Booked train only hypothetical

[greaterangrier]

Soon, I will be going on a journey from Colchester to Sheffield, on Advances which have a counted place reservation on the Thameslink portion from Farrington to St Pancras International.

Looking at the journey history of that train on recenttraintimes has revealed quite bad performance.

If this Thameslink train is late, what should I do officially and in practice?

Note: The itinerary has me changing at Stratford (XR) and Farringdon (TL)

 

[transportphoto]

Farringdon to St Pancras - realistically you’ll be absolutely fine. Get on the first available.

If your booked connection is late, and you miss the intercity as a result, get the next available EMR to Sheffield to complete your journey. Your ticket is valid on the next available train if the railway has disrupted your journey.

Likewise if your Colchester to Stratford, or Elizabeth Line, is disrupted - get the next available Intercity from St Pancras.

 

[greaterangrier]

Farringdon to St Pancras - realistically you’ll be absolutely fine. Get on the first available.

If your booked connection is late, and you miss the intercity as a result, get the next available EMR to Sheffield to complete your journey. Your ticket is valid on the next available train if the railway has disrupted your journey.

Likewise if your Colchester to Stratford, or Elizabeth Line, is disrupted - get the next available Intercity from St Pancras.

I will do this on the day if anything happens.

The reason I asked this question is because I expected the answer to me "yes, take the first train"; nobody would notice for a short 2 minute journey anyway... however, is the answer technically that you have to wait for this train unless you will be over 60 minutes late/cancelled by which point you gain the ability to be rerouted?

Theoretically (and will not attempt) would you be entitled/expected to delay yourself waiting for your booked Thameslink, gaining delay compensation in the process? This is nonsensical for a 22tph core section.

 

[yorkie]

I will do this on the day if anything happens.

The reason I asked this question is because I expected the answer to me "yes, take the first train"; nobody would notice for a short 2 minute journey anyway... however, is the answer technically that you have to wait for this train unless you will be over 60 minutes late/cancelled by which point you gain the ability to be rerouted?

Theoretically (and will not attempt) would you be entitled/expected to delay yourself waiting for your booked Thameslink, gaining delay compensation in the process? This is nonsensical for a 22tph core section.

Before GTR made Thameslink trains "reserveable" for the purpose of "counted places", it was absolutely unambiguous that you would take any available train.

However, GTR have muddied the waters; this could be avoided if only Rail Delivery Group would formally say that the "connections" can be used on any "appropriate" service regardless of reservations, but I doubt they will do that.

You could ask GTR to see what they say, but I doubt you'd get a good answer.

However it's a completely moot point because almost no-one ever checks tickets on these trains, and even if they did, it would be the absolute pinaccle of "jobsworthiness" for anyone to claim that you couldn't take the first available train.

Next time, if you want to avoid any potential for any ambiguity, you could specify avoiding Thameslink when you book, which would give you an itinerary on London Underground from Farringdon to King's Cross St Pancras, but if it was me, I really wouldn't worry about getting on the first train that pulls in.

Tip: the escalators from Farringdon (Crossrail) platforms are near the front of the train, in the westbound direction, and the escalators take you to the northbound Thameslink platforms; it's a much easier interchange to make than the other direction. You then want to be relatively near the front at St Pancras (maybe about 3 coaches back?) for a speedy exit.

If you ever want more interchange time, e.g. if your arrival time is critical, you can specify additional interchange time at your desired location.

 

[Haywain]

Theoretically (and will not attempt) would you be entitled/expected to delay yourself waiting for your booked Thameslink,

No, Thameslink do not insist on you travelling on the booked train when the journey on their services is an "and connections" element of your overall journey.

 

[Hadders]

GTR are actually very sensible when it comes to this sort of thing. Internal Guidance says:

Where a journey involves using a Gatwick Express, Great Northern, Southern or Thameslink as a connection into a different operators service (not a different Gatwick Express, Great Northern, Southern or Thameslink service). For example Advance Tickets routed “AP SLOUGH”, or “AWC & Connections”, the passenger can use any Gatwick Express, Great Northern, Southern or Thameslink service to complete their journey, even though retail systems will force a reservation to be made.

In reality, if your train into Liverpool Street is on time you'll probably be able to get an earlier Thameslink service from Farringdon giving you a longer connection at St Pancras. Of course, if the train is late causing you to miss your booked train you are entitled to take the next train anyway.

 

[Deerfold]

GTR are actually very sensible when it comes to this sort of thing. Internal Guidance says:

They could be more sensible by making this information publicly available.

 

[redreni]

They could be more sensible by making this information publicly available.

What an absurd suggestion!

That would involve thinking that if your customers don't know something (because you haven't told them and you haven't included it in any publicly available guidance or information and because you have set a misleading and false compulsory reservation flag) and this causes them stress and inconvenience, it might matter.

You wouldn't get very far in the rail industry with that attitude!