BBC - Operators call for new rail lines

[blacknight]

Not going to happen I'm afraid it's a well-used cycle/foot path now

Always a chance it could if question was asked would the local population be better served by a rail service all year round & will it be cost effective such as moving school children from village to town if local councils were to invest in such a project.
Remember that if cycle path runs along the original track bed & infrastructure is inplace then minimal engineering would be required for relaying rails on its original alignment & putting up signs for cylists not to trespass on the railway

 

[Aictos]

Peterborough-Northampton, however, I'd want reopened with wires, and served by an LM Euston-Peterborough service, which could call only northampton, Wellinborough, Higham Ferrers, Thrapston and Oundle.

Won't happen due to the excessive time it would take between Euston and Peterborough not to mention the Peterborough to Yarwell Junction section is in use as the NVR so means a new line being built although I wouldn't say no to a faster link between Bedford and Peterborough as it takes just as long going via Leicester as it does going via London.

Although it probably be operated by FCC,

 

[fgwrich]

Hang on a second...

Arnt we forgetting one pretty important route here...

The Former Southern Mainline from Exeter to Plymouth Via Okehampton...

With rising tides predicted within the next few years, and the ever continueing maintenance on the sea wall at Dawlish, isnt it about time that something was made to re - open the route as a through route...even if say the route was doublefrom Plymouth to a few miles north of Tavistok, Signle with 'dynamic loops' to Meldon, and then roughly double back down to Yeoford...

That way, youve got a good diversianary route away from the sea wall and engineering works - this december was a good example with the relaying of the down line up at Marley Tunnel and the relaying of the sea wall back at Dawlish...Thus resulting in a hefty amount of weekend closures and limeted services monday to friday...

And whilst FGW would still run along the GWR Route to plymouth, they could provide the local Services along with SWT running fast services...

And another station that could do with reopening, though not as major as say kenilworth, is Chineham, on the Basingstoke to reading line...its been on the cards for years, funding has been avilible from time to time...but then Network Rail comes along and turns it down, becasue it would impact on exsisting services...yet its been on the cards since Network South East days...

And what about areas like Salisbury, where a new Park & Ride interchange has been buillt right next to the rail line[from the basingstoke end]...Yet only buses service it...And Wilton - Where now that Quidhampton has closed, why not open a Park & Ride there, serving both the SWT & FGW routes...thus giving easier acess to Salisbury from the western end, also making travelling from Wilton to Say Bristol, easier than having to go into Salisbury and change there...

As for smaller routes...And as i mentioned here on another thread before...Why can't Tram Trains be introduced...Take one place which i think would certainly suite Tram Trains would be the Fareham to Gosport route...with the trackbed still remaining for now - although Hampshire County Council is planning to turn that into another flipping Guided Busway- The trams could run from the seafront of Gosport, then onto the former heavy rail route to Fareham, then run onto the streets of fareham as trams...

sorry...wanderd off topic abit i guess...but im certainly pleased that both Washington & Ashington & Blyth are included in Atoc's plans and lets hope that we will see these routes properly re-opend with passenger services running sometime inthe near future...

rich

 

[Waverley125]

unfortunatley as we look to reopen lines some preserved lines are going to bite the dust-the lavender line on Lewes-Uckfield, for example.

And the bus service may not be full, but that's because it's slow and of terrible quality, so anyone who can afford to takes a car-which is why the A605 is one of the most congested roads in Northamptonshire. Some stuff would need bulldozing, but the link between the ECML & WCML provided, and the Peterborough-Higham Ferrers-Wellingborough-Northampton link would be very good for travel in the Nene Valley.

 

[Philip Elliott]

And the bus service may not be full, but that's because it's slow and of terrible quality, so anyone who can afford to takes a car-which is why the A605 is one of the most congested roads in Northamptonshire. Some stuff would need bulldozing, but the link between the ECML & WCML provided, and the Peterborough-Higham Ferrers-Wellingborough-Northampton link would be very good for travel in the Nene Valley.

I agree but the line never went through Higham Ferrers. It went through Irthlingborough, the station of which was called Irthlingborough & Higham Ferrers but Higham was served by a branch from Wellingborough via Rushden which has been partially re-opened as a preserved line - last weekend was the first time it has operated

Northampton - Wellingborough has got to be the priority as Northampton is completely cut off from the rest of the county!

 

[fgwrich]

unfortunatley as we look to reopen lines some preserved lines are going to bite the dust-the lavender line on Lewes-Uckfield, for example.

And the bus service may not be full, but that's because it's slow and of terrible quality....

Good Point...But a way to think of it is something Excellent to replace something thats quite good...if that makes sense...like a unexpected rose coming out of a quite well kept flower bed....

Another line which would be a good diversinary route - again where a preserved route is is the Mid Hants...Becasue, although i live in Basingstoke, i can imagine its a pain getting from say Southampton to London when the Basingstoke areas out...with a bus from Winchester...when yet 40 years ago the train would have been diverted via Alton...

Or again the Dartmoor Group - though of course now owned by British American Railroad services...so not quite a preserved line, what would to have happen of them if and when the former Southern route to Plymouth ever gets re-instated...

One thing that amazes me though is why did certain routes get axed? like the West Somerset for example, surely BR knew how poor the road connections are in the area at the time and wow, its one very lengthy line to axe...

 

[Waverley125]

they knew the cost of everything and the value of nothing.

The Northampton-Wellingborough section would obviously be the first to open, as it would provide an important link between the MML & the WCML. Then up to Rushden (the total population of the Rushden/Higham Ferrers/Irthlingborough area is nearly 40,000 btw) and then to Peterborough.

 

[A0]

And the bus service may not be full, but that's because it's slow and of terrible quality, so anyone who can afford to takes a car-which is why the A605 is one of the most congested roads in Northamptonshire. Some stuff would need bulldozing, but the link between the ECML & WCML provided, and the Peterborough-Higham Ferrers-Wellingborough-Northampton link would be very good for travel in the Nene Valley.

Except it's not that slow, it takes in all the key towns along the route - Wellingborough, Kettering and Corby - is extensively advertised and uses new vehicles - hardly "terrible quality".

That the A605 is congested won't be addressed by reopening a route across the Nene Valley. The issue, if you've ever used the road regularly, is that directionally it's the shortest way to get to the A14 if you're coming down the A1 from the north, hence it gets used alot. This would continue since alot of the traffic doesn't originate in Peterborough, nor is Northampton it's destination. A much cheaper way to resolve the A605 would be to dual it from the A1 to the A14 - it would also improve the safety of the road immeasurably.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

they knew the cost of everything and the value of nothing.

The Northampton-Wellingborough section would obviously be the first to open, as it would provide an important link between the MML & the WCML. Then up to Rushden (the total population of the Rushden/Higham Ferrers/Irthlingborough area is nearly 40,000 btw) and then to Peterborough.

The Northampton - Wellingborough link has virtually no value whatsoever. The vast majority of rail users from Northampton are heading either to MK or London. The traffic, even in rush hour, between Wellingborough and Northampton is minimal - I know, I live very close to the A45 in Northampton. The issue with the A45 is the volume of local traffic using it to get into town or different areas of the town -which the rail link would do nothing to change.

Unlikely Higham - Rushden would be worthwhile either. From the centre of Rushden to Wellingborough Station is approx 5 miles. It would be worth improving access to Wellingborough station so there is access from the east side - and this is being considered as a future development.

The only three lines in Northants which *might* be worth looking at are:

Northampton - Harborough. Largely intact trackbed and would provide a link from MK - East Midlands without the need to go via Birmingham, Nuneaton or London.

Something to link Daventry onto the national network - not sure how that would be best done though.

Northampton - Bedford if places like Olney and Turvey were to grow further.

Linking Bedford - Peterborough can be done with existing infrastructure by running via Corby, Manton and Stamford. This at least would ensure Wellingborough, Kettering and Corby received some benefit unlike the other 'across the Nene Valley' schemes which are being touted.

 

[tbtc]

That wont work, as there are no plans to put a platform on the flyover to serve Bletchley, and you cant access the station otherwise. Chiltern are likely to run an Oxford - Milton Keynes service, alongside the Aylesbury one. Diverting various XC services that way via the WCML is also being talked about.

Didn't realise that, sorry.

I though that a Chiltern service to Bedford could replace the Bletchley - Bedford service, but (if it can't stop a Bletchley) then the existing stopper would need to remain, meaning less justification for a "through" service from Oxford/ Aylesbury to Bedford.

Shame, but I suppose a bit like the Willsden flyover, where there's no way that a Milton Keynes/ Watford - Clapham Junction/ East Croydon service can call there (to interchange with the other lines etc)

Thanks for explaining

 

[whoshotjimmi]

yeah Skipton - Ilkley is a no chance unless you carve through the centre of addingham, kill a few hundred people and then it might happen...

Would it not be more polite to rehouse them?! Killing them might be a little extreme!

Just as an aside, I'm intrigued as to why so many people advocate the reopening of Skipton - Colne. Exactly what traffic would use it? Would it ever generate enough passengers to be profitable?

My problem with the whole opening lines debate is that I see very little point in opening margianlly profitable lines just to service the few people who might use it. I would rather look at lines that would relieve capacity issues on other existing lines or reopening/building new lines where there would be a substantial benefit to the local population ie urban areas (in which case you would probably be looking at light rail). Most of the rural communities that get mentioned do not even have a decent bus service, so why moeny would be spent on reinstating trains is beyond me.

 

[Waverley125]

yeah but you've got to remember that a lot of people who won't take a bus would take a train. For instance, from my town there's a very sporadic bus service to Lincoln, which takes about 2 hours. Back in 1952 there was a direct line to Sleaford and then on to Lincoln.

The A15 is one of the most convoluted & congested roads in Lincolnshire (IIRC it was the top trunk road for deaths for the last several years). The point is, the Bus service is badly used, but i'd bet that reopening the rail line would be popular, firstly because it's a train and not a bus, and secondly as it could compete with road journey times to lincoln, with the added bonus of not having to find somewhere to park in the city.

Rail lines don't just make a profit, they provide an important community service & encourage growth in the area. For instance, Skegness is currently derided as a run-down seaside resort & place for older people to retire. But if the Boston-Spalding and Firsby-Lincoln lines were reopened, it's slash journey times to London & Lincoln, and bring this part of 'green desert' back into the fold as an important region of the country.

 

[Mystic Force]

This is a report by TOCs which have contrscts so you can expect only lines they expect to increase profit in a short time frame. So the most likely candidates are existing freight lines and where connecting chourds are needed beyond that nothing else is likely going to be done unless we the tax payer does it.

 

[whoshotjimmi]

yeah but you've got to remember that a lot of people who won't take a bus would take a train. For instance, from my town there's a very sporadic bus service to Lincoln, which takes about 2 hours. Back in 1952 there was a direct line to Sleaford and then on to Lincoln.

The A15 is one of the most convoluted & congested roads in Lincolnshire (IIRC it was the top trunk road for deaths for the last several years). The point is, the Bus service is badly used, but i'd bet that reopening the rail line would be popular, firstly because it's a train and not a bus, and secondly as it could compete with road journey times to lincoln, with the added bonus of not having to find somewhere to park in the city.

Rail lines don't just make a profit, they provide an important community service & encourage growth in the area. For instance, Skegness is currently derided as a run-down seaside resort & place for older people to retire. But if the Boston-Spalding and Firsby-Lincoln lines were reopened, it's slash journey times to London & Lincoln, and bring this part of 'green desert' back into the fold as an important region of the country.

I personally don't think the A15 is that bad. The road out of Lincoln towards Newark (can't remember the number) is much worse IMO. Of course, a rail link exists between those two points. I think that is enough to suggest that a rail link wouldn't necessarily improve the traffic situation. I have also been relatively pleased with the parking in Lincoln - bit on the dear side. Maybe I've had good experiences, I don't know.

That aside, when it comes to opening a new line, it has to make business sense and therefore a profit. Benefits to the local community, regardless of how important, would have to play second fiddle to the profit making ability of the line. Let's not forget, the majority of closed lines were closed because they made a loss. I think that if a line is to be reopened for local benefits then there would have to be massive investment and subsidy from local councils. In rural communities, where spending is less than in urban conurbations, this will probably not be forthcoming. In fairness to Skegness though, it is only as bad as pretty much every other coastal town in England.