Bee Network Service/Route Discussion

[Xenophon PCDGS]

TfGM have released their latest service changes.

Buses. But better.

Buses. But better.

tfgm.com

A welcome improvement for some services, certainly in Manchester I'd have liked to have seen the 135 PVR increase and the 59 to have it's reliability looked at.

2

In the Stockport area, the reliability of the 368 needs looking at.

 

[Howardh]

Really handy, will link west Bolton to Horwich Parkway for once.

I'm looking for the new timetable, has anyone got a link, thanks!!

 

[First Northern]

New timetable via bustimes.org

615 Timetable 30/08/26

 

[M60lad]

I notice that despite drivers going on about it for most of this year the idea/changes to 415 have been dropped and the timetable is obviously staying as it is, makes me wonder whether this was just another case of driver hearsay or whether the changes were actually meant to happen but have now been postponed for some reason.

 

[Howardh]

New timetable via bustimes.org

615 Timetable 30/08/26

Thanks, just what I was looking for!

 

[Trackman]

Where did the 615 go before (or even now)?
Went to a football match a few years back and there was no bus to Bolton I think, well apart from match buses plus the trains were not running due to staff shortages.
I met up with some people after the match in the pub 'Harvester?' I assumed incorrectly the trains were running, which was a silly mistake - I didnt think much of it as I had a lift to the stadium. Wi-Fi/4G was near enough non-existent to compound problems.

 

[Tim33160]

New timetable via bustimes.org

615 Timetable 30/08/26

and from TfGM

From 30 August, as part of improvements to buses between Middlebrook and Bolton, we’re extending bus 615 from Middlebrook to Bolton via Chorley New Road. We’re also adding earlier morning, evening, Sunday and public journeys, and more Monday to Saturday daytime journeys. Buses will run every 30 minutes in the daytime and hourly in the evening, seven days a week. Bus 576 will also link Middlebrook with Bolton town centre via Chorley New Road. This change is in place until further notice.

More information and advice provides link to timetable pdf leaflet

 

[158756]

This round of changes around Middlebrook look like the first real attempt for the Bee Network to change the route network they inherited.

New timetables for the 575 and 576 are now up on TfGMs site. The 575 is increased to every 15 minutes between Bolton and Blackrod, but reduced to every 30 between Blackrod and Wigan (however I think the 575 and 615 coordinate at the Wigan end). The 576 is diverted via Middlebrook Tesco and reduced to every 30 minutes.

Combined, it looks like the 575,576 and 615 will provide a bus every 7-8 minutes (up from every 10 now with the 575/576) along Chorley New Road from Bolton, with half going to Middlebrook (576 and 615, though the 576 only appears to go to the Tesco) and half continuing direct to Horwich (575).

So Middlebrook Tesco (which is a bit of a trek from most of the retail park) will have a bus every 15 minutes to Bolton, from nothing now, and the 615 goes from no service a year ago and the current hourly with large gaps at school times to half hourly. There are losers though - the unique sections of the 575 (Blackrod-Aspull) and 576 see their frequency reduced, and the frequency from Horwich towards Bolton is effectively reduced from every 10 to 15 minutes, with the 575 and 576 no longer being evenly spaced.

 

[Howardh]

This round of changes around Middlebrook look like the first real attempt for the Bee Network to change the route network they inherited.

New timetables for the 575 and 576 are now up on TfGMs site. The 575 is increased to every 15 minutes between Bolton and Blackrod, but reduced to every 30 between Blackrod and Wigan (however I think the 575 and 615 coordinate at the Wigan end). The 576 is diverted via Middlebrook Tesco and reduced to every 30 minutes.

Combined, it looks like the 575,576 and 615 will provide a bus every 7-8 minutes (up from every 10 now with the 575/576) along Chorley New Road from Bolton, with half going to Middlebrook (576 and 615, though the 576 only appears to go to the Tesco) and half continuing direct to Horwich (575).

So Middlebrook Tesco (which is a bit of a trek from most of the retail park) will have a bus every 15 minutes to Bolton, from nothing now, and the 615 goes from no service a year ago and the current hourly with large gaps at school times to half hourly. There are losers though - the unique sections of the 575 (Blackrod-Aspull) and 576 see their frequency reduced, and the frequency from Horwich towards Bolton is effectively reduced from every 10 to 15 minutes, with the 575 and 576 no longer being evenly spaced.

I know Blackrod needs a bus service, but that trip round added considerable time to the Bolton Wigan bus. The new 615 addition will cut Blackrod out, but Blackrod still keeps it's services.

Means now I can consider home to Wigan NW station as a viable (and quicker, more reliable?) transfer by bus rather than to Piccadilly for the WCML.

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

Blackrod has a population in excess of 5,000. Unfortunately, its railway station is situated in a border area.

 

[Howardh]

Blackrod has a population in excess of 5,000. Unfortunately, its railway station is situated in a border area.

It's neither here nor there, isn't it??! It's a steep walk up to Blackrod (unless you wait for the bus) and while it does serve that part of Horwich, it's still some distance into town. There is a small P+R there though.

I've often considered on a journey from Blackpool or Preston, whether to alight there (Blackrod) and get the 575 (6??) to take me home, but the times I've tried that there's no co-ordination.. Hoping that will be better from Horwich Parkway once the 615 passes.

 

[Statto]

When Arriva operated the 575 reliability was appalling, you could often get 2 buses together on a 20 minute route, didn't help the 575 interworked the 362

 

[158756]

Something I think TfGM could improve around the 575/576/615 changes is I can't see any publicity for the improved frequency on the shared sections of route in Bolton and Wigan. The 615 is still being published as a separate timetable, rather than a combined timetable being produced to show the full service - the 575 and 576 were already in one timetable, which now shows 15 minute gaps into Bolton where the 615 runs. The 575 and 615 even have different timing points a few stops apart at Scholes and New Springs.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 13 Aug 2026 ==

Looking at the new timetable for the 471, the service is improved in the very early morning, evenings and Sundays,but the morning peak towards Bolton looks poor. Reduced from 5 buses arriving between 8 and 9 in the current timetable (albeit not evenly spaced) to just 3, with a 24 minute gap followed by 28 minutes on a service which runs every 12 minutes off peak. Running times are extended again - since the start of the Bee Network peak journeys on this route have been extended by up to 20 minutes. I don't know how much more reliable it is now, but on paper the service is getting a bit rubbish unless TfGM are going to throw more resources at it.

https://assets.ctfassets.net/nv7y93idf4jq/3BNpJlREtMun0tWCh8mXOa/4dafb98bbc7bf8771dd844ca143bbdcc/471_26-SC-0294.pdf

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

How much customer feedback has been instrumental in bringing these new route/service updates into fruition?

 

[Statto]

I find it odd whilst the 36 has a night service the 8 doesn't with last services on the 8 at 23.00 from Bolton, & 23.56 from Manchester, were as the 36 runs 24/7 until the changes in a couple of weeks, & even after the changes happen it's only 2 overnight services being removed from Monday to Thursday, the 8 goes through Farnworth a sizable town just before Bolton, it's like they've been ignored when it comes to night services.

 

[Trackman]

I find it odd whilst the 36 has a night service the 8 doesn't with last services on the 8 at 23.00 from Bolton, & 23.56 from Manchester, were as the 36 runs 24/7 until the changes in a couple of weeks, & even after the changes happen it's only 2 overnight services being removed from Monday to Thursday, the 8 goes through Farnworth a sizable town just before Bolton, it's like they've been ignored when it comes to night services.

Maybe because it goes around the houses to get to Bolton for a bigger catchment area, saying that the no.8 which is a premier route passes through many parishes.
The 36 does go through Farnworth, but on the top end and not for long.
I had to endure the 36 today, first trip the suspension was knackered or not very well, and I thought my back was going to break. Piccadilly bus station was on form, saw about four incidents in 15 minutes, I only got mithered once 'Can you spare a dollar?' All the fun of the fair.

 

[stait.john]

The MCFC matchday buses start back this Sunday, hopefully the ongoing closure of the Northbound Alan Turing Way will not prove to be too much of an issue.

The MC2 from Marple will be operated by Stockport Depot.

 

[D Mylchreest]

[...] Piccadilly bus station was on form, saw about four incidents in 15 minutes, I only got mithered once 'Can you spare a dollar?' All the fun of the fair.

I think that's the only time I've ever seen the dialect word mithered in print/on screen.

 

[adam rogan]

Great news for the restoration of many long lost cross boundary routes. A Burnley to Rochdale route via Bacup would have been nice. I wonder whether the 535 will be a Bee Network bus on tender to Lancashire CA or if a new operator will run the Blackburn to Bolton route.

- https://lancashire-cca.gov.uk/have-your-say/proposed-changes-bus-services-blackburn-darwen

 

[MCRTransitYT]

Great news for the restoration of many long lost cross boundary routes. A Burnley to Rochdale route via Bacup would have been nice. I wonder whether the 535 will be a Bee Network bus on tender to Lancashire CA or if a new operator will run the Blackburn to Bolton route.

- https://lancashire-cca.gov.uk/have-your-say/proposed-changes-bus-services-blackburn-darwen

I would presume Bee Network continue to operate it, while although the last trip of the day is Blackburn to Tockholes, they chose to retain the 535 number, and the 5xx series represents Bolton, and all of the other new routes in the area are 2xx (such as 235 236)

 

[M60lad]

There did used to be a Rochdale-Burnley service up-to a couple of years ago (591) until First started butchering the Todmorden routes round Calder Valley to the extent that you have the situation that if you went that way today you end up with a 20 minute way for a bus from Todmorden-Burnley.

As for a Bee Network route to Burnley I think it could work especially if it went via Edenfield as there isn't really a direct route that way and it could link up at Edenfield & Rawtenstall with the services that Transdev currently operate.

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

As for a Bee Network route to Burnley I think it could work especially if it went via Edenfield as there isn't really a direct route that way and it could link up at Edenfield & Rawtenstall with the services that Transdev currently operate.

The relatively new bus station at Rawtenstall is quite pleasant and offers a nice place to wait whilst changing services to a number of destinations.

 

[Whisky Papa]

There did used to be a Rochdale-Burnley service up-to a couple of years ago (591) until First started butchering the Todmorden routes round Calder Valley to the extent that you have the situation that if you went that way today you end up with a 20 minute way for a bus from Todmorden-Burnley.

As for a Bee Network route to Burnley I think it could work especially if it went via Edenfield as there isn't really a direct route that way and it could link up at Edenfield & Rawtenstall with the services that Transdev currently operate.

The Rochdale - Todmorden - Burnley route was actually the 589, but it was always rather poor as a through route due to the excessive running time. This was particularly bad southbound where a scheduled 10 minutes in Todmorden Bus Station was often nearer 15 - fine for me as a driver starting a mealbreak or finishing a shift, less good for through passengers, of which there were really very few at the time. Of course, there is now an option via rail that closely shadows this route, but both stations are fairly remote from their town centres. I'd be very happy to see the 589 return to give two bph from Todmorden to both Burnley and Rochdale, but I'm not holding my breath!

I'm not sure how much justification there would be to run via Bacup, which would duplicate the 464 Rochdale - Bacup and presumably replace the 8 from Bacup to Burnley? Rochdale to Edenfield is a long-lost link I agree, and scenic to boot, so maybe a Rochdale - Edenfield - Rawtenstall service might have some merit, but I doubt extending it to Burnley would add much.

 

[Andyh82]

Why would there be a bee network route to Burnley, when about 90% of the route would be outside Greater Manchester?

 

[JasonL]

Why would there be a bee network route to Burnley, when about 90% of the route would be outside Greater Manchester?

If a route were to be revived then I can see The Burnley Bus Company (Trandev) operating the route

 

[Statto]

The Rochdale - Todmorden - Burnley route was actually the 589, but it was always rather poor as a through route due to the excessive running time. This was particularly bad southbound where a scheduled 10 minutes in Todmorden Bus Station was often nearer 15 - fine for me as a driver starting a mealbreak or finishing a shift, less good for through passengers, of which there were really very few at the time. Of course, there is now an option via rail that closely shadows this route, but both stations are fairly remote from their town centres. I'd be very happy to see the 589 return to give two bph from Todmorden to both Burnley and Rochdale, but I'm not holding my breath!

I'm not sure how much justification there would be to run via Bacup, which would duplicate the 464 Rochdale - Bacup and presumably replace the 8 from Bacup to Burnley? Rochdale to Edenfield is a long-lost link I agree, and scenic to boot, so maybe a Rochdale - Edenfield - Rawtenstall service might have some merit, but I doubt extending it to Burnley would add much.

The 10 minute wait was because the 589, 591 & 592 all connected with each other at Todmorden giving a 30 minute service on each section of the route even if you had to change at Todmorden.

 

[Whisky Papa]

The 10 minute wait was because the 589, 591 & 592 all connected with each other at Todmorden giving a 30 minute service on each section of the route even if you had to change at Todmorden.

Indeed, although it was the 590 rather than 591 (which was Halifax - Heptonstall). However, both the 589 and daytime 592 could have left Burnley 5 minutes later and still comfortably made the connection.

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

On the south side of the exterior area under Greater Manchester. both Macclesfield and Buxton are served by non-Bee Line services, which seems fine as long as the service provision is good.

 

[Trackman]

If I bought a 7 or 28 day bee bus pass via app, do you buy it then activate it or does it become live straight away? I suppose you have to activate it, if this is the case how long does it sit on your phone for before it expires?
Many thanks in advance.

 

[mayneway]

If I bought a 7 or 28 day bee bus pass via app, do you buy it then activate it or does it become live straight away? I suppose you have to activate it, if this is the case how long does it sit on your phone for before it expires?
Many thanks in advance.

On the app I believe it goes live when you activate it.