I grew up in Leicester and went to University in Norwich in the early 1980s. I made loads of direct journeys between the two cities and it was a really easy trip with a class 31 hauling 4 or 5 MK1s I think from Birmingham to Norwich. It's a shame that these direct services were broken up - does anyone know when and why this happened and any other memories of these services would be great to hear!
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Birmingham to Norwich in the 80s
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IIRC, most of them used the Adelaide Curve [Ely West Loop], to avoid having to reverse and run-round in Ely station.
They used this loop in both directions.
If you got a comfortable compartment on a Mk 1 coach you had an enjoyable journey. If, however you suffered a rattling Cl 105 Cravens unit, you were glad to alight!
They used this loop in both directions.
If you got a comfortable compartment on a Mk 1 coach you had an enjoyable journey. If, however you suffered a rattling Cl 105 Cravens unit, you were glad to alight!
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The 31s replaced cross-country 3-car dmmus which worked the route in the 70s (and still worked the daily Cambridge-Birmingham in the early 80s). The service was massively altered by Sprinterisation, but IIRC the present pattern is post Privatisation. Others will be better informed.
This thread from 2014 is worth reading.
http://www.railforums.co.uk/showthread.php?t=100164
This thread from 2014 is worth reading.
http://www.railforums.co.uk/showthread.php?t=100164
It was way more fun travelling on a loco hauled train. I knew someone who was travelling to Stamford, and by the time the 31 had stopped at the station my mates coach was still in the tunnel. This was over 30 yrs ago, but we still remember and laugh.
When the new sprinters came in the late 80s, you have to admit it made a big difference to journey times and frequency.
Stamford to Peterborough late 70s/to mid 80s service was pretty dire I recall.
When the new sprinters came in the late 80s, you have to admit it made a big difference to journey times and frequency.
Stamford to Peterborough late 70s/to mid 80s service was pretty dire I recall.
Springs Branch
Established Member
In the mid to late 1970s and into the 80s I made regular journeys between Wigan and Cambridge. My route was WCML between Wigan and Nuneaton, change to the Birmingham/Norwich as far as March, then a DMU to Cambridge.
As mentioned, the frequency was not great and you had to study your timetable to pick the one or two trips per day with reasonable connections.
When I first started doing this, the Birmingham/Norwichs were 3-car Cross Country DMUs. These DMUs always seemed a bit cramped, noisy & claustophobic to me after the electrically-hauled Mk.2 on the WCML, but were certainly better than the spartan & rattly bus-style Class 105s which invariably did the last leg into Cambridge.
It was a big improvement when the Class 31 & Mk.1s were introduced - both open or compartment varieties were used and I think my hit rate of either was about 50:50.
I still have a clear mental scrapbook of memories of these journeys:-
- Waiting expectantly at Nuneaton to see whether the Norwich connection would be loco-hauled or one of those pesky Class 120 DMUs, then the welcome oily clatter of the Class 31 loco as it ran into the platform.
- Full semaphore signalling after leaving the WCML (especially prolific around Leicester) through to the ECML at Peterborough. Where I grew up in the North there had been extensive rationalisation and semaphore signalled areas were usually characterised by redundant signal posts, bare dolls and gantries with maybe just one operational signal arm remaining. On the MML around Leicester, everything seemed densely signalled and still intact, including semaphore distant arms which were becoming rare elsewhere.
- Trundling along at a moderate, but adequate pace through England's green and pleasant land east of Leicester on a warm summer afternoon. All the window ventilators were open in the lightly-loaded Mk.1 TSO and I was lulled into a doze by the rhythmic clickety-clack of the jointed track.
- Freezing half to death on March station waiting for my connecting train in winter. This could happen in either direction; if heading north, at least I had the prospect of the steamy warmth of a Mk.1 compartment to thaw out in. Heading to Cambridge I often had to haul my luggage over the footbridge to the Spalding line platform for the Doncaster-Lincoln-Spalding-Cambridge train, which was sure to be a cold, draughty, rattly Cravens DMU.
- One occasion when the Norwich train ran late and all the connecting passengers had to run madly over the footbridge at March (with our luggage) as the connecting DMU was already in the platform. We needn't have worried, since with semaphore block signalling it would be a good number of minutes before the Cambridge train got the right away to follow. We later passed the Norwich train held on the Ely West loop for us to pass - its Class 31 pointing in the opposite direction by this time of course.
- Another occasion in a particularly cold winter (maybe 1981?) when we arrived on-time at Nuneaton on a Birmingham-bound train, toasty warm from a Mk.1, to find serious dispution on the WCML due to icing on the OHLE. I had to wait ages in the freezing cold for a connection to the north with no information on train running and no station buffet serving hot cups of tea. Meanwhile the diesel trains between Birmingham and Leicester/Norwich were all arriving and departing punctually as if it were a just normal day - and very inviting their warm carriages looked too. I considered trying my luck via Birmingham, but then an Inter-City to Manchester arrived and I got home that way - standing room only of course. When this train arrived at Piccadilly, we had to walk through the train as less than half the doors could be opened - the rest being iced shut (OK this is not really a Birmingham/Norwich memory).
- Sidings at March with lines of withdrawn Eastern Region London area EMUs. Not sure whether these were Class 302 or Class 306, but they were there for ages. As the years passed, the Rail Blue livery faded to a paler and paler shade and the yellow front ends faded almost to white. The old stock did not seem to suffer grafitti attacks, although I think a lot of the windows were progressively smashed.
Two other random but vivid memories which are not related directly to operation of Birmingham/Norwich trains:-
1) The first time I saw a schoolboy wearing an old-fashioned school cap was on a Cravens DMU at Ely. I didn't think that apparel existed any more, even in the 1970s (and certainly no lad would wear one out and about in Wigan).
2) On my very last journey on this route, boarding a busy Birmingham train at March, I managed to bag the last seat in a Mk.1 compartment. It was lunchtime so I pulled out my lunch - a pork pie, an apple and can of Abbott Ale. With the open can held between my legs and fiddled with the pork pie, I did the McDonalds Hot Coffee thing and spilled most of the beer over my pants and seat cushion. With the compartment full of glaring, "not amused" fellow passengers, there was nothing to do but stay put, trying to look innocent sitting in a wet, sticky & stinky beer puddle until Nuneaton. (If you travelled on this route in the early 1980s and wondered why your clothes smelled beery afterwards - sorry about that!)
After this, my tickets became claimable business expenses and I switched to the faster, more flexible (and more expensive) route via Euston & Kings Cross with an Inter-City First Class breakfast in place of beer and pork pie.
As mentioned, the frequency was not great and you had to study your timetable to pick the one or two trips per day with reasonable connections.
When I first started doing this, the Birmingham/Norwichs were 3-car Cross Country DMUs. These DMUs always seemed a bit cramped, noisy & claustophobic to me after the electrically-hauled Mk.2 on the WCML, but were certainly better than the spartan & rattly bus-style Class 105s which invariably did the last leg into Cambridge.
It was a big improvement when the Class 31 & Mk.1s were introduced - both open or compartment varieties were used and I think my hit rate of either was about 50:50.
I still have a clear mental scrapbook of memories of these journeys:-
- Waiting expectantly at Nuneaton to see whether the Norwich connection would be loco-hauled or one of those pesky Class 120 DMUs, then the welcome oily clatter of the Class 31 loco as it ran into the platform.
- Full semaphore signalling after leaving the WCML (especially prolific around Leicester) through to the ECML at Peterborough. Where I grew up in the North there had been extensive rationalisation and semaphore signalled areas were usually characterised by redundant signal posts, bare dolls and gantries with maybe just one operational signal arm remaining. On the MML around Leicester, everything seemed densely signalled and still intact, including semaphore distant arms which were becoming rare elsewhere.
- Trundling along at a moderate, but adequate pace through England's green and pleasant land east of Leicester on a warm summer afternoon. All the window ventilators were open in the lightly-loaded Mk.1 TSO and I was lulled into a doze by the rhythmic clickety-clack of the jointed track.
- Freezing half to death on March station waiting for my connecting train in winter. This could happen in either direction; if heading north, at least I had the prospect of the steamy warmth of a Mk.1 compartment to thaw out in. Heading to Cambridge I often had to haul my luggage over the footbridge to the Spalding line platform for the Doncaster-Lincoln-Spalding-Cambridge train, which was sure to be a cold, draughty, rattly Cravens DMU.
- One occasion when the Norwich train ran late and all the connecting passengers had to run madly over the footbridge at March (with our luggage) as the connecting DMU was already in the platform. We needn't have worried, since with semaphore block signalling it would be a good number of minutes before the Cambridge train got the right away to follow. We later passed the Norwich train held on the Ely West loop for us to pass - its Class 31 pointing in the opposite direction by this time of course.
- Another occasion in a particularly cold winter (maybe 1981?) when we arrived on-time at Nuneaton on a Birmingham-bound train, toasty warm from a Mk.1, to find serious dispution on the WCML due to icing on the OHLE. I had to wait ages in the freezing cold for a connection to the north with no information on train running and no station buffet serving hot cups of tea. Meanwhile the diesel trains between Birmingham and Leicester/Norwich were all arriving and departing punctually as if it were a just normal day - and very inviting their warm carriages looked too. I considered trying my luck via Birmingham, but then an Inter-City to Manchester arrived and I got home that way - standing room only of course. When this train arrived at Piccadilly, we had to walk through the train as less than half the doors could be opened - the rest being iced shut (OK this is not really a Birmingham/Norwich memory).
- Sidings at March with lines of withdrawn Eastern Region London area EMUs. Not sure whether these were Class 302 or Class 306, but they were there for ages. As the years passed, the Rail Blue livery faded to a paler and paler shade and the yellow front ends faded almost to white. The old stock did not seem to suffer grafitti attacks, although I think a lot of the windows were progressively smashed.
Two other random but vivid memories which are not related directly to operation of Birmingham/Norwich trains:-
1) The first time I saw a schoolboy wearing an old-fashioned school cap was on a Cravens DMU at Ely. I didn't think that apparel existed any more, even in the 1970s (and certainly no lad would wear one out and about in Wigan).
2) On my very last journey on this route, boarding a busy Birmingham train at March, I managed to bag the last seat in a Mk.1 compartment. It was lunchtime so I pulled out my lunch - a pork pie, an apple and can of Abbott Ale. With the open can held between my legs and fiddled with the pork pie, I did the McDonalds Hot Coffee thing and spilled most of the beer over my pants and seat cushion. With the compartment full of glaring, "not amused" fellow passengers, there was nothing to do but stay put, trying to look innocent sitting in a wet, sticky & stinky beer puddle until Nuneaton. (If you travelled on this route in the early 1980s and wondered why your clothes smelled beery afterwards - sorry about that!)
After this, my tickets became claimable business expenses and I switched to the faster, more flexible (and more expensive) route via Euston & Kings Cross with an Inter-City First Class breakfast in place of beer and pork pie.
Services changed from 31s to 156 Sprinters in May 1988, mainly so that better connections could be made at Ely. Prior to 1988 the service was 2 hourly from Norwich to Birmingham, whereas after it was an hourly service from Norwich, with alternate trains serving Birmingham or Liverpool Lime St. The same pattern of service also operated from Cambridge, thus giving an hourly service to both destinations with a change at Ely.
Springs Branch mentioned the change at March to the Joint line and the scrap emus. This dates to around 1981/1982 as the joint line between March and Spalding closed at the end of 1982 and the emus were class 306s displaced from the Shenfield services by 315s. They were stored at March pending scrapping at Snailwell.
The winter of 1981/1982 was indeed a bad one. I remember doing 55002 on a Norwich - York tour and the ice was forming on the inside of the windows!!!
The trains for Mildenhall stopped at Shippea Hill. On one summer Saturday in 1985, I had 47064 to Shippea Hill for 47298 back, then later a Shippea Hill - Peterborough additional produced 31164 - ah happy days
Springs Branch mentioned the change at March to the Joint line and the scrap emus. This dates to around 1981/1982 as the joint line between March and Spalding closed at the end of 1982 and the emus were class 306s displaced from the Shenfield services by 315s. They were stored at March pending scrapping at Snailwell.
The winter of 1981/1982 was indeed a bad one. I remember doing 55002 on a Norwich - York tour and the ice was forming on the inside of the windows!!!
The trains for Mildenhall stopped at Shippea Hill. On one summer Saturday in 1985, I had 47064 to Shippea Hill for 47298 back, then later a Shippea Hill - Peterborough additional produced 31164 - ah happy days
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Lots of disgruntled people complaining of the fares, but as some of us know, back in the day this could be a real slog. Now, for instance, with trains running hourly between Leicester/Stamford to Cambridge, and journey times comfortably reduced.
I take my hat off to the man who used to travel from Wigan to East Anglia during a time of such infrequent services.
I take my hat off to the man who used to travel from Wigan to East Anglia during a time of such infrequent services.
And people talk about the good old days of B.R.
N.B. item 1. Probably King's school, Ely.
ac6000cw
Established Member
Agreed - there are rather too many 'rose tinted' views of BR service standards around here sometimes. Yes, the 31s + LHCS trains were an improvement over the 'Cross-Country' DMUs, but that wasn't saying much - the trains were still slow, draughty and either cold or hot and stuffy in the winter.
eastwestdivide
Established Member
I was at Leicester uni from 1980-3, and it was mid-way through that period, around 1982/3 ish, that the steam heat 31s with Mk1s changed over to electric heat 31/4s with some non-air-con Mk2s.
Nearly always March-based locos.
Nearly always March-based locos.
satisnek
Member
Yes, 31/4s and Mk2s, that's how I remember it.
I can clearly recall the first time I travelled in a Sprinter between Birmingham and Nuneaton and the frequent acceleration and braking during the journey. 31s, of course, didn't accelerate before it was time to slow down again!
2+2 seating on a BSO (39 seats on a Mk 1). 2+1 seating was 1st class and there were no BFOs.
No, some BSOs (mk2) had 2+1, I remember them well.
Edit – just looked them up in an old Platform 5. All Mk2 and Mk2A BSOs had 2+1 seating and wider tables.
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The last batch of the original Mk 2 SO vehicles were likewise, they were 48 seat 2+1 SO rather than 64 seat 2+2 TSO. There was a group of these assigned to the Liverpool-Edinburgh service in the 1970s, which gave a pleasant wider ride. The staff from the buffet marshalled next vehicle would use the first couple of bays laid out as restaurant accommodation, which I believe was the original idea. Bear in mind that there was still much Mk 1 side corridor stock around at the time, which had 3-a-side compartments, the same in both first and second class.
Ironically for me the start of these journeys would be on the 1938/56 Wirral electrics, which had large former-First class saloons in the centre car, only recently declassified, and which thus provided 2+1 second class seating in more comfortable seats on a short local journey. These seats, which for years had hardly been used, suddenly became the most popular in the train. So it was 2+1 second class seating throughout the trip.
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ac6000cw
Established Member
...which does rather make the case for modern DMUs!
I'm just reading the (very interesting) 'The Regional Railways Story' book, and Provincial/Regional Railways were desperate to get rid of loco haulage generally to reduce maintenance costs, speed up services and work longer, more intensive diagrams.
I was mid teens in 1980, I was at Stamford meeting a friend off the class 31 from Peterborough. It was quite a long set, my mates coach stopped nearer the tunnel than the platform. I can still see the look on his face now as he got off. I remember by 1985 the station announcer at PB always specified that passengers for Stamford are requested to join the front 3 coaches.
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