Autumn refresh for GWR Class 165/166 Turbos

[Snow1964]

It is very similar to Paddington to Reading/Oxford stopping services though

Tend to be used much more intensively without much of a midday lull (in Network South East days regularly about half fleet was parked up between peaks and from mid evening)

Many now seem to be diagrammed nearer 16 hours a day.

 

[Class172]

That's what they did for over 20 years, I don't see why it's an issue now

Spare parts become harder to source or manufacture as time goes on, leading to stock sat out-of-use for longer periods of time as they await repair. Not necessarily a problem of the Turbo fleet, but a lot of 1990s-designed things are filled with the sort of technology that is particularly hard to replace as they are sandwiched between simpler electro-mechanical controls that predate that era, but come before the development of fully computer-dependent systems where things like software upgrades can be easily applied.

 

[Horizon22]

That's what they did for over 20 years, I don't see why it's an issue now

You don't tend to keep your car for 20 years. Trains reaching 30+ years old are getting towards end of life and spare parts become harder to procure.

 

[Mike Machin]

Time they went for recycling.

 

[smithy_37688]

166206 returned last night on 5Q81 from Doncaster.

Realtime Trains | 5Q81 1858 Doncaster Works Wabtec to St Philips Marsh Depot Fhh | 24/05/2024

Real-time train running information for 5Q81 1858 departure from Doncaster Works Wabtec to St Philips Marsh Depot Fhh on 24/05/2024. From Realtime Trains, an independent source of train running info for Great Britain.

www.realtimetrains.co.uk

5Q23 path to Doncaster from SPM in this afternoon.

Realtime Trains | 5Q23 1508 St Philips Mrsh H S T D to Doncaster West Yard | 25/05/2024

Real-time train running information for 5Q23 1508 departure from St Philips Mrsh H S T D to Doncaster West Yard on 25/05/2024. From Realtime Trains, an independent source of train running info for Great Britain.

www.realtimetrains.co.uk

Any idea what unit maybe going next please?
Many Thanks !

 

[CR165022]

5Q23 path to Doncaster from SPM in this afternoon.

Realtime Trains | 5Q23 1508 St Philips Mrsh H S T D to Doncaster West Yard | 25/05/2024

Real-time train running information for 5Q23 1508 departure from St Philips Mrsh H S T D to Doncaster West Yard on 25/05/2024. From Realtime Trains, an independent source of train running info for Great Britain.

www.realtimetrains.co.uk

Any idea what unit maybe going next please?
Many Thanks !

166213

 

[smithy_37688]

166213

Many thanks!

 

[3973EXL]

166208

Realtime Trains | 5Q81 0849 Wolverton Centre Sidings to St Philips Mrsh H S T D | 05/06/2024

Real-time train running information for 5Q81 0849 departure from Wolverton Centre Sidings to St Philips Mrsh H S T D on 05/06/2024. From Realtime Trains, an independent source of train running info for Great Britain.

www.realtimetrains.co.uk

Realtime Trains | 5Q70 1129½ St Philips Marsh Depot Fhh to Wolverton Centre Sidings | 05/06/2024

Real-time train running information for 5Q70 1129½ departure from St Philips Marsh Depot Fhh to Wolverton Centre Sidings on 05/06/2024. From Realtime Trains, an independent source of train running info for Great Britain.

www.realtimetrains.co.uk

 

[Train Boy]

166208

Realtime Trains | 5Q81 0849 Wolverton Centre Sidings to St Philips Mrsh H S T D | 05/06/2024

Real-time train running information for 5Q81 0849 departure from Wolverton Centre Sidings to St Philips Mrsh H S T D on 05/06/2024. From Realtime Trains, an independent source of train running info for Great Britain.

www.realtimetrains.co.uk

Realtime Trains | 5Q70 1129½ St Philips Marsh Depot Fhh to Wolverton Centre Sidings | 05/06/2024

Real-time train running information for 5Q70 1129½ departure from St Philips Marsh Depot Fhh to Wolverton Centre Sidings on 05/06/2024. From Realtime Trains, an independent source of train running info for Great Britain.

www.realtimetrains.co.uk

I imagine 5Q70 can only be 166205 (branded / refreshed at the GWR launch). The other three for the programme (206, 216 & 220) are allocated.

 

[Mag_seven]

I imagine 5Q70 can only be 166205

Confirmed by sight today.

 

[3973EXL]

166214

Realtime Trains | 5Q23 1413 St Philips Mrsh H S T D to Doncaster Works Wagn Shops | 08/06/2024

Real-time train running information for 5Q23 1413 departure from St Philips Mrsh H S T D to Doncaster Works Wagn Shops on 08/06/2024. From Realtime Trains, an independent source of train running info for Great Britain.

www.realtimetrains.co.uk

 

[HamworthyGoods]

Time they went for recycling.

They will do in due course but the units of greater priority to replace will be the 150s and 158s as they are older and suffer with greater corrosion.

 

[JonathanH]

They will do in due course but the units of greater priority to replace will be the 150s and 158s as they are older and suffer with greater corrosion.

While that makes sense for the steel 150s, what is the relative level of corrosion on the 158s and 16x units? Both are of welded aluminium construction. Does two extra years of operation make a difference?

 

[fgwrich]

While that makes sense for the steel 150s, what is the relative level of corrosion on the 158s and 16x units? Both are of welded aluminium construction. Does two extra years of operation make a difference?

Possibly, possibly not. We’ve seen with some newer Ally fleets that they aren’t immune to corrosion issues (the normally bomb proof AC Desiro’s in the Pan Wells while the electrostars seem to be bodywide - Though at least the construction of the Turbos will aide them being welded Ally than Bolted). As for the level of corrosion itself, that I can’t tell you off of the top of my head, but the 158s seem to have fared better than the Turbos in that regard I believe.

 

[northernbelle]

They will do in due course but the units of greater priority to replace will be the 150s and 158s as they are older and suffer with greater corrosion.

The 150s will be the first to be run down, likely before the end of the decade. The 158s and 16x will have to continue until their replacements arrive into the 2030s.

 

[3973EXL]

166213

Realtime Trains | 5Q81 0955 Doncaster Works Wagn Shops to St Philips Mrsh H S T D | 17/06/2024

Real-time train running information for 5Q81 0955 departure from Doncaster Works Wagn Shops to St Philips Mrsh H S T D on 17/06/2024. From Realtime Trains, an independent source of train running info for Great Britain.

www.realtimetrains.co.uk

22/06
5Q81 1236 Doncaster Works Wabtec - St Philips Marsh Depot

166214

23/06
5Q23 0815 St Philips Marsh HSTD - Doncaster Works Wagn Shops

166211

 

[Siemens Staines]

5Q81 0849 Wolverton Centre Sidings to St Philips Mrsh H S T D

Realtime Trains | 5Q81 0849 Wolverton Centre Sidings to St Philips Mrsh H S T D | 21/06/2024

Real-time train running information for 5Q81 0849 departure from Wolverton Centre Sidings to St Philips Mrsh H S T D on 21/06/2024. From Realtime Trains, an independent source of train running info for Great Britain.

www.realtimetrains.co.uk

5Q70 1429 St Philips Marsh Depot Fhh to Wolverton Centre Sidings

Realtime Trains | 5Q70 1429 St Philips Marsh Depot Fhh to Wolverton Centre Sidings | 21/06/2024

Real-time train running information for 5Q70 1429 departure from St Philips Marsh Depot Fhh to Wolverton Centre Sidings on 21/06/2024. From Realtime Trains, an independent source of train running info for Great Britain.

www.realtimetrains.co.uk

Presumably 5Q81 will be 166212 and 5Q70 will be 166206 if these transfers take place today?

 

[Recessio]

Now that I've been travelling on these regularly for a few months, I wonder if GWR should have put a more substantial lock on the hopper windows during the refurbishment. I'd say around half of the trains I travel on have the windows open despite the air conditioning running on full. Either passengers are able to open them eg with a key way too easily, or they are vibrating themselves open or something.

If I remember correctly, Chiltern removed the hopper windows altogether on their Turbos?

 

[py_megapixel]

Now that I've been travelling on these regularly for a few months, I wonder if GWR should have put a more substantial lock on the hopper windows during the refurbishment. I'd say around half of the trains I travel on have the windows open despite the air conditioning running on full. Either passengers are able to open them eg with a key way too easily, or they are vibrating themselves open or something.

The problem is it then becomes harder to open them when that's actually needed! Also doesn't solve the problem of staff opening them when the AC is actually working, not realising that it just needs to be left to get the train down to the right temperature.

IMO the best solution would be an electrical interlock so that the AC won't run if a window in the coach is open, but that's probably complex to retrofit to an old system and of course is itself liable to fail.

 

[12LDA28C]

If I remember correctly, Chiltern removed the hopper windows altogether on their Turbos?

They were removed years ago when the air con was put in.

 

[Snow1964]

Now that I've been travelling on these regularly for a few months, I wonder if GWR should have put a more substantial lock on the hopper windows during the refurbishment. I'd say around half of the trains I travel on have the windows open despite the air conditioning running on full. Either passengers are able to open them eg with a key way too easily, or they are vibrating themselves open or something.

Currently on a 166 on Portsmouth-Cardiff and all the windows are open, and it is very noisy from engines and wind buffeting

I wonder if it costs more in fuel running with windows open and a/c on for next few years than it would have cost to replace the windows or provide decent locks

 

[The exile]

Currently on a 166 on Portsmouth-Cardiff and all the windows are open, and it is very noisy from engines and wind buffeting

I wonder if it costs more in fuel running with windows open and a/c on for next few years than it would have cost to replace the windows or provide decent locks

Also requires A/C that actually works reliably and is allowed to work long enough before the unit enters service that the atmosphere no longer resembles a sauna.

 

[Benjwri]

How many window locks are actually broken? Whenever I travel the locks themselves look fine, they've just been left open and unlocked for whatever reason.

 

[Snow1964]

Also requires A/C that actually works reliably and is allowed to work long enough before the unit enters service that the atmosphere no longer resembles a sauna.

Weird that you mention that, because we all got thrown off at Bristol TM and had to cross to another unit which was parked with engines off, was started and doors opened about 2 minutes after everyone had crossed and walked along platform to it. Initially humid, stuffy and rather warm inside. Unit change with replacement not being ready has made train 8 minutes late too.

 

[LUYMun]

It would appear one of the Basingstoke-Reading diagrams have been out of circuit due to a fault with one of the Turbos, and Reading have no more spare units, resulting in the 06:10, 07:38, 08:59, 10:33 and 12:09 to Basingstoke as well as the corresponding returns being cancelled so far.

 

[Clarence Yard]

Tend to be used much more intensively without much of a midday lull (in Network South East days regularly about half fleet was parked up between peaks and from mid evening)

Many now seem to be diagrammed nearer 16 hours a day.

That’s an urban myth. They were used quite intensively when they were at Reading.

Taking the 1996 diagrams as an example (and excluding any intermediate shed time), the 2 cars were out for a diagram average of 17 hours 57 minutes, the 3 car 165/1 for 14 hours 55 minutes and the 166 for 16 hours 56 minutes. Daily average SX diagram mileages were 394.4, 397.8 and 595.7 respectively.

The Donkey unit was the one that out the longest. It left Reading Depot at 0127 and did an overnight run to Pad and back before going to Maidenhead and then onto the branch, where it worked all day. It arrived back at Reading Upper Triangle at 0103 the following morning.

Only 1 x 2 car and 4 x 3 cars stabled for the entire inter-peak, all at OOC - 5 units out of 51 diagrams. There were a few others that came on OOC and RDG for a couple of hours only, mainly for a sweep out at the former and fuel at the latter.

I do remember that the number of units stabling during the day dropped further in the following year as the fleet was used even more intensively. Reading could deal with this intensive use as it was set up to cope.

 

[Siemens Staines]

Friday 5th July 2024
5Q81 1820 Doncaster Works Wagn Shops to St Philips Mrsh H S T D

Realtime Trains | 5Q81 1820 Doncaster Works Wagn Shops to St Philips Mrsh H S T D | 05/07/2024

Real-time train running information for 5Q81 1820 departure from Doncaster Works Wagn Shops to St Philips Mrsh H S T D on 05/07/2024. From Realtime Trains, an independent source of train running info for Great Britain.

www.realtimetrains.co.uk

Saturday 6th July 2024
5Q23 1413 St Philips Mrsh H S T D to Doncaster Works Wagn Shops

Realtime Trains | 5Q23 1413 St Philips Mrsh H S T D to Doncaster Works Wagn Shops | 06/07/2024

Real-time train running information for 5Q23 1413 departure from St Philips Mrsh H S T D to Doncaster Works Wagn Shops on 06/07/2024. From Realtime Trains, an independent source of train running info for Great Britain.

www.realtimetrains.co.uk

 

[3973EXL]

166211

Realtime Trains | 5Q81 1820 Doncaster Works Wagn Shops to St Philips Mrsh H S T D | 05/07/2024

Real-time train running information for 5Q81 1820 departure from Doncaster Works Wagn Shops to St Philips Mrsh H S T D on 05/07/2024. From Realtime Trains, an independent source of train running info for Great Britain.

www.realtimetrains.co.uk

166217

Realtime Trains | 5Q23 1413 St Philips Mrsh H S T D to Doncaster Works Wagn Shops | 06/07/2024

Real-time train running information for 5Q23 1413 departure from St Philips Mrsh H S T D to Doncaster Works Wagn Shops on 06/07/2024. From Realtime Trains, an independent source of train running info for Great Britain.

www.realtimetrains.co.uk

Realtime Trains | 5Q81 0849 Wolverton Centre Sidings to St Philips Mrsh H S T D | 09/07/2024

Real-time train running information for 5Q81 0849 departure from Wolverton Centre Sidings to St Philips Mrsh H S T D on 09/07/2024. From Realtime Trains, an independent source of train running info for Great Britain.

www.realtimetrains.co.uk

Realtime Trains | 5Q70 1507 St Philips Mrsh H S T D to Wolverton Centre Sidings | 09/07/2024

Real-time train running information for 5Q70 1507 departure from St Philips Mrsh H S T D to Wolverton Centre Sidings on 09/07/2024. From Realtime Trains, an independent source of train running info for Great Britain.

www.realtimetrains.co.uk

 

[V221 135]

Spare parts become harder to source or manufacture as time goes on, leading to stock sat out-of-use for longer periods of time as they await repair. Not necessarily a problem of the Turbo fleet, but a lot of 1990s-designed things are filled with the sort of technology that is particularly hard to replace as they are sandwiched between simpler electro-mechanical controls that predate that era, but come before the development of fully computer-dependent systems where things like software upgrades can be easily applied.

Actually a big problem with the Turbo fleets, both Chiltern and GWR.

 

[Energy]

Taking the 1996 diagrams as an example (and excluding any intermediate shed time), the 2 cars were out for a diagram average of 17 hours 57 minutes, the 3 car 165/1 for 14 hours 55 minutes and the 166 for 16 hours 56 minutes. Daily average SX diagram mileages were 394.4, 397.8 and 595.7 respectively.

Interesting that the 3 car 165s were out for much less time than the 2 cars, I'd imagine a two car unit being sat on a branch all day pushes the average up.

Actually a big problem with the Turbo fleets, both Chiltern and GWR.

Not just electronics, Angel was working on 3D printing parts like arm rests which are also getting difficult to source.