Bob Crow announces yet another rail strike

[northwichcat]

Staff at Arriva Trains Wales will stage a 24-hour walk-out in a dispute over pay and conditions.

The planned action will take place on 27 December and is expected to hit travellers returning from their Christmas holidays.

The Rail and Maritime (RMT) union said action was necessary to force a rethink on a "de facto" pay cut by management.

Arriva Trains Wales (ATW) previously said it was "surprised and disappointed".

General Secretary Bob Crow said the work/life balance of drivers was not being considered.

The move threatens fresh disruption to passengers following the recent wintry conditions.

Staff at Arriva will walk out for a total of 24 hours after voting in favour of industrial action.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-12049823

 

[Greenback]

ATW drivers suspended their industrial action last month to allow for further negotiation. Clearly these negotiations have been unsuccessful in settling an ongoing dispute.

 

[northwichcat]

I wonder if it's been done to coincide with the Northern strike for maximum disruption. Both operators provide services between Chester and Manchester, Warrington and Manchester and Crewe and Manchester

 

[Clip]

It said the RMT had chosen to ballot for action "based on a previous pay offer which has since been superseded by a significantly improved offer

So he has asked for an improvement on the previous offer - got one and still wants to take them out? Anyone got more details on what the offers were then and now?

Its a good way of getting the public on the railways side after the last few weeks of disruption

 

[Greenback]

Both sides will make statements that are not necessairly 100% accurate. I doubt that the actual details of any offer will be known to many outside of the unions negotiating team and senior ATW management.

 

[Clip]

Both sides will make statements that are not necessairly 100% accurate. I doubt that the actual details of any offer will be known to many outside of the unions negotiating team and senior ATW management.

aye true but someone on here must know.. Though given the thread about northern rail ill doubt we'll get the full picture.

 

[Greenback]

So do I. The rumour mill is notoriously unreliable on the railway, and never more so than when strikes and/or pay offers are involved!

 

[313103]

So do I. The rumour mill is notoriously unreliable on the railway, and never more so than when strikes and/or pay offers are involved!

Or when people have already made their mind up no matter what the facts are, like some on here no doubt!

 

[Greenback]

Never let the facts get in the way of a good opinion!

 

[ANorthernGuard]

Never let the facts get in the way of a good opinion!

My Opinion is!!!!!!!!!!

as I haven't got a clue why ATW are striking i'm not in a position to make one lol

 

[cav1975]

The winner, as usual, will be the car industry.

 

[tbtc]

The winner, as usual, will be the car industry.

Agreed

 

[Geezertronic]

Well don't say that Bob never gives the public anything for Christmas

To be honest, I'm a bit non plussed about strikes and what they achieve, mainly because I work in the Private Sector and have never been on strike (and never considered it either)

 

[ANorthernGuard]

Well don't say that Bob never gives the public anything for Christmas

To be honest, I'm a bit non plussed about strikes and what they achieve, mainly because I work in the Private Sector and have never been on strike (and never considered it either)

Railway and Strikes used to be alot more frequent then they are now, but like a late/cancelled train they are always remembered

 

[313103]

To be honest, I'm a bit non plussed about strikes and what they achieve, mainly because I work in the Private Sector and have never been on strike (and never considered it either)

That could be down to you having a harmonious Boss that looks after you. I work in the private sector as well, but my boss probabbly isnt as forgiven as yours.

Tell you something though after a strike i know which colleagues i can trust and call upon in the future. Those that decide to work, well that is up to them but dont expect me to look after them when something goes wrong.

 

[radamfi]

Presumably with massive increase in wages in recent years, the rail industry must be attracting a lot more people with well educated backgrounds, and therefore becoming more middle class. Has that had an effect of the desire for strikes within the workforce?

 

[1VWC]

Tell you something though after a strike i know which colleagues i can trust and call upon in the future. Those that decide to work, well that is up to them but dont expect me to look after them when something goes wrong.

...and why is that exactly?

Because they are less competent in doing their job?
Because they are spreading vicious rumours about colleagues behind their backs?
Because they are defrauding the company?

No, simply because they do not have the same beliefs as you.

That's what really gets to me about working on the railway, just because people choose not to be a member of a union, their colleagues see fit to treat them as an outcast. Would it be the acceptable to treat someone differently based on their religious beliefs? No, so why should it be for not being a member of the union.

 

[The Barlow Boy]

Bob Crow and the shadowy people behind him live in a different world. He dreams of a Marxist theorist utopia where everyone will be happy living in state collectives. He doesn't understand the real world. He lives in theory world. The world that he yearns for with it's associated political system simply doesn't work. East Germany? Cuba? Soviet Union? Romania? Albania? Just remind me again what happened to those Marxist utopias.
There's always North Korea of course, that's popular and so accomodating for it's people who live happy carefree lives.

 

[GB]

...and why is that exactly?

Because they are less competent in doing their job?
Because they are spreading vicious rumours about colleagues behind their backs?
Because they are defrauding the company?

No, simply because they do not have the same beliefs as you.

That's what really gets to me about working on the railway, just because people choose not to be a member of a union, their colleagues see fit to treat them as an outcast. Would it be the acceptable to treat someone differently based on their religious beliefs? No, so why should it be for not being a member of the union.

I could be wrong, but I believe he was refering to union "scabs" rather than colleagues that are not in a union.

 

[ANorthernGuard]

Bob Crow and the shadowy people behind him live in a different world. He dreams of a Marxist theorist utopia where everyone will be happy living in state collectives. He doesn't understand the real world. He lives in theory world. The world that he yearns for with it's associated political system simply doesn't work. East Germany? Cuba? Soviet Union? Romania? Albania? Just remind me again what happened to those Marxist utopias.
There's always North Korea of course, that's popular and so accomodating for it's people who live happy carefree lives.

He fights for his beliefs, maybe if more people did that. This country would not be in the pitiful position it is now.

 

[junglejames]

Yes he may fight for his beliefs, but this is not always the way to go about it.
We are turning into another France, and its worrying. Bob Crow is being an idiot, and is not thinking sensibly.

 

[ANorthernGuard]

Yes he may fight for his beliefs, but this is not always the way to go about it.
We are turning into another France, and its worrying. Bob Crow is being an idiot, and is not thinking sensibly.

It may not always be the right way to go about things, but he is right a heck of alot more times than he is wrong, last year the s*n tried saying he had a £££ company car etc etc when he only takes public transport, the s*n ADMITTED they were wrong and paid a sum to charity, shame they cant put that on their front page lol

 

[Geezertronic]

That could be down to you having a harmonious Boss that looks after you. I work in the private sector as well, but my boss probabbly isnt as forgiven as yours

You've never met my boss then

 

[ralphchadkirk]

It may not always be the right way to go about things, but he is right a heck of alot more times than he is wrong, last year the s*n tried saying he had a £££ company car etc etc when he only takes public transport, the s*n ADMITTED they were wrong and paid a sum to charity, shame they cant put that on their front page lol

Really, because when I met him he had his driver with him. Could have been his personal train driver I suppose

 

[ANorthernGuard]

Really, because when I met him he had his driver with him. Could have been his personal train driver I suppose

My apologies, I mean for normal commuting etc. my bad

 

[313103]

...and why is that exactly?

Because they are less competent in doing their job?
Because they are spreading vicious rumours about colleagues behind their backs?
Because they are defrauding the company?

No, simply because they do not have the same beliefs as you.

Actually i was talking about union members who do not support the unions action rather then non union members (and i will address that at the bottom of this message. Factually it is because these kind of people will slag the union down, say it has done nothing for them (despite 90% of the population wishing they had similar agreements), when the union asks them for support they go and (four letter word that upsets some people so i wont mention it).
As a member they are entitled by law representation, as a rep i can decline to represent said member and get someone from head office to do it.

With regard the issue of non members, well that is another story. If they get into trouble it is not for me to help them (how would that look to someone who pays contributions to get the same thing?). Why should they also get the same terms and conditions as those that have sacrificed in getting them?
You say these people shouldn't be treated any differently, so why does the law support these people more then they would me? Trade union reform law protects those that choose not to strike then those that do! Surely the law should treat everyone equal!

With regard the vicious rumour remark, i have been victim to this on more then one occasion, i had to just get on with it and prove the rumours wrong.
These people are not treated by me any differently, i just tell them and everyone how it is, if they don't like it that is there problem.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

I could be wrong, but I believe he was refering to union "scabs" rather than colleagues that are not in a union.

Thanks GB my point.

 

[Clip]

Actually i was talking about union members who do not support the unions action rather then non union members (and i will address that at the bottom of this message. Factually it is because these kind of people will slag the union down, say it has done nothing for them (despite 90% of the population wishing they had similar agreements), when the union asks them for support they go and (four letter word that upsets some people so i wont mention it).
As a member they are entitled by law representation, as a rep i can decline to represent said member and get someone from head office to do it.

With regard the issue of non members, well that is another story. If they get into trouble it is not for me to help them (how would that look to someone who pays contributions to get the same thing?). Why should they also get the same terms and conditions as those that have sacrificed in getting them?
You say these people shouldn't be treated any differently, so why does the law support these people more then they would me? Trade union reform law protects those that choose not to strike then those that do! Surely the law should treat everyone equal!

Dont contradict yourself. You want everyone to be equal yet you clearly state above that you dont think that people who are non union should get the same pay rise as you just because you went out on strike?

 

[313103]

message too short

Your absolutely right Clip, However I don't think i have contradicted myself, if i belong to a union that negotiates on my behalf, why then should those that don't belong to a union benefit?

They indeed should negotiate their own T&Cs then if they get a better deal it might encourage people to leave the unions and do their own T&Cs therefore everyone will be equal. That would mean you have got your workforce right where you want them and with a broom attached to their appendage to boot.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

You've never met my boss then

I would probably prefer him to the one i have now

 

[The Barlow Boy]

He fights for his beliefs, maybe if more people did that. This country would not be in the pitiful position it is now.

And his beliefs are those that I've listed. He doesn't/won't/can't see what is happening in the real world.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

It may not always be the right way to go about things, but he is right a heck of alot more times than he is wrong, last year the s*n tried saying he had a £££ company car etc etc when he only takes public transport, the s*n ADMITTED they were wrong and paid a sum to charity, shame they cant put that on their front page lol

But of course union leaders never, ever, distort the truth.

 

[313103]

And his beliefs are those that I've listed. He doesn't/won't/can't see what is happening in the real world.

Well as the power of all knowledge Barlow Boy what is happening in the real world?