Avanti delay repay unsuccessful - advice please

[blakey1152]

Good afternoon,
I received this reply from Avanti regarding a Delay repay claim from last month

Unfortunately, your application has been turned down as we have found an identical claim on our system. If you have made a claim on behalf of another customer, you need to ensure that all the customer contact details and payment details are those of the customer who experienced the delay, otherwise this will result in a 'duplicate claim' which will be rejected. If you believe that there are mitigating circumstances, for example you are claiming on behalf of dependants or children, please resubmit your claim explaining this. You will receive a response regarding your original claim shortly.

First of all there were two claims submitted . One was automatically approved by Avanti as it was an advance ticket from Birmingham to Euston. No problem with that.

However whilst in Birmingham I used my bank card to buy a single ticket to return back with me on the same train and to Woolwich Arsenal not Euston.

So as I purchased the ticket for someone else it seems that Avanti are refusing the claim. I don't understand why I need to put their details in when I bought the ticket.
I also find it frustrating that they've flagged it as an identical claim when it's to a different destination, the ticket was purchased the day before the journey was made and it's a single not an advanced ticket.

The person I bought the ticket for currently does not have a UK bank account either.

So I'm asking for advice on what to put for an appeal. As far as I'm concerned surely the purchaser of the ticket (even if it is for someone else) should claim back the delay repay

Thank you

 

[Haywain]

I'm not sure why you seem surprised that they've rejected one of two claims that both state that you were travelling on the same train. All you need to do is explain to Avanti what you've explained to us, but with some more detail for them about the other person. However, you should be aware that it is the person travelling who is entitled to compensation rather than the ticket purchaser.

 

[Class800]

I'm not sure why you seem surprised that they've rejected one of two claims that both state that you were travelling on the same train. All you need to do is explain to Avanti what you've explained to us, but with some more detail for them about the other person. However, you should be aware that it is the person travelling who is entitled to compensation rather than the ticket purchaser.

Yes agreed, it is the traveller who is eligible not the purchaser - so actually the traveller should complete the form. If you buy tickets for someone else's journey, this is a risk you take and whether the traveller agrees to give the compensation to the purchaser is a private matter between them, as contractually it is the traveller who is entitled to delay repay not the ticket purchaser

 

[Fawkes Cat]

Good afternoon,
I received this reply from Avanti regarding a Delay repay claim from last month

Unfortunately, your application has been turned down as we have found an identical claim on our system. If you have made a claim on behalf of another customer, you need to ensure that all the customer contact details and payment details are those of the customer who experienced the delay, otherwise this will result in a 'duplicate claim' which will be rejected. If you believe that there are mitigating circumstances, for example you are claiming on behalf of dependants or children, please resubmit your claim explaining this. You will receive a response regarding your original claim shortly.

First of all there were two claims submitted . One was automatically approved by Avanti as it was an advance ticket from Birmingham to Euston. No problem with that.

However whilst in Birmingham I used my bank card to buy a single ticket to return back with me on the same train and to Woolwich Arsenal not Euston.

So as I purchased the ticket for someone else it seems that Avanti are refusing the claim. I don't understand why I need to put their details in when I bought the ticket.
I also find it frustrating that they've flagged it as an identical claim when it's to a different destination, the ticket was purchased the day before the journey was made and it's a single not an advanced ticket.

The person I bought the ticket for currently does not have a UK bank account either.

So I'm asking for advice on what to put for an appeal. As far as I'm concerned surely the purchaser of the ticket (even if it is for someone else) should claim back the delay repay

Thank you

Thinking about this practically rather than as a matter of principle, if Avanti's systems are set up to expect the traveller's details rather than the purchaser's, then if you want to resolve things you need to go with what Avanti want. Unfortunately, I don't know if Avanti's systems will accept submissions with different names but identical bank details as being different from each other. But on this point, my advice would be to say that claim 1 was in respect of blakey1152, while claim 2 was in respect of blakey1152's-friend (obviously using the appropriate real names...)

I can also see why they describe claim 2 as being 'identical': it is for the same train. This isn't a common (or correct) use of the term 'identical' but they are using 'identical' to mean 'claimed for the same delay'. If you can get Avanti to understand that there were two travellers then this problem should surely melt away.

 

[SuspectUsual]

If all else fails, and the same bank details can't be used for both claims, do Avanti offer DR payments in national rail travel vouchers?

 

[Class800]

If all else fails, and the same bank details can't be used for both claims, do Avanti offer DR payments in national rail travel vouchers?

But they will be sent to the traveller if the form is completed correctly - while it is fair to criticise TOCs when they make errors, I do not see an error here - the delay repay is due to the traveller and the ticket purchaser incorrectly tried to claim delay repay for the journey of another passenger

 

[Snow1964]

It seems as if each traveler has to claim

Not sure why if a group or family travel, you can’t attach all the tickets. Would seem more work for Avanti to have to process 2 claims than 1 claim covering 2 people.

Maybe it is a job creation scheme, and their claim staff need more work, because they are sitting around with all claims already processed.

 

[Fawkes Cat]

It seems as if each traveler has to claim

Not sure why if a group or family travel, you can’t attach all the tickets. Would seem more work for Avanti to have to process 2 claims than 1 claim covering 2 people.

Maybe it is a job creation scheme, and their claim staff need more work, because they are sitting around with all claims already processed.

It seems to me inherently simpler from a processing point of view to have a system which only deals with claims of one traveller / one journey than a system which can also cope with multiple travellers / one journey.

Please note that this is purely looking at it from a processinf point of view - not from the point of view of what is customer friendly.

 

[blakey1152]

The reason I find it odd as I purchased the ticket is if I bought say an electrical item from a store and gave it to a friend and after purchase it went down in price at another store and the original store price matched it and agreed to refund the difference they wouldn't give it to my friend they would require it went back on the original card used for purchase.

I can also see that it is the traveller is inconvienced so should be entitled to claim back the delay repay.

Logically though, two seperate tickets were bought so delay repay should be repayable for both. If I had been trying to claim twice on one ticket then I would have expected them to decline it but no. There were two seperate valid tickets held.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 6 Jan 2022 ==

It seems to me inherently simpler from a processing point of view to have a system which only deals with claims of one traveller / one journey than a system which can also cope with multiple travellers / one journey.

Please note that this is purely looking at it from a processinf point of view - not from the point of view of what is customer friendly.

It probably easier to process but if I was travelling with say a 4 year old child and I have obviously bought their ticket I wouldn't expect a 4 year old to have to put their details in to claim back delay repay.

So why should it be any different if the ticket was purchased for an adult?

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 6 Jan 2022 ==

So I put it on twitter and Avanti have responded back saying that if I purchased the tickets I can claim for them!

 

[Haywain]

Logically though, two seperate tickets were bought so delay repay should be repayable for both. If I had been trying to claim twice on one ticket then I would have expected them to decline it but no. There were two seperate valid tickets held.

It is quite possible for someone to be in possession of more than one ticket which is valid for a journey they make, but they still only get to claim once.

 

[SuspectUsual]

But they will be sent to the traveller if the form is completed correctly - while it is fair to criticise TOCs when they make errors, I do not see an error here - the delay repay is due to the traveller and the ticket purchaser incorrectly tried to claim delay repay for the journey of another passenger

Indeed, but they could then be passed on. It seems a slightly cumbersome method but if the traveller doesn't have a UK bank account it may be the only option

 

[robbeech]

I do not see an error here

No error as such, but a poor response. They could ask a question rather that rejecting outright. A reasonable customer service team would do this.

Not sure why if a group or family travel, you can’t attach all the tickets. Would seem more work for Avanti to have to process 2 claims than 1 claim covering 2 people.

The systems are automated in the first instance. They’re designed by people with very limited knowledge on implementing automated delay repay systems. They’re conveniently set up biased quite heavily towards rejecting claims.

The reason I find it odd as I purchased the ticket is if I bought say an electrical item from a store and gave it to a friend and after purchase it went down in price at another store and the original store price matched it and agreed to refund the difference they wouldn't give it to my friend they would require it went back on the original card used for purchase.

That’s because delay repay is NOT A REFUND it’s a compensation scheme which compensates the passenger for poor service. The figures might be the same and if the purchaser is the traveller which will be the case on most journeys then it might appear to be the same end result but the method is very different.

To butcher your electrical item analogy. It would be more akin to you buying an electrical item and giving it to your friend, it being faulty and burning them and them claiming against the manufacturer (not the retailer) for personal injury. They wouldn’t give that to you just because you bought it.

 

[island]

Good afternoon,
I received this reply from Avanti regarding a Delay repay claim from last month

Unfortunately, your application has been turned down as we have found an identical claim on our system. If you have made a claim on behalf of another customer, you need to ensure that all the customer contact details and payment details are those of the customer who experienced the delay, otherwise this will result in a 'duplicate claim' which will be rejected. If you believe that there are mitigating circumstances, for example you are claiming on behalf of dependants or children, please resubmit your claim explaining this. You will receive a response regarding your original claim shortly.

First of all there were two claims submitted . One was automatically approved by Avanti as it was an advance ticket from Birmingham to Euston. No problem with that.

However whilst in Birmingham I used my bank card to buy a single ticket to return back with me on the same train and to Woolwich Arsenal not Euston.

So as I purchased the ticket for someone else it seems that Avanti are refusing the claim. I don't understand why I need to put their details in when I bought the ticket.
I also find it frustrating that they've flagged it as an identical claim when it's to a different destination, the ticket was purchased the day before the journey was made and it's a single not an advanced ticket.

The person I bought the ticket for currently does not have a UK bank account either.

So I'm asking for advice on what to put for an appeal. As far as I'm concerned surely the purchaser of the ticket (even if it is for someone else) should claim back the delay repay

Thank you

The claim needs to be submitted by the person who travelled, not the person who purchased the ticket.

I am not sure what payment methods Avanti offer for compensation but many TOCs offer options such as PayPal or a payment to a Visa card, as well as Rail Travel Vouchers.

 

[Deafdoggie]

I once purchased one adult and three child tickets with a family railcard for a XC journey. It was part cancelled on the day. DR applied for, rejected. Each person had to apply for their own!! Or, as a generous offer from XC, I could provide a phone number and they'd speak to all four of us to make sure everyone agreed I could claim for everyone.
I replied, with my phone number, saying I and one of the children were deaf and can't hear a phone conversation and the youngest child was six and would happily talk to them for hours on the phone about cbeebies. I wished XC luck with it all.
They sent the due DR by return instead.

 

[blakey1152]

Avanti did finally agree to pay Delay Repay - took them a long time and kept requiring more information but it's sorted and the money is in the bank (I did wait for that before posting this - just in case of a last minute payment derailment)