To anyone who thinks the anomalies should not exist, please tell me what you think would happen if the TOCs/ATOC were ordered by the DfT to remove such anomalies? I think I know what would happen:
1) Prices would increase - massively
2) Routeing options would have to decrease, with tickets being routed specific ways to avoid anomalies (e.g. York to Sheffield Route Doncaster or Route Pontefract or Route Leeds etc)
3) They still wouldn't get rid of them all!
4) Loads of people would ditch the train, especially on shorter journeys with all the CDRs removed!
I'll take these. First of all, I do accept that anomalies will need to exist. The network is so vast that there's no way they cannot. I've highlighted a number if instances already where improvements can be made to the ticketing system in order to improve things, most notably on the CrossCountry network where there are literally anomalies everywhere that serve only to penalise the traveller. I'll address your points;
1) I don't believe that they would necessarily. Indeed, I reckon the higher fares that people see on some journeys will put them off, so lowering fares in this way would potentially increase the number of passengers and offset any difference. In some cases, so many people know how to get around the issue anyway, so resolving the problem probably won't cause much loss.
2) Not necessarily; I've not suggest removing every anomaly. We'd be here for ever and a day and still get nowhere. Routeing options could remain open. Even if you were to close a number of routeing options, what real difference does it make? Even on the most open routes (eg London-Glasgow), 99% of passengers will probably travel on the most direct and sensible services available. For example, I doubt London-Glasgow tickets are ever used on St Pancras-Sheffield-Leeds-Carlisle-Kilmarnock-Glasgow, even though it's technically a valid route (IIRC).
3) See 2).
4) Remove all CDRs? I don't think anyone's suggested that! In fact, I think the availability of day returns should be increased to a reasonable distance for day travel (about 2 hours seems right, maybe more?) alongside "1 month" returns. This is a common area where splitting tickets works very well, and people are already wise to it (such as the Glasgow-Dundee market I've already spoken about). It won't be long until most people know how to get around the system anyway, so any losses will probably be negligible. Indeed, ditching CDRs would be so catastrophic for the TOCs that it would do more harm than good.
My main problem with the split tickets anomalies is that they are really common, and affect routes that hundreds of people use every day. We're not just talking about obscure train journeys here used once or twice a year. It's just plain wrong that they are allowed to deceive people into paying quite a bit more than they need to.
But I think my suggestions really do need more regulation to work well. I've always believed that all walk-up fares should all be regulated.
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I appreciate it's unfair to those who cannot apply these tactics, but I'm afraid that openly publishing these splits and anomalies will only lead to their eventually being removed.
Let's go back to one I've spoken about before; the Glasgow-Dundee split. I know I'm going on about it, but it's one I know quite well and similar situations exist up and down the country. As I've mentioned before, it's one of the more reasonable cases (day return vs "1 month" return), but it does penalise those going for a day trip in either direction, which is perfectly feasible given the 1hr30-ish journey time.
Buying CDRs Glasgow-Stirling, Stirling-Perth and Perth-Dundee is cheaper than the SVR Glasgow-Dundee for those returning on the same day. Those who know about the split save quite a bit of money. Those who don't lose out. Let's say Scotrail wanted to change things; what options do they have?
1) Remove all CDRs, or increase the price of the CDR to stop the split being worthwhile. They won't do this. In an instant, they'd kill the busy intermediate journeys off and, in effect, be committing suicide. Stirling-Glasgow, for example, is a busy route that would no longer be an attractive option.
2) Prevent people using split tickets. In reality, this is totally unenforceable and will never happen.
3) Introduce a day return from Glasgow-Dundee. Yes, you're going to lose some revenue. But market it well and any revenue loss will be regained. Bear in mind that quite a number of people already know about the split, so that limits the damage straight away.
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Again bizarre logic - a system which enables a few passengers to get even cheaper fares is actually: "TOCs trying to maximise their revenue by exploiting the relative ignorance of a typical traveler,"
Do you actually think they maintain this system so that enthusiasts and people who know as much as Yorkie can travel for cheaper than the average man on the street? They do not. Where they know the anomalies exist, and they know about plenty of them, I would suggest that they actually want people to needlessly buy the more expensive product in order to maximise their own revenue. Cynical? Yes, but that's what they're doing. At least for the cases they know about (to be fair, there are so many that they won't know all of them).
Yet again logic goes out of the window ! NOBODY is getting "around it", they are quite legally and honestly using what is there.
They're using legal and honest techniques to get around the techniques used by the TOC to penalise those who don't know the anomalies. The companies know perfectly well that many of these cases exist, don't think otherwise. The reason they're not resolving them is to exploit them for their own benefit.
Perhaps on my next visit to Tesco I shouldn't buy a four pack of beans in case anyone thinks I am "getting round" the higher unit price of single cans ............:roll::roll:
You rabbit on about my bizarre logic, yet use this utterly perverse example? First of all, your example is the wrong way round. The anomaly would be if the four pack were more expansive than four single cans.
Second (and most importantly) Tesco will tell you how much each individual product is per 100g/item/whatever, and therefore allow the consumer to make an informed decision. Have a look at this:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/coultart/4367580626/
Now, first of all, this is an infinitely better example of an anomaly than you've used! Second of all, look below the "£1.00". You'll see in smaller writing "16.7p each" advising you of the cost per single item. This allows you to compare the options. Of course, to go back to your cans, in the cases where a four pack is more expensive than four single cans, then you can still make a valid comparison when you're in the canned foods aisle and have the selection laid out in front of you.
Now, I've not gone off on a tangent. The railways give you no such comparison. If I were to buy a ticket, I get what I've asked for. At no point are they obliged to tell me that it's cheaper to split at X and Y, or to get a return to B which is actually further down the line.
