Avanti West Coast Rolling Stock Updates

[Speed43125]

I presume the 807s and 805s can multi with each other? If so, could such a combination, theoretically at least, run in passenger service as 12x26m?

 

[Bletchleyite]

I presume the 807s and 805s can multi with each other? If so, could such a combination, theoretically at least, run in passenger service as 12x26m?

I'd imagine they theoretically could (fairly sure all 80x can multi), but there aren't an awful lot of platforms that would fit a 312m train (though more post HS2) so it'd be very limited stop indeed. It'd fit anywhere the Highland Sleeper does.

 

[ShadowKnight]

I thought the second Liverpool was going to split/join with another train from n.wales?

 

[Sorcerer]

I didn't realise a bi-mode and electric train could couple up together and form one single unit. I can imagine an 805 under electric power is probably compatible with an 807 but what about on non-electrified routes? Could an 805 in theory carry an 807 to Holyhead even though over half the train is without traction power?

 

[Bletchleyite]

I thought the second Liverpool was going to split/join with another train from n.wales?

That's HS2 and it's the Lancaster semifast.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 14 Jun 2022 ==

I didn't realise a bi-mode and electric train could couple up together and form one single unit. I can imagine an 805 under electric power is probably compatible with an 807 but what about on non-electrified routes? Could an 805 in theory carry an 807 to Holyhead even though over half the train is without traction power?

In short, yes, it can. Albeit slowly.

 

[krus_aragon]

I thought the second Liverpool was going to split/join with another train from n.wales?

That's HS2 and it's the Lancaster semifast.

For the avoidance of doubt, some Liverpool and Lancaster services are due to split/join on HS2; there are no plans for North Wales HS2 services due to lack of electrification (hence the bi-mode 805s).

 

[Sorcerer]

In short, yes, it can. Albeit slowly.

Interesting. Of course I doubt this would happen in practice but it's still an interesting thought.

 

[Huntergreed]

Is there any further issues with the refurbished sets? I notice that, out of all 6 sets, only 1 (125) is out today.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Interesting. Of course I doubt this would happen in practice but it's still an interesting thought.

LNER actually do it in service on the Bradfords - one DMU and one EMU, both 5-cars. Though their "EMU" version has one generator set for hotel power, I don't know if Avanti's do so it might be hard on the batteries.

 

[Sorcerer]

LNER actually do it in service on the Bradfords - one DMU and one EMU, both 5-cars. Though their "EMU" version has one generator set for hotel power, I don't know if Avanti's do so it might be hard on the batteries.

Are these the same generators used in the event of electrical overhead line failure?

 

[Bletchleyite]

Are these the same generators used in the event of electrical overhead line failure?

Yes.

 

[Sorcerer]

Yes.

Ahh, figures. Interesting to know, however. But then when it comes to Avanti I imagine such a practice won't be commonplace seeing as an 805 and 807 combined would be longer than most platforms on their routes. Liverpool Lime Street can barely accommodate an eleven coach Pendolino so a 12-car 805/807 pairing with 26-metre coaches would definitely not fit.

 

[skyhigh]

LNER actually do it in service on the Bradfords - one DMU and one EMU, both 5-cars. Though their "EMU" version has one generator set for hotel power, I don't know if Avanti's do so it might be hard on the batteries.

They do it on some Harrogate services. The Bradford route is fully electrified.

 

[Dave91131]

They do it on some Harrogate services. The Bradford route is fully electrified.

It's also done over some fairly long distances on diversion during engineering works - Newcastle to Carlisle via Hexham, Newcastle to Northallerton via Durham coast and Peterborough to "unknown point" (somewhere near Royston I think) via March are examples.

 

[JakeMurphy]

390157 has returned to edge hill with 390131 going the other way.

 

[LNW-GW Joint]

With regards to the Class 807 is it actually looking likely that we will get a second Liverpool service every hour? I understand that some of them will be replacing the Voyagers on West Midlands routes but was the stock order placed with the provisions for a second Liverpool service in mind? So far I haven't heard much in the way of approval by the Office of Road and Rail, nor about any increased demand for a second Liverpool service which may have dropped following the pandemic.

807s are supposed to be freeing up enough Pendolinos to allow Euston-Birmingham-Scotland services to be fully 390s, replacing the Voyagers.
That seems to include some Euston-Birmingham and Euston-Liverpool services (possibly also Blackpool).
It has been said that 807s themselves will not go beyond Preston, and the new WCML speed profile for them will go as far as Weaver Jn (for Liverpool).
Talk of extra services is a bit moot when Avanti is still not running a pre-covid frequency, with Preston-Glasgow and Chester/North Wales still way below par.
If they don't restore Chester/North Wales there will be spare 805s too, just as there are spare Voyagers now.
As far as one can tell Avanti is still negotiating its longer term National Rail Contract.

 

[Some guy]

807s are supposed to be freeing up enough Pendolinos to allow Euston-Birmingham-Scotland services to be fully 390s, replacing the Voyagers.
That seems to include some Euston-Birmingham and Euston-Liverpool services (possibly also Blackpool).
It has been said that 807s themselves will not go beyond Preston, and the new WCML speed profile for them will go as far as Weaver Jn (for Liverpool).
Talk of extra services is a bit moot when Avanti is still not running a pre-covid frequency, with Preston-Glasgow and Chester/North Wales still way below par.
If they don't restore Chester/North Wales there will be spare 805s too, just as there are spare Voyagers now.
As far as one can tell Avanti is still negotiating its longer term National Rail Contract.

It’s shocking they still aren’t bringing the Birmingham Glasgow services back in December especially when it’s how busy you they are now. If they don’t return it then some 807s should run the Euston-Birmingham-Blackpool services it would make sense considering Preston drivers and train managers would need to be trained on them

 

[Agent_Squash]

It’s shocking they still aren’t bringing the Birmingham Glasgow services back in December especially when it’s how busy you they are now. If they don’t return it then some 807s should run the Euston-Birmingham-Blackpool services it would make sense considering Preston drivers and train managers would need to be trained on them

What’s the point in training Preston drivers on them when the grand plan is not to have them running north of Weaver Junction?

 

[Efini92]

What’s the point in training Preston drivers on them when the grand plan is not to have them running north of Weaver Junction?

They’re running to Blackpool

 

[Agent_Squash]

They’re running to Blackpool

Is the plan to run them in the spare path out of Euston - or is it in place of the other Euston-Birmingham-Scotland?

 

[Efini92]

Is the plan to run them in the spare path out of Euston - or is it in place of the other Euston-Birmingham-Scotland?

I think they’re just going to run on the existing Blackpool’s.
I believe it’s all going to coincide with crewe depot opening as Preston drivers aren’t going to sign them.

 

[voyagerdude220]

Is Avanti stopping using their 221s in December or is this likely to be delayed because the new fleet is unlikely to be ready by then?

 

[Efini92]

Is Avanti stopping using their 221s in December or is this likely to be delayed because the new fleet is unlikely to be ready by then?

They’ll still be using them in December. They just won’t be going to Scotland.

 

[Bletchleyite]

They’ll still be using them in December. They just won’t be going to Scotland.

Presumably they'll just go onto the 80x diagrams (i.e. North Wales plus the London-Brum semifast), to be swapped out with 80x once they are in service, with the second Liverpool not introduced until they do arrive? Plus I guess filling in for Pendolinos off for refurb.

 

[Efini92]

Presumably they'll just go onto the 80x diagrams (i.e. North Wales plus the London-Brum semifast), to be swapped out with 80x once they are in service, with the second Liverpool not introduced until they do arrive? Plus I guess filling in for Pendolinos off for refurb.

That would make sense.

 

[AJDesiro]

390 154 terminating at WVH operating 9S70 after technical incidents. Is it just me, or do the refurbished units seem to be prone to issues?

 

[Peter0124]

390 154 terminating at WVH operating 9S70 after technical incidents. Is it just me, or do the refurbished units seem to be prone to issues?

Heard 390155 had a leak aswell probably from the AC.

 

[voyagerdude220]

They’ll still be using them in December. They just won’t be going to Scotland.

Thanks for that.

 

[Some guy]

What’s the point in training Preston drivers on them when the grand plan is not to have them running north of Weaver Junction?

Well maybe because Preston does Crewe to Chester so would need training and Crewe train managers isn’t for a few years it’s drivers only

 

[dereksingh291]

What's happening with 221142-221143 that are no longer in use?