Blue Pullman Returns

[Domh245]

So far as I'm aware there have been no cases so far of older trains being retro-fitted - all those without yellow fronts have been built within the past few years.

TPE's 185s have had their lights converted to be compliant with the latest specifications, although they do retain the yellow front for now.

 

[ainsworth74]

Let's not get too sidetracked into lights please. We've definetly discussed this at length on the Forum before!

 

[jamesnotts86]

Is there any indication of what they plan to do to the interiors? They would be fine for charter use, but as this is obviously intended as a premium service I would assume new seat covers, carpets and curtains at least?

This looks like a good venture and wish them every success with it. I'd be interested in travelling on it, but if I paid that price for the Pullman Dining experience and arrived to see the remnants of former TOCs interiors I'd be wanting a discount! I really hope they make something special out of it and not just recover original seats and hope to get away with it. The GWR first class refurb and what they have done with the Night Riviera stock looks amazing so just shows the potential of what can be done with older stock to give an 'old' train a premium modern feel.

The images show a Mk1 interior which obviously won't be the case, but it must take a lot of work to make it 'feel' like the original surely? (by original I mean Pullman-esque rather than HST). Doesn't seem like much of a turnaround time to completely refit a HST into a Pullman experience?

 

[37424]

I don't like the false history myself but if they can get away with it then good look to them, after all the Statesman has been running for sometime with Standard MK2's disguised as Pullman carriages.

The way its worded on the Statesman Website perhaps suggests it may only be for a limited period and not permanent. I would suggest that any refurb will be limited to new carpets and maybe a retrim of the seats, and maybe some wood paneling on the vestibule ends if they are pushing the boat out but we will see.

Are they using all 1st class Carriages? the booking form would seem to suggest so as its only shows 1st class and Pullman and talks about tables for 2 in both.

 

[whoosh]

Lots of negativity, I think it’s beautiful, and I’ll be over the moon to see this run.

At last!

Had to go almost all the way through the first page of posts to find a good positive attitude.
I think it's an awesome idea.

 

[Why]

At last!

Had to go almost all the way through the first page of posts to find a good positive attitude.
I think it's an awesome idea.

Argee 100%

 

[zn1]

Get the Paint job right, the correct blue shade, get rid of the yellow on the front and replace with the Blue Pullman logo with white window surround, The seating, and service right...could be a winner...The Pullmans Back at PADd, Pancras EUS on round trips...id certainly pay for a Trip...An HST, at seat service, Jack daniels on tap...and a scenic rail journey....pick up at the Keynes would be preferable though

 

[Killingworth]

I don't like the false history myself but if they can get away with it then good look to them, after all the Statesman has been running for sometime with Standard MK2's disguised as Pullman carriages.

The way its worded on the Statesman Website perhaps suggests it may only be for a limited period and not permanent. I would suggest that any refurb will be limited to new carpets and maybe a retrim of the seats, and maybe some wood paneling on the vestibule ends if they are pushing the boat out but we will see.

Are they using all 1st class Carriages? the booking form would seem to suggest so as its only shows 1st class and Pullman and talks about tables for 2 in both.

The stong implication from their website is that they are being refurbished for the long term, although not in quite the same style as their Mk 2 carriages.

 

[37424]

The stong implication from their website is that they are being refurbished for the long term, although not in quite the same style as their Mk 2 carriages.

I'm sure they are whether the Blue Pullman theme is long term I guess we will see. Personally If I wanted a full Pullman experience I would want to go on proper Pullman carriages not tarted up MK2's and Mk3's.

 

[edwin_m]

I'm sure they are whether the Blue Pullman theme is long term I guess we will see. Personally If I wanted a full Pullman experience I would want to go on proper Pullman carriages not tarted up MK2's and Mk3's.

Today's generation of affluent oldies who probably form the target market for this type of train will remember the 50s and 60s, and those traditional Pullmans that were still around at that time probably weren't the best advert for rail travel! So I'd expect something perhaps not far off how the original BP interior was fitted out, reminiscent of the early James Bond films. But probably minus the trap doors and the pools of sharks, as they'd be a bit difficult to fit within the British loading gauge.

 

[BrianW]

I'm sure they are whether the Blue Pullman theme is long term I guess we will see. Personally If I wanted a full Pullman experience I would want to go on proper Pullman carriages not tarted up MK2's and Mk3's.

I guess it doesn't matter that much what we personally like or want but whether the train fills and pays its way- a bit like the 'normal' railway. I liked the look of the 'original Blue Pullman; I never rode it. It'll be the same for this one.
I'll look forward to seeing pictures of it in action; same now as then.

 

[Llanigraham]

I just hope they run this Cardiff - Paddington as well; I might even be willing to put my hand in my pocket if they did.
And I'd raise a glass to my late Dad who used to occasionally use it to go up to London for meetings when his firm were paying. Used to reckon they did an excellent breakfast.

 

[DB]

This looks like a good venture and wish them every success with it. I'd be interested in travelling on it, but if I paid that price for the Pullman Dining experience and arrived to see the remnants of former TOCs interiors I'd be wanting a discount! I really hope they make something special out of it and not just recover original seats and hope to get away with it. The GWR first class refurb and what they have done with the Night Riviera stock looks amazing so just shows the potential of what can be done with older stock to give an 'old' train a premium modern feel.

The images show a Mk1 interior which obviously won't be the case, but it must take a lot of work to make it 'feel' like the original surely? (by original I mean Pullman-esque rather than HST). Doesn't seem like much of a turnaround time to completely refit a HST into a Pullman experience?

These are all ex-GWR carriages, all first class (except one, which might well have a first class interior put into it). I suspect they probably will retain the majority of the interior, with new seat covers, carpets, etc, but time will tell.

The pictures of the Mk2s linked to above shows this approach - they are ordinary first class Mk2f interiors, including the seats, with new covers, carpets, etc.

 

[DarloRich]

I think it is a really good idea - high class travel and dining for discerning customers. If it is like Statesman it will be a good service.

 

[kermit]

Get the Paint job right, the correct blue shade, get rid of the yellow on the front and replace with the Blue Pullman logo with white window surround, The seating, and service right...could be a winner...The Pullmans Back at PADd, Pancras EUS on round trips...id certainly pay for a Trip...An HST, at seat service, Jack daniels on tap...and a scenic rail journey....pick up at the Keynes would be preferable though

I was with you all the way until you got to the Jack Daniels! Chivas 21yr old Royal Salute, as found at many strategic points on the Royal Yacht, perhaps!

 

[37424]

There was a MK2 set painted in Blue Pullman livery a few years ago I don't know whether that still exists or its been repainted since then

Real Blue Pullman rather than the imposter

 

[DB]

There was a MK2 set painted in Blue Pullman livery a few years ago I don't know whether that still exists or its been repainted since then

Real Blue Pullman rather than the imposter

No, it's not still in use, although one coach (a standard class one) ended up at the NRM and last time I was there is was still in that livery.

 

[Cowley]

No, it's not still in use, although one coach (a standard class one) ended up at the NRM and last time I was there is was still in that livery.

There are a few on the Dartmoor Railway. I travelled on them a last year, they were also used on their Polar Express.

 

[TheBeard]

A HST will look lovely in the Classic Blue Pillman livery. The only real link is the general type of unit, or the reverse blue grey applied to it. But personally looked forward to this happening for years. Don't think even Hoskins has got enough cash to rebuild a whole Blue Pullman set, though if he does will permanently loan him an engine!

 

[talltim]

I like the concept too, and I think the livery works well, with the exception that the white around the cab windows looks awkward because of the shape/positioning of the windscreen/ side windows. I love the idea of a modern interpretation of the 60s interiors but I suspect it will be a bit watered down

 

[RT4038]

Today's generation of affluent oldies who probably form the target market for this type of train will remember the 50s and 60s, and those traditional Pullmans that were still around at that time probably weren't the best advert for rail travel! So I'd expect something perhaps not far off how the original BP interior was fitted out, reminiscent of the early James Bond films. But probably minus the trap doors and the pools of sharks, as they'd be a bit difficult to fit within the British loading gauge.

I suspect that today's generation of affluent oldies who probably form the target market may remember seeing Pullmans, possibly even the Blue Pullman (but most likely only on posters or in spotting books/ magazines or BT films). Highly unlikely to have ever travelled on one, except possibly the Brighton Belle! These were premium fare trains, not used by ordinary people going on their holidays or excursion trains which were the main mode of long distance travel by children in those days. Bit like First or Business Class in a long distance plane nowadays. This train will capture their imagination of the fabled train of the past, outwardly similar that it is.

As for the enthusiasts - run the train on unusual routes for 125s and they will travel on it too. I bet many would pay good money for a trip on the non authentic livery yellow painted Network Rail train.

 

[edwin_m]

I suspect that today's generation of affluent oldies who probably form the target market may remember seeing Pullmans, possibly even the Blue Pullman (but most likely only on posters or in spotting books/ magazines or BT films). Highly unlikely to have ever travelled on one, except possibly the Brighton Belle! These were premium fare trains, not used by ordinary people going on their holidays or excursion trains which were the main mode of long distance travel by children in those days. Bit like First or Business Class in a long distance plane nowadays. This train will capture their imagination of the fabled train of the past, outwardly similar that it is.

As for the enthusiasts - run the train on unusual routes for 125s and they will travel on it too. I bet many would pay good money for a trip on the non authentic livery yellow painted Network Rail train.

That may be so, but they might have aspired to travel on such a modern luxury train in the way they probably wouldn't for the 1920s relics that were operating the "traditional" Pullman services (Met-camms excepted, they would be somewhere in between).

 

[RT4038]

That may be so, but they might have aspired to travel on such a modern luxury train in the way they probably wouldn't for the 1920s relics that were operating the "traditional" Pullman services (Met-camms excepted, they would be somewhere in between).

I'm not sure that the VSOE Pullman train had any shortage of takers either. I suspect the aspiration would have been similar for any of the Pullman types. (It wasn't just the actual rolling stock, it was the thought of an almost unattainable high class product, and destinations [such as Golden Arrow])

If the standard of service is right, this Blue Pullman themed HST will do very well.

 

[edwin_m]

I'm not sure that the VSOE Pullman train had any shortage of takers either. I suspect the aspiration would have been similar for any of the Pullman types. (It wasn't just the actual rolling stock, it was the thought of an almost unattainable high class product, and destinations [such as Golden Arrow])

If the standard of service is right, this Blue Pullman themed HST will do very well.

The VSOE came in in the 1980s when the affluent oldies of the time would have remembered the heyday of the traditional Pullman. It still has a market, but the Statesman and others have tried to do something a bit similar. By choosing the Blue Pullman livery I believe the promoters have decided the market for traditional-styled luxury trains is approaching saturation and are trying to do something a bit different.

 

[RT4038]

The VSOE came in in the 1980s when the affluent oldies of the time would have remembered the heyday of the traditional Pullman. It still has a market, but the Statesman and others have tried to do something a bit similar. By choosing the Blue Pullman livery I believe the promoters have decided the market for traditional-styled luxury trains is approaching saturation and are trying to do something a bit different.

Quite right, and good luck to them.

 

[Journeyman]

The VSOE came in in the 1980s when the affluent oldies of the time would have remembered the heyday of the traditional Pullman. It still has a market, but the Statesman and others have tried to do something a bit similar. By choosing the Blue Pullman livery I believe the promoters have decided the market for traditional-styled luxury trains is approaching saturation and are trying to do something a bit different.

Absolutely. The chintzy traditional Pullman car has never appealed to me, but the Blue Pullman was quite minimalist, and recreating that ambience in an HST will work pretty well. I could certainly be tempted.

 

[Cowley]

Absolutely. The chintzy traditional Pullman car has never appealed to me, but the Blue Pullman was quite minimalist, and recreating that ambience in an HST will work pretty well. I could certainly be tempted.

I quite like the idea of a sort of mid 60s Thunderbirds recreation but with less flammable upholstery...

 

[hexagon789]

I am a bit late with this reply but I was amused by Prince Philip in connection with this

Warships on the Rails: Royal Navy and British Railways

warships rails royal navy british railway diesel electric steam iron duke magpie ark royal swindon north english western region hydraulic lion tiger rocket

glostransporthistory.visit-gloucestershire.co.uk

a letter to Western Region General Manager John Hammond before the Marylebone exhibition, the Duke had expressed an interest in driving “his” locomotive – perhaps not least as his wife had driven the last Castle Class locomotive built at Swindon some eleven years before. Before entering the cab and being shown the controls, he was offered a diesel drivers cap and white coat by Western Region Running and Maintenance Officer HEA White. While accepting the cap, His Royal Highness declined the coat with his usual tact and charm saying that he didn’t want to look like a bloody milkman!

Love it! And I don't blame him

 

[Mitchell Hurd]

I've seen the pictures of the outside and I think it looks fantastic - I like the 'MIDLAND PULLMAN' font and the livery. I was never around when the original Pullman was there.

Clearly the HST should be much more reliable than the original sets that I read about quite a while ago!

 

[43 302]

In case anyone hasn't heard, the tours for 2021 have been announced and include some lines in thee west Highlands, Kyle of Localsh. Here's the website: https://midlandpullman.com/