Avanti cancellations - is it always this bad?

[Tom B]

Needing to travel to Birmingham today, I booked tickets with Avanti for Watford-Birmingham.

I checked last night and lucky I did, the 10.31 has been cancelled, along with 56 other services due to "lack of staff". As a result my choice is to either travel an hour earlier (and loiter around at my destination early) or an hour later (and be late).

Is this par for the course now? 56 cancellations is surely more than the odd sickness or hiccup. I know a few years ago they had issues but, given nothing was warned about when I booked, I assumed the advertised timetable was run.

 

[footprints]

Aren't there also 38 Avanti services already removed from the timetable for over the summer? So the 56 cancellations today is effectively 94 services they're not operating compared to the full timetable. Then there's the many partial cancellations on top of that, such as 0800 Glasgow to Euston terminating at Preston.

 

[D6130]

Aren't there also 38 Avanti services already removed from the timetable for over the summer? So the 56 cancellations today is effectively 94 services they're not operating compared to the full timetable. Then there's the many partial cancellations on top of that, such as 0800 Glasgow to Euston terminating at Preston.

My wife and I were supposed to be travelling from Glasgow to Rugeley today for a friend's significant birthday party. First thing I did on waking up was to check Real Time Trains. Both the 09 42 and 10 41 (which we had intended to take) from Glasgow Central to Euston have been cancelled. We're now on our way to Edinburgh or Haymarket to try and intercept the 10 52, which is reported running, as far as Stafford. Are Avanti drivers and/or train managers banning rest day working at the moment?

 

[Mcr Warrior]

We're now on our way to Edinburgh or Haymarket to try and intercept the 08 52, which is reported running, as far as Stafford.

Do you mean the 10:52 Avanti (from Edinburgh Waverley)? The 08:52 was yet another cancellation! Good luck with your journey!

 

[D6130]

Do you mean the 10:52 Avanti (from Edinburgh Waverley)? The 08:52 was yet another cancellation! Good luck with your journey!

I do indeed! I'm afraid I'm a bit weary after a late night and comparatively early start. Thanks for the good wishes. (Previous post edited).

 

[dk1]

Looks like Avanti currently have no rest day working agreement with ASLEF so this will become the norm until they do. I see the planned cancellations have increased from full/part 28/7 to 57/19 already for today.

 

[KNN]

Looks like Avanti currently have no rest day working agreement with ASLEF so this will become the norm until they do. I see the planned cancellations have increased from full/part 28/7 to 57/19 already for today.

It's this, plus animals on the line in the Lake District somewhere knocking things out of synch.

 

[dk1]

It's this, plus animals on the line in the Lake District somewhere knocking things out of synch.

I think the latter had a small effect but with the lack of drivers recovery from any disruption will be limited.

 

[D6130]

My wife and I were supposed to be travelling from Glasgow to Rugeley today for a friend's significant birthday party. First thing I did on waking up was to check Real Time Trains. Both the 09 42 and 10 41 (which we had intended to take) from Glasgow Central to Euston have been cancelled. We're now on our way to Edinburgh or Haymarket to try and intercept the 10 52, which is reported running, as far as Stafford. Are Avanti drivers and/or train managers banning rest day working at the moment?

We made the connection at Haymarket onto 9M54....so we're now hoping that there will be a driver available to take us on from Preston. The train is surprisingly uncrowded, considering that the previous Avanti service from Edinburgh was cancelled. However I suspect that it will be a different story from Carlisle, with two consecutive Glasgow-Eustons via the Trent Valley cancelled.

 

[800002]

They're not even specific about the reason for the current situation on their website landing page.

This weekend, from Friday 7 to Sunday 9 August, we're seeing some short-notice cancellations on our network, so please check your journey before you travel. We're really sorry if this affects you and your journey, but we're working hard to make sure we can minimise these cancellations.

If you've already booked and your journey is impacted, we'll be in touch to let you know your options. Trains are likely to be busy, so please do check before you travel at the link below.

If your train is cancelled, your ticket is valid on one of the two Avanti West Coast services immediately before your booked train, or one of the two immediately after.
If your journey's delayed 15 minutes or more, you can claim compensation at delayrepay.avantiwestcoast.co.uk.
If you no longer wish to travel because your train's delayed or cancelled, you can request a full refund from where you bought your ticket.

 

[ScottGallagher]

I thought all this was sorted out a couple of years ago when they recruited extra staff to rely less on overtime?

 

[D6130]

I thought all this was sorted out a couple of years ago when they recruited extra staff to rely less on overtime?

Yes....but many more staff have retired since then.

 

[dk1]

I thought all this was sorted out a couple of years ago when they recruited extra staff to rely less on overtime?

It’s a never ending cycle. Overtime will always be required in such railway operating jobs.

 

[ScottGallagher]

It’s a never ending cycle. Overtime will always be required in such railway operating jobs.

I always thought it was a tad optimistic then again statements by ministers in parliament ( there was an actual emergency debate as i remember) arent always what they are cracked up to be....

 

[dk1]

I always thought it was a tad optimistic then again statements by ministers in parliament ( there was an actual emergency debate as i remember) arent always what they are cracked up to be....

You never actually know when drivers retire these days. Myself and several colleagues have all recently left. In my case it was 10 years early. Just gave 3 months notice.

 

[Mcr Warrior]

My wife and I were supposed to be travelling from Glasgow to Rugeley today for a friend's significant birthday party.

What time did you eventually arrive Rugeley TV. Maybe 14:45?

 

[trainophile]

School holidays. Parents want to be with their kids not working, or are on pre-booked leave. Always the same, and somehow seems worse at half term times, probably as everyone wants to be off in the same one week period.

 

[Tom B]

Surely there is somebody, probably quite highly paid, working in an office working out what workforce they'll need in the next 1, 2, 5, 10 years time - especially with grades which require a long lead time, such as drivers.
There will be cases of course where this isn't 100% accurate, but surely the overall rates are known.
60+ cancellations listed today isn't a small issue.
Seems very much like the attitude is to cancel ahoy rather than work out their staffing needs properly.

 

[dk1]

Surely there is somebody, probably quite highly paid, working in an office working out what workforce they'll need in the next 1, 2, 5, 10 years time - especially with grades which require a long lead time, such as drivers.
There will be cases of course where this isn't 100% accurate, but surely the overall rates are known.
60+ cancellations listed today isn't a small issue.
Seems very much like the attitude is to cancel ahoy rather than work out their staffing needs properly.

Trouble is the DfT seem to be pulling the strings. It’s rarely going to end well when politicians are involved in the day today running of our railways.

 

[AndrewE]

Trouble is the DfT seem to be pulling the strings. It’s rarely going to end well when politicians are involved in the day today running of our railways.

Trouble is that DfT aren't politicians... They are civil servants - who won't get voted out of office no matter how bad the service is - doing what they think politicians want them to do (or only proposing things that they think the Treasury will go along with.)

 

[dk1]

Trouble is that DfT aren't politicians... They are civil servants - who won't get voted out of office no matter how bad the service is - doing what they think politicians want them to do (or only proposing things that they think the Treasury will go along with.)

Makes you appreciate how straightforward things where before the pandemic.

 

[Tom B]

At the end of the day, I had the choice today of driving or getting the train. I thought I'd do the latter as it was supposedly quicker, easier, etc. As they clearly don't wish people to actually travel without being messed around and delayed, I will do as they want and drive next time!

 

[Canary73]

I’m just returning back from Preston having left on this morning’s 0830. There have been several cancellations and this one which started from Preston instead of Glasgow is 60 late. They’ve declassified first class and said people can opted for the one just behind. I decided to sit out the hour at a very busy station with a few Glasgow and Edinburgh trains cancelled

 

[route101]

A few late running Avanti's northbound at Carlisle this evening, jumped on a ex Liverpool TPE to Glasgow. I had an on time service last weekend and that was the first arrival in a while on time into Glasgow.

 

[MontyP]

When they say they are "working hard to make sure we can minimise these cancellations", what exactly do they mean?

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 8 Aug 2026 ==

School holidays. Parents want to be with their kids not working, or are on pre-booked leave. Always the same, and somehow seems worse at half term times, probably as everyone wants to be off in the same one week period.

But surely drivers can't just take holidays whenever they want, it has to be approved so that staffing levels are maintained? That's how it works in any normal industry.

 

[D1537]

But surely drivers can't just take holidays whenever they want, it has to be approved so that staffing levels are maintained? That's how it works in any normal industry.

Pre-booked leave will indeed have been approved. However, "normal industries" don't require their staff to work overtime to maintain minimum staffing levels...

 

[dk1]

At the end of the day, I had the choice today of driving or getting the train. I thought I'd do the latter as it was supposedly quicker, easier, etc. As they clearly don't wish people to actually travel without being messed around and delayed, I will do as they want and drive next time!

Or just book the train and get a free ride thanks to delay repay. The DfT pays after all

 

[teaspoon]

I've been doing Glasgow - London every few weeks, and it felt like things were starting to improve at the beginning on the year. My last few trips have had plenty to go wrong - not all of it Avanti's fault, in fairness - but it's rare to have a trip that doesn't involve some Delay Repay. It's nice to get the money back, but I do often wonder if we'd see tangible improvements if that money could be invested in a more reliable railway instead.

 

[D6130]

What time did you eventually arrive Rugeley TV. Maybe 14:45?

14 44, to be precise....having been stopped for about a minute on the approach to Colwich Junction to allow the late-running 1A53, 13 35 Manchester Piccadilly-Euston to precede.

 

[Ballyheigue]

I think what's really needed is a complete re-cast of the timetable so overtime is minimised as much as it can be, even if that means significant reductions in frequency, at least then you'll have a better chance of the train running. There are several instances of 2 trains timetabled to run together on sections of route, like 2 London trains between Carlisle, Oxenholme and Preston, ok so both take different routes south of Preston and there may be Penrith missed by one of them, but why not just have one of them run from the North with a call at Penrith with the other starting at Preston and passengers changing? I don't see the issue myself of changing trains if it means the majority of timetabled workings can run with existing realistic staffing levels. They seem to be operating beyond their realistic means so things should be cut back.