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Birmingham-Wolverhampton Problems 2-4-22

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M60lad

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Does anybody know what happened this afternoon/evening to warrant all the delays to trains from Birmingham-Wolverhampton? According to Realtime trains it was due to disorder but according to staff at Wolverhampton it was due to a broken down train, unless the 2 reasons are connected.

I know a Voyager or 2 from Manchester terminated at Wolverhampton due to the problems and replaced other services that were caught up in the problems at Birmingham
 
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Trainfan2019

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I've just read on national rail about passengers disturbance between Wolverhampton and Birmingham New Street earlier. Disruption expected until the end of the day although lines now reopened.
 

Toby268

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Does anybody know what happened this afternoon/evening to warrant all the delays to trains from Birmingham-Wolverhampton? According to Realtime trains it was due to disorder but according to staff at Wolverhampton it was due to a broken down train, unless the 2 reasons are connected.

I know a Voyager or 2 from Manchester terminated at Wolverhampton due to the problems and replaced other services that were caught up in the problems at Birmingham
Passengers pulled egress and self evacuated from WMR service.
 

syorksdeano

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Villa fans apparently pulling the emergency cords, opening the doors and walking on the tracks.
 

gazzaa2

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Passengers causing a disturbance was cited in one train so the lines were blocked while the police were called. As packed out train were left stranded maybe some self evacuated which caused more problems.
 

GG96LFC

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I was on the 16:06 LNWR train travelling back from Lime Street after watching the Liverpool v Watford match. The train stopped at Wolverhampton and picked up lots of fans that had been to Wolves v Aston Villa at Molineux (police were already having to arrest some of these fans on the platform at Wolverhampton). Way too many passengers climb on board, there was barely any room to breathe.
Cue shouting and swearing from drunk passengers hurling abuse at one another. Train leaves Smethwick Galton Bridge just before 6pm, then grinds to a halt before we reach Rolfe Street. Conductor comes onto the speaker to announce an egress has been pulled but the doors haven’t been closed again. He struggles to walk through the train due to so many people standing in each carriage who won’t let him walk past, so he, the driver and one more on board staff walk around the outside of the train trying to get to the affected door.
They seemed to get it sorted, however the conductor then comes back on the speaker to announce that 5 more egress handles have been pulled and those doors have been opened too. The passengers on board start arguing, they think the issue is that the doors inside the train between the carriages need to remain closed for the train to move, as opposed to the doors on the outside of the train.
Passengers then decide to start self evacuating the train, around 50 people jump off and start walking on both lines (causing a line block in both directions), with those people saying they were intending on walking miles back to Smethwick Galton Bridge to get a taxi back home from there.
Just before 7pm, BTP reach the train and help remove some of the unruly passengers and they also help the conductor and driver sort out the issue of the doors being constantly opened due to egress pulls every time the train tried to move. Just as the line blocks are lifted, two passengers have medical emergencies on board. Once they were seen to, the train was eventually able to move again just after 7:15pm
 
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seagull

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Just one of many reasons why we could never have Japanese-style punctuality here. And also a good example of why many of those staff on a Saturday day off, do not want to work overtime.
 

gazzaa2

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Just one of many reasons why we could never have Japanese-style punctuality here. And also a good example of why many of those staff on a Saturday day off, do not want to work overtime.

I seen Wolves were playing Villa and made sure I got the earlier train back today. Wouldn't have expected what happened but there was bound to be unruly fans and mass overcrowding if nothing else.

BTP/WMP used to insist these games were played at 12pm and usually on a Sunday and the trains would have a strong police presence. Surprised the train involved never had a police presence from Wolverhampton, as that would have controlled the issues.
 
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GordonT

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I seen Wolves were playing Villa and made sure I got the earlier train back today. Wouldn't have expected what happened but there was bound to be unruly fans and mass overcrowding if nothing else.

BTP/WMP used to insist these games were played at 12pm and usually on a Sunday and the trains would have a strong police presence. Surprised the train involved never had a police presence from Wolverhampton, as that would have controlled the issues.
Perhaps police resources severely impacted by Covid?
 

RPI

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As a Villa fan my self, I couldn't be more embarrassed. ( and we're pretty used to being embarrassed!)
 

GG96LFC

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Overcrowding definitely made the situation twice as bad as it may have otherwise been. The 09:04 train from New Street to Lime Street was also packed to the brim (it was meant to be an 8 carriage train but was downgraded to a 4 carriage train) and there was a medical emergency on board that one too which also caused delays to that train.
Add drunk passengers to an already insanely overcrowded train (some were even smoking on the train which didn’t have opening windows) and it was always going to be a recipe for disaster
 
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asdirective

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I seen Wolves were playing Villa and made sure I got the earlier train back today. Wouldn't have expected what happened but there was bound to be unruly fans and mass overcrowding if nothing else.

BTP/WMP used to insist these games were played at 12pm and usually on a Sunday and the trains would have a strong police presence. Surprised the train involved never had a police presence from Wolverhampton, as that would have controlled the issues.

Birmingham City play West Brom today as well.

A bit stupid having two local derbies in one weekend. I imagine it's stretched police resources to the max.
 

Dave W

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Birmingham City play West Brom today as well.

A bit stupid having two local derbies in one weekend. I imagine it's stretched police resources to the max.
This was moved at the behest of police as neither game was picked up for telly so were originally scheduled at the same time.

Which would have been fun.
 

gazzaa2

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Overcrowding definitely made the situation twice as bad as it may have otherwise been. The 09:04 train from New Street to Lime Street was also packed to the brim (it was meant to be an 8 carriage train but was downgraded to a 4 carriage train) and there was a medical emergency on board that one too which also caused delays to that train.
Add drunk passengers to an already insanely overcrowded train (some were even smoking on the train which didn’t have opening windows) and it was always going to be a recipe for disaster

It's also supposed to be a half hour service (New-Street-Lime Street), still at hourly with the reduced timetables.

It can just about carry a 4 car service at the half hour frequency, let alone hourly on busy Saturdays.

It would have been even more carnage if Birmingham-West Brom was played yesterday.
 

185

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Surely the common sense move would be for RSSB, ORR and the responsible adults to tell the operator's safety manager this...

- Trainfulls of football fans MUST NOT operate into short platforms. This also happened after a Wolves match last month, the local stopper was cancelled, so a stop order was given for the 8-car Liverpool to call at Tipton, which resulted in the line blocked for 55 minutes at Tipton and seemingly no lessons were learnt.

- A not to call order should be issued for Galton Bridge, Coseley etc when football is on, same out of Liverpool at Winsford, South Parkway etc after football and events.
 

gimmea50anyday

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a good example of why many of those staff on a Saturday day off, do not want to work overtime.

EXACTLY!!! And yet myself and my colleagues from TPE are being vilified for refusing to work our days off unless a reasonable rest day work agreement is put in place
 

newtownmgr

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This was moved at the behest of police as neither game was picked up for telly so were originally scheduled at the same time.

Which would have been fun.
Standard routine is Villa & Wolves home the same day with Blues & West Brom away & alternate.2 Local derbies on the same weekend is chaos. With both Birmingham City & West Brom being on the snow hill lines it can be very busy when both at home but kick off times are occasionally staggered at the request of WM Police, but to be fair, with the exception of the trains being busy we get little trouble from both sets of fans with 2 distinct flows. Mainly west Brom fans traveling on the Worcester side with mainly Blues fans coming in from the Stratford/Leamington side. The usual mix of trouble is blues/Villa & too a lesser extent Wolves/West Brom based on ancient rivalries.
 

SCDR_WMR

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This kind of incident happens most weekends now, and it's not attributed to being football fans as it happens on that stretch on days when Wolves or WBA are not playing.

There is starting to really become safety issues across LNWR routes that have such a negative impact of not only passengers but also the train crew involved.

Lime St issues seem to be getting better now there's a risk assessment and plan in action involving NR/BTP/TOCs so this will once again be raised at TOC level and hopefully fed higher.

I think the prudent thing to do in the Short term would be to route non-stopping traffic via Heath Town/Portobello even if it's just to come up Soho still. That and BTP actually issuing £1000 fines for trespass to people who do self-evac!
 
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Not sure how anyone on board the train can complain about overcrowding… they boarded the train?

It's the old "drivers complaining about the traffic not realising that they are the traffic" problem.

ie the train is overcrowded because too many people got on it. Including you.
 

paulmch

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It's the old "drivers complaining about the traffic not realising that they are the traffic" problem.

ie the train is overcrowded because too many people got on it. Including you.

The key difference being that driving is generally something to be discouraged in favour of a more environmentally friendly choice like the train. There's only so long the industry can keep kidding itself that it will manage with reduced capacity, and I suspect we're starting to reach the limits of that at weekends. Hopefully it doesn't take somebody coming to some serious harm before things start to change!
 

setdown

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It's also supposed to be a half hour service (New-Street-Lime Street), still at hourly with the reduced timetables.

It can just about carry a 4 car service at the half hour frequency, let alone hourly on busy Saturdays.

It would have been even more carnage if Birmingham-West Brom was played yesterday.
And will still be hourly between May and December at least. I fear this is now the normal timetable, alas.
 

SCDR_WMR

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The key difference being that driving is generally something to be discouraged in favour of a more environmentally friendly choice like the train. There's only so long the industry can keep kidding itself that it will manage with reduced capacity, and I suspect we're starting to reach the limits of that at weekends. Hopefully it doesn't take somebody coming to some serious harm before things start to change!
Funny you should say that, we're running pretty much full pre-covid service (minus 1tph to LIV).
Trains are full to the point of safety issues every weekend
 

SCDR_WMR

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And will still be hourly between May and December at least. I fear this is now the normal timetable, alas.
This is now the long term plan for the timetable as defined by the DfT on signing the NRC. This was communicated internally by the Exec Team.

Aim is 80% service which is what is run now, despite staff/passengers/managers calling for more.
 

Glenn1969

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This is now the long term plan for the timetable as defined by the DfT on signing the NRC. This was communicated internally by the Exec Team.

Aim is 80% service which is what is run now, despite staff/passengers/managers calling for more.
Even during the Commonwealth Games? Surely no chance of it coping this summer. I have Games tickets and will be commuting from my sister's flat in Bletchley. Really hope to not have to stand xx
 
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