Bad Signal Placement

[LucaZone]

Whats this signal doing on the approach to Havant heading towards London from Portsmouth. Its certainly a new installation since the through track was removed.

From watching cab videos as well as observing sat and ariel footage, it seems that the signal for entering Havant platform 2(?) is mounted in the middle of the junction. Its not for the Up line as there is a signal for that line north of the tracks also alongside the bridge.

Thus am I right in thinking that it would be possible for a train to arrive from Bedhampton and get stopped at this signal, which in doing so would block both up and down lines?

Anyone know more about this placement?

 

[bengley]

It most certainly isn't new since most google maps pictures were taken around 2003-2005.

 

[Tomnick]

If blocking both roads by standing a train at that signal is going to be a problem, then presumably the train won't be signalled towards it in the first place. It's going to block the up road whether it stands at that signal, or the one in rear, and if there's an down train to pass first, then it'll have to be held at the one in rear (if the locking doesn't ensure that - i.e. the down train isn't already signalled through Havant - then common sense hopefully will). On the other hand, locating that signal closer (probably more significant on the up line than the down) will allow an arriving train to more closely follow a departing train into the platform, which will be rather useful - I don't know the area at all, but I suspect that's why the design is as it is.

 

[LucaZone]

In line with your thoughts, its almost like the signal is a waste of time. A train can only be signalled passed it at all times, as being stopped by it will cause conflict with other lines.

Why they didnt just place a signal before the diverging junction on the up line (50>100m back up the line), and thus remove the requirement to have two signals at that location, I guess we will never know.

It most certainly isn't new since most google maps pictures were taken around 2003-2005.

I would have thought that was new in signalling terms....

 

[Tomnick]

In line with your thoughts, its almost like the signal is a waste of time. A train can only be signalled passed it at all times, as being stopped by it will cause conflict with other lines.

Why they didnt just place a signal before the diverging junction on the up line (50>100m back up the line), and thus remove the requirement to have two signals at that location, I guess we will never know.

Placing the signal 100yds - 200yds in rear of the crossover (is there also a trailing crossover to protect?) would prevent a second train from following a departing train so closely into the platform. The extra half-minute or so would have a noticeable impact on headways and hence the capacity of the whole line. I see your point about the signal for up direction movements on the down line, but that'll probably just be a consequence of the signalling on the up line, to maintain consistency (and signal spacing!) across both lines.

 

[Darandio]

It most certainly isn't new since most google maps pictures were taken around 2003-2005.

Not necessarily, there are ongoing updates. I use GM quite often to check on things for route building in Railworks and some places have different shots to what was there only 6 months ago.

 

[90019]

Not necessarily, there are ongoing updates. I use GM quite often to check on things for route building in Railworks and some places have different shots to what was there only 6 months ago.

The ones around the centre of Edinburgh have been taken within the past couple of weeks (The ever changing roadworks have some use )

Edit: Or not, I mistook them for ones that were there about a year ago

 

[2030720310]

They've moved the signals at Tamworth, which is probably useful for drivers but now we can't see (from the top level platforms) if anything is heading southbound on the lower level