]

Just been up to Millerhill,what's happening at the farm steading there? I have noticed a new access road which if I can add 2+2,it goes over the Waverley route into the railway depot itself,is that part of the proposed EMU depot?

Its there to access a recycling depot being built near the depot site

 

[railjock]

Shawfair earlier today.

 

[Photohunter71]

Its there to access a recycling depot being built near the depot site

Ahh,thanks! I had thought the access road would be via the old colliery road and that the waste depot would be constructed on where the wee bing stands just now. Hope they will still move waste and the fuel by rail from and to there in the future.