Blackpool to Hazel Grove extension to Sheffield.

[Philip]

Just wondering what people think about extending the hourly Blackpool to Hazel Grove onwards to Sheffield? It would obviously need doubled up 195s to replace doubled up 331s for the whole route, but with some rolling stock reorganisation it would tick two boxes; the 3rd fast Hope Valley service between Manchester and Sheffield and also 6-coach all standard class trains which would be a huge capacity boost.

If capacity into Sheffield is a problem then perhaps the EMT could be routed via Dore South Curve to avoid Sheffield.

 

[JonathanH]

Just wondering what people think about extending the hourly Blackpool to Hazel Grove onwards to Sheffield? It would obviously need doubled up 195s to replace doubled up 331s for the whole route, but with some rolling stock reorganisation it would tick two boxes; the 3rd fast Hope Valley service between Manchester and Sheffield and also 6-coach all standard class trains which would be a huge capacity boost.

If capacity into Sheffield is a problem then perhaps the EMT could be routed via Dore South Curve to avoid Sheffield.

Most people baulk at the idea of running diesel trains under wires especially ones which have only recently been installed.

Perhaps an idea for when signalling and electrification has been upgraded in the Hope Valley.

 

[Philip]

Most people baulk at the idea of running diesel trains under wires especially ones which have only recently been installed.

Perhaps an idea for when signalling and electrification has been upgraded in the Hope Valley.

Maybe for old diesel trains like Sprinters which pollute a lot, not for modern 'clean diesel' stock like 195s.

Electrification is a long way off for this route, capacity enhancements need to happen now, not in 10 years or more.

 

[JonathanH]

Maybe for old diesel trains like Sprinters which pollute a lot, not for modern 'clean diesel' stock like 195s.

Electrification is a long way off for this route, capacity enhancements need to happen now, not in 10 years or more.

195s are still not zero emission (at the point of use) and there aren't that many of them given the routes they need to cover.

The track layout at Hazel Grove allows for trains to reverse there. Where else could the 331s be used if they weren't used for Blackpool to Hazel Grove.

It is not a outlandish idea to extend Blackpool to Hazel Grove trains over the route to Sheffield but too many things are against it.

 

[tbtc]

We lost our direct Blackpool services when the Regional Railways "East Anglia to North West" settled into a Norwich - Liverpool service (one of those rationalising gains that benefitted Liverpool, which is why you don't hear about it as much), and I'm sure there'd be some in South Yorkshire who'd welcome a trip to the Fylde coast (as well as better WCML connections, given that the Norwich - Liverpool stops at Warrington Central, so requires a hike across Warrington), but we're probably talking fairly small numbers.

More important are the number of Sheffield - Manchester commuters who are fairly neglected (compared to the attention given to the trans-pennine route through Huddersfield) and the people in the Hope Valley/ Chinley who may consider Stockport a significant place in its own right (and possibly Stepping Hill could factor, given the relative proximity to Hazel Grove). But, as things stand, anyone wanting to get from Chinley to Hazel Grove/ Stockport generally has to go via either Sheffield or Manchester (given the lack of intermediate stops on the "semi-fast" services).

It'd be good use of bi-mode stock, if the 769s ever actually work, but until they do then I can't see anyone wanting to take 331s off the Hazel Grove route and replace them with DMUs.

 

[Philip]

Would wires fit in Disley Tunnel? It looks a small bore and seem to recall reading that 142s aren't allowed through it, although not sure if that was because of the size or the gradient.

 

[Ianno87]

Would wires fit in Disley Tunnel? It looks a small bore and seem to recall reading that 142s aren't allowed through it, although not sure if that was because of the size or the gradient.

I have been through Disley tunnel on a 142. Diverted stopper due to a bridge bash at Marple.

I think you're thinking of one of the tunnels on the Buxton line.

 

[CJ]

Would wires fit in Disley Tunnel? It looks a small bore and seem to recall reading that 142s aren't allowed through it, although not sure if that was because of the size or the gradient.

142s have definitely operated Manchester to Sheffield via Stockport in the past (when the Marple line is unavailable), calling points were Stockport, Chinley and then all stops to Sheffield.

 

[Kite159]

142s have definitely operated Manchester to Sheffield via Stockport in the past (when the Marple line is unavailable), calling points were Stockport, Chinley and then all stops to Sheffield.

And I believe there is at least one early morning service which goes that way (the 0546 Manchester Piccadilly to Sheffield on Saturdays), which I would imagine would have been pacer worked in the past (plus a couple ECSs.

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As for the idea of extending the Hazel Grove services to Sheffield, as it means diesels will have to run underneath those wires from Blackpool to Hazel Grove before carrying on the hope(less) valley, then nope.

 

[Ianno87]

I have been through Disley tunnel on a 142. Diverted stopper due to a bridge bash at Marple.

I think you're thinking of one of the tunnels on the Buxton line.

Factoid: This is the only time I've gone through Stockport non-stop....on a 142!

 

[Bletchleyite]

As for the idea of extending the Hazel Grove services to Sheffield, as it means diesels will have to run underneath those wires from Blackpool to Hazel Grove before carrying on the hope(less) valley, then nope.

Yet another reason Northern should have ordered a fleet of bi-modes instead of DMUs and EMUs.

That said, if the 769s ever see service (I'm not betting on it) they might be suitable for such a service.

 

[S&CLER]

Yet another reason Northern should have ordered a fleet of bi-modes instead of DMUs and EMUs.

That said, if the 769s ever see service (I'm not betting on it) they might be suitable for such a service.

There are some cryptic ecs workings showing as STP timings on RTT departures from Southport next week which look as if they may be 769 tests from Springs Branch to Southport and back. 3Z52 is quite smartly timed from Wigan Wallgate to Meols Cop pass.