BBC Panorama programme on HS2 Monday 16th September at 8PM

[jfowkes]

Of course air resistance is huge at high speeds, but is it any greater than for conventional trains IF they were both travelling at the same speed?

It's the same at the same speed (ignoring changes to the vehicle), but the whole point of maglev is to go faster. If you don't run a maglev faster, you may as well stick to the far cheaper conventional rail.

I'm not entirely disagreeing about the benefits of inter-operability, but look what's actually happened with HS2 - this very "benefit" is now leading to LOWER capacity between Birmingham and Manchester, due to the smaller passenger capacity than existing trainsets. So using this known and proven technology perhaps isn't all it's cracked up to be!

Sure, but that's an issue with politics, national infrastructure planning, economics and project management. So the same cost overruns, mismanagement and eventual scope changes and cuts would likely have happened with a maglev or an HSUK style network.

 

[Haywain]

There's another thing that most people don't talk about with HS2 and that's the ability to run wider or taller trains, with the increased space making journeys more comfortable.

Has it been specified to allow that? With links onto classic lines, the train in use will be restricted to the existing loading gauge.

 

[swt_passenger]

…At the same time that HS2 was being developed there was a serious proposal for Maglev and later there was HSUK, but people on this forum have been quick to dismiss both as crayonista exercises by enthusiasts who had little concept of real costs. Perhaps someone with greater expertise than myself then, could explain why Maglev and HSUK both deserved such scorn, and why HS2 doesn’t?

Wasn’t maglev‘s biggest problem answered here, only a week ago:

HSUK vs HS2

2 minute dwells only. You can pass through International at 100mph, Cov at 80 on the up and 75 on the down. 1725613263 For a 390 Stechford to International is 2½ pass to pass, 3½ pass to stop. International to Berkswell is 3½ pass to pass, 4 start to pass. 2 minute dwell, 3½ total loss...

www.railforums.co.uk

I don’t think asking the same question repeatedly is going to change the response.

 

[jon0844]

Has it been specified to allow that? With links onto classic lines, the train in use will be restricted to the existing loading gauge.

I thought there were to be a mix of new trains and legacy/classic trains, but what point would there be to build the bigger trains if they can't go far?

 

[Shrop]

It's the same at the same speed (ignoring changes to the vehicle), but the whole point of maglev is to go faster. If you don't run a maglev faster, you may as well stick to the far cheaper conventional rail.

But Maglev isn't just about higher speeds, it also benefits from superior acceleration, and at speeds below 100mph it's virtually silent too, which makes it far less noise-intrusive in urban areas near to stations. Swings and roundabouts!

Sure, but that's an issue with politics, national infrastructure planning, economics and project management. So the same cost overruns, mismanagement and eventual scope changes and cuts would likely have happened with a maglev or an HSUK style network.

Every political "issue" and unforeseen problem with HS2 diminishes any benefits of the proven technology. Given the track record of HS2 it almost makes one wonder if many benefits were really worthwhile at all!

 

[jfowkes]

But Maglev isn't just about higher speeds, it also benefits from superior acceleration, and at speeds below 100mph it's virtually silent too, which makes it far less noise-intrusive in urban areas near to stations. Swings and roundabouts!

I don't think those benefits are strong enough to outweigh the significant downsides of a maglev system. But that's largely a subjective opinion.

Every political "issue" and unforeseen problem with HS2 diminishes any benefits of the proven technology.

It diminishes the benefits of *any* technology, unless you are claiming that a maglev system would somehow not have suffered those same issues and problems.

 

[Shrop]

Wasn’t maglev‘s biggest problem answered here, only a week ago:

HSUK vs HS2

2 minute dwells only. You can pass through International at 100mph, Cov at 80 on the up and 75 on the down. 1725613263 For a 390 Stechford to International is 2½ pass to pass, 3½ pass to stop. International to Berkswell is 3½ pass to pass, 4 start to pass. 2 minute dwell, 3½ total loss...

www.railforums.co.uk

I don’t think asking the same question repeatedly is going to change the response.

Sorry, I didn't quite get your point, could you clarify (just a little)?

 

[eldomtom2]

I thought there were to be a mix of new trains and legacy/classic trains, but what point would there be to build the bigger trains if they can't go far?

I thought the plans for the "captive" trains were scrapped when Phase 2 was cancelled.

 

[Shrop]

I don't think those benefits are strong enough to outweigh the significant downsides of a maglev system. But that's largely a subjective opinion.


It diminishes the benefits of *any* technology, unless you are claiming that a maglev system would somehow not have suffered those same issues and problems.

I'm not entirely disagreeing, and neither have I ever been a staunch Maglev enthusiast, I just think (and still do) that HS2 thinking has always been blinkered.

 

[swt_passenger]

Sorry, I didn't quite get your point, could you clarify (just a little)?

I thought the reply in the other thread was self explanatory. So basically maglev is a dead end if the services were running onto the existing network to get to the north east and Scotland, as has always been a requirement.