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Australia/Sydney trains

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heathrowrail

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I was wondering if anyone has been to Australia, mainly Sydney? I'm looking to go next year and want to ride the XPT I was thinking of using it to get to the Blue Mountains but think I might hire a car instead. Wondering if anyone knows a good day trip you can take on them Newcastle maybe?
 
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GC class B1

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I was wondering if anyone has been to Australia, mainly Sydney? I'm looking to go next year and want to ride the XPT I was thinking of using it to get to the Blue Mountains but think I might hire a car instead. Wondering if anyone knows a good day trip you can take on them Newcastle maybe?
I lived in Australia for some of the time between 2006 and 2008. I travelled on the Sydney to Brisbane XPT many times as far as Broadmeadow which is just south of Newcastle. It doesn’t go to the Blue Mountains.
 

heathrowrail

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I lived in Australia for some of the time between 2006 and 2008. I travelled on the Sydney to Brisbane XPT many times as far as Broadmeadow which is just south of Newcastle. It doesn’t go to the Blue Mountains.
It goes to Katoomba from where you get a bus to the blue mountains ;)
 

LNW-GW Joint

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It goes to Katoomba from where you get a bus to the blue mountains ;)
It's the Dubbo XPT, 0719 from Sydney Central.
I'm not clear if you can book on the XPT to Katoomba though, as NSW Trainlink only shows 2tph local electric trains for that section.
In my day (admittedly 30+ years ago!) I had to book on the XPT to Lithgow, the stop after the Blue Mountains (and the end of electric working), and then get a local back to Katoomba.
I think the earlier stops were pickup only, but that might have changed.
I also don't think you can use an Opal card on the XPT, though you can on the electrics.
The viewpoints at Katoomba are a fair walk from the station, and are well separated.

The return XPT (same train) is 1842 from Lithgow.
 
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AdamWW

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I got an XPT to Katoomba..but now I think about it that was from Dubbo then I continued the next day on a local train.
 

Springs Branch

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I'm not clear if you can book on the XPT to Katoomba though . . .
The XPT calling at Katoomba (once per day each way to/from Dubbo) is still pick-up only out of Sydney and set down only back into Sydney and you can't book that journey. Timetable is on NSW Train Link website

Visiting Katoomba / Blue Mountains ('The Blue Mountains' proper is a huge area) for a day trip from Sydney is definitely worthwhile, and in my opinion, is best done by train.

I've done it both by train and by hire car and the train won hands down. My one and only car trip involved a few nights stay in the Blue Mountains with Mrs S.B. and her luggage in tow, so better option with a car on that occasion. If you do drive, there's heavy traffic congestion in Sydney, especially around the airport, annoying e-Tag toll motorways along the way and the busy, steep and winding Great Western Highway to negotiate once you climb into the Blue Mountains.

Although you can't get to Katoomba by XPT, there are hourly double-deck electric trains to/from Sydney. These also call at other stations in the Blue Mountains, such as Leura and Wentworth Falls, if you want to avoid "tourist central" at Katoomba - although if you only go for one day, Katoomba is the most spectacular, easily-accessible place so probably the one to aim for. One-way journey time is 2 hours, in round figures, plus the short bus journey from Katoomba station to the Three Sisters etc.

You can use either Opal or a contactless credit / debit card for the trip (tap on and off similar to TfL). One-way adult rail fares Sydney/Katoomba seem to be AU$9.31 (about £5) peak, AU$6.51 (about £3.50) off-peak. So, a bargain compared to a two-hour train journey in Britain, and much cheaper than hiring a car and paying motorway tolls plus petrol.


Regarding a trip to sample an XPT, there are some significant differences (not necessarily in your favour) to understand compared to "having a ride on an HST" in Britain. There's no equivalent to buying a Day Return from Paddington to Reading, turning up for the next HST departure and having a quick spin out and back (as in the good old days).

- The XPTs are only used for the longest-distance services in NSW, like Sydney to Dubbo, Melbourne or Brisbane.
- There might only be one (two if you're lucky) trains per day on a particular route, not necessarily at convenient times for a shortish or leisurely day out.
- Tickets and seats on these regional trains always have to be booked and reserved in advance (I'm not sure whether you can book on the day). It's not usually turn-up-at-the-station-and-travel.
- While the XPTs do stop in the Sydney suburban and outer-metropolitan area at places like Strathfield and Penrith, this is only to pick-up or set-down depending on direction of travel. The compulsory reservation system means this restriction can be effectively policed (you can't hop on and hope the conductor didn't notice).
- Once you get into the sphere of "regional trains" in Australia, distances are long and the trains don't go all that fast, so you might be looking at a good few hours out, a significant wait, then some hours more to travel back.
- The regional trains are more expensive. e.g. the Sydney/Broadmeadow return trip mentioned by @GC class B1 costs AU$33.58 with compulsory booking both ways on an HST XPT, versus about AU$13 round-trip if you used one of the regular electric interurban trains between the same stations, where Opal / contactless fares are available.
- Having said that, I think the Sydney/Broadmeadow trip is possibly the most 'do-able' shortish hop (a 2¼ to 2½ hour ride to just outside Newcastle). You can go XPT one way and a Sydney Trains service the other using Opal / contactless. Just need to watch out that the Train Link service you book is actually an XPT, not an Xplorer DMU (the distinction is clear enough in the on-line booking site). [EDIT] If you are planning to try this one, make sure you book Broadmeadow (without an 's'), not Broadmeadows (with an 's'). The latter is on the outskirts of Melbourne, more than 10 hours away.
 
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heathrowrail

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The XPT calling at Katoomba (once per day each way to/from Dubbo) is still pick-up only out of Sydney and set down only back into Sydney and you can't book that journey. Timetable is on NSW Train Link website

Visiting Katoomba / Blue Mountains ('The Blue Mountains' proper is a huge area) for a day trip from Sydney is definitely worthwhile, and in my opinion, is best done by train.

I've done it both by train and by hire car and the train won hands down. My one and only car trip involved a few nights stay in the Blue Mountains with Mrs S.B. and her luggage in tow, so better option with a car on that occasion. If you do drive, there's heavy traffic congestion in Sydney, especially around the airport, annoying e-Tag toll motorways along the way and the busy, steep and winding Great Western Highway to negotiate once you climb into the Blue Mountains.

Although you can't get to Katoomba by XPT, there are hourly double-deck electric trains to/from Sydney. These also call at other stations in the Blue Mountains, such as Leura and Wentworth Falls, if you want to avoid "tourist central" at Katoomba - although if you only go for one day, Katoomba is the most spectacular, easily-accessible place so probably the one to aim for. One-way journey time is 2 hours, in round figures, plus the short bus journey from Katoomba station to the Three Sisters etc.

You can use either Opal or a contactless credit / debit card for the trip (tap on and off similar to TfL). One-way adult rail fares Sydney/Katoomba seem to be AU$9.31 (about £5) peak, AU$6.51 (about £3.50) off-peak. So, a bargain compared to a two-hour train journey in Britain, and much cheaper than hiring a car and paying motorway tolls plus petrol.


Regarding a trip to sample an XPT, there are some significant differences (not necessarily in your favour) to understand compared to "having a ride on an HST" in Britain. There's no equivalent to buying a Day Return from Paddington to Reading, turning up for the next HST departure and having a quick spin out and back (as in the good old days).

- The XPTs are only used for the longest-distance services in NSW, like Sydney to Dubbo, Melbourne or Brisbane.
- There might only be one (two if you're lucky) trains per day on a particular route, not necessarily at convenient times for a shortish or leisurely day out.
- Tickets and seats on these regional trains always have to be booked and reserved in advance (I'm not sure whether you can book on the day). It's not usually turn-up-at-the-station-and-travel.
- While the XPTs do stop in the Sydney suburban and outer-metropolitan area at places like Strathfield and Penrith, this is only to pick-up or set-down depending on direction of travel. The compulsory reservation system means this restriction can be effectively policed (you can't hop on and hope the conductor didn't notice).
- Once you get into the sphere of "regional trains" in Australia, distances are long and the trains don't go all that fast, so you might be looking at a good few hours out, a significant wait, then some hours more to travel back.
- The regional trains are more expensive. e.g. the Sydney/Broadmeadow return trip mentioned by @GC class B1 costs AU$33.58 with compulsory booking both ways on an HST XPT, versus about AU$13 round-trip if you used one of the regular electric interurban trains between the same stations, where Opal / contactless fares are available.
- Having said that, I think the Sydney/Broadmeadow trip is possibly the most 'do-able' shortish hop (a 2¼ to 2½ hour ride to just outside Newcastle). You can go XPT one way and a Sydney Trains service the other using Opal / contactless. Just need to watch out that the Train Link service you book is actually an XPT, not an Xplorer DMU (the distinction is clear enough in the on-line booking site). [EDIT] If you are planning to try this one, make sure you book Broadmeadow (without an 's'), not Broadmeadows (with an 's'). The latter is on the outskirts of Melbourne, more than 10 hours away.
Thanks for the info i'll have to have a good look at what trip is possible.
 

route101

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The line to Newcastle was quite scenic if I remember. I do like the older double deck EMUs. I done Sydney to Melbourne on the XPT, was quite slow compared to our XPTS. I dont remember it being too expensive.
 

railfan99

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I was wondering if anyone has been to Australia, mainly Sydney? I'm looking to go next year and want to ride the XPT I was thinking of using it to get to the Blue Mountains but think I might hire a car instead. Wondering if anyone knows a good day trip you can take on them Newcastle maybe?

You don't state how long you'll be in Oz for, but why not purchase a NSW TrainLink Discovery Pass?

As with Interrail/Eurailpass, buy a first class Discovery Pass:


You cannot use it to travel on Sydney suburban or interurban trains BUT you are allowed to use these if 'connecting' so that's a loophole.

By ringing the call centre, they can book you on day trips in car A, the sleeper on the XPT that for day use has 27 seats in nine compartments: three per compartment. Ask for a forward facing window seat in car A.

An alternative to Broadmeadow is the nicely timed 0930 hours XPlorer 'Northern Tablelands Express'. Even better if you travel all the way to Moree or Armidale (train divides at Werris Creek that has a small platform railway museum), as then you see all the coal trains between just out of Broadmeadow and all the way to Narrabri. (You could change over at Singleton between the two 'NTEs' if on time.

Always check trackwork as it can mean rail replacement coaches. Sometimes there are problems with the XPTs in particular as well: while unusual, yesterday the Melbourne to Sydney daytime XPT broke down at Cootamundra, and there were road coaches to Sydney.
 

heathrowrail

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You don't state how long you'll be in Oz for, but why not purchase a NSW TrainLink Discovery Pass?

As with Interrail/Eurailpass, buy a first class Discovery Pass:


You cannot use it to travel on Sydney suburban or interurban trains BUT you are allowed to use these if 'connecting' so that's a loophole.

By ringing the call centre, they can book you on day trips in car A, the sleeper on the XPT that for day use has 27 seats in nine compartments: three per compartment. Ask for a forward facing window seat in car A.

An alternative to Broadmeadow is the nicely timed 0930 hours XPlorer 'Northern Tablelands Express'. Even better if you travel all the way to Moree or Armidale (train divides at Werris Creek that has a small platform railway museum), as then you see all the coal trains between just out of Broadmeadow and all the way to Narrabri. (You could change over at Singleton between the two 'NTEs' if on time.

Always check trackwork as it can mean rail replacement coaches. Sometimes there are problems with the XPTs in particular as well: while unusual, yesterday the Melbourne to Sydney daytime XPT broke down at Cootamundra, and there were road coaches to Sydney.
Thanks I'll check that out. Looking around a month to 5 weeks still early days in planning yet.
 

TT-ONR-NRN

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You don't state how long you'll be in Oz for, but why not purchase a NSW TrainLink Discovery Pass?

As with Interrail/Eurailpass, buy a first class Discovery Pass:


You cannot use it to travel on Sydney suburban or interurban trains BUT you are allowed to use these if 'connecting' so that's a loophole.

By ringing the call centre, they can book you on day trips in car A, the sleeper on the XPT that for day use has 27 seats in nine compartments: three per compartment. Ask for a forward facing window seat in car A.

An alternative to Broadmeadow is the nicely timed 0930 hours XPlorer 'Northern Tablelands Express'. Even better if you travel all the way to Moree or Armidale (train divides at Werris Creek that has a small platform railway museum), as then you see all the coal trains between just out of Broadmeadow and all the way to Narrabri. (You could change over at Singleton between the two 'NTEs' if on time.

Always check trackwork as it can mean rail replacement coaches. Sometimes there are problems with the XPTs in particular as well: while unusual, yesterday the Melbourne to Sydney daytime XPT broke down at Cootamundra, and there were road coaches to Sydney.
I thought this was such good value when I first saw it but having seen this, I'm no longer considering it. Bar the odd trip to Melbourne or Canberra, Sydney Trains will account for 95% of my railway travel when in Australia.
 

185

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*The Blue Mountains train is tap on tap off with any contactless bank card, as is the bus in Katoomba. Will be covered by the daily Opal cap. Was on it two weeks ago.
 

Springs Branch

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An alternative to Broadmeadow is the nicely timed 0930 hours XPlorer 'Northern Tablelands Express'. Even better if you travel all the way to Moree or Armidale (train divides at Werris Creek that has a small platform railway museum), as then you see all the coal trains between just out of Broadmeadow and all the way to Narrabri. (You could change over at Singleton between the two 'NTEs' if on time.
Definitely a grand day out there, but I think the OP was specifically looking to travel on an XPT.

One other plausible route not yet mentioned is to catch the morning Melbourne XPT (07:40 from Sydney Central) to some point along the Southern Highlands line.

The Southern Highlands route doesn't quite have the rugged mountain scenery of the Blue Mountains Line (although you don't get to see much really spectacular scenery from the train), or the 'water features' of the line north towards Newcastle - but it's certainly pleasant enough landscape through places like Bowral.

This line has two XPTs per day (morning and evening) running to & from Melbourne, plus three round trips per day Sydney/Canberra, which are formed of Xplorer DMUs (not XPTs).

Depending how much time & money you want to spend on your XPT jaunt there are several options, all leaving Sydney on the 07:40 Melbourne XPT:-
  • Travel as far as Moss Vale arr. 09:22 (XPT's first set-down stop and approx 1¾ hour ride from Sydney)
    Return from Moss Vale on the 10:06 Southern Highlands 'Intercity' train to Campbelltown.
    Despite the name, this is actually a 2-car Endeavour DMU, calling at local stations through to Campbelltown, where you change to a double-deck suburban EMU for the connection back to Sydney.
    Arrival back in Sydney would be at 12:31. The Moss Vale to Sydney leg of the trip could be done economically for around £3 to £4 with off-peak Opal / contactless, no booking needed. There's also another Endeavour railcar from Moss Vale an hour later, in case anything goes amiss with the outbound XPT leg (so you won't be stranded).

  • Travel as far as Goulburn, arr. 10:13
    Return from Goulburn on the 13:22 XPlorer DMU ex-Canberra, arr. Sydney 16:03 (pre-booking required)
    Goulburn is a large regional town. A bit work-a-day and run-down, but you'll have no trouble finding a sandwich, a coffee, some fish & chips or a beer or two in a pub to while away the three hours wait. Goulburn station is right in the town centre. I was there not so many years ago in winter, and the station travel centre / waiting room had a real coal fire burning. Lovely!

  • Travel as far as Cootamundra, arr. 12:44 (so a five-hour ride from Sydney)
    Return from Cootamundra on the 14:38 XPT ex-Melbourne (pre-booking required), arr. Sydney 19:47 - another 5 hours!
    In theory you could continue to the XPT's next stop at Junee (a historic railway town) and return from there with a ½ wait between trains, but that's risking it in the event of any delay. I wouldn't want to get stranded in Junee!
 
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LNW-GW Joint

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  • Travel as far as Goulburn, arr. 10:13
    Return from Goulburn on the 13:22 XPlorer DMU ex-Canberra, arr. Sydney 16:03 (pre-booking required)
    Goulburn is a large regional town. A bit work-a-day and run-down, but you'll have no trouble finding a sandwich, a coffee, some fish & chips or a beer or two in a pub to while away the three hours wait. Goulburn station is right in the town centre. I was there not so many years ago in winter, and the station travel centre / waiting room had a real coal fire burning. Lovely!


I didn't get out at Goulburn on my 2018 trip, but it is a major rail operations centre and had lots of freight locos in the sidings to the south.
There was also a steam loco in there somewhere (3112 from my photograph).
 

Springs Branch

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A couple of other Australian quirks for the OP, or any other visitors thinking of taking a ride on an XPT before they're replaced by new CAF trains:-

1) If taking a 'short hop' trip (a mere 2 to 3 hours), NSW Train Link can put restrictions on how far ahead you can book a ticket. Most long-distance journeys can be booked up to 6 months ahead, but for short trips like Sydney to Broadmeadow or Moss Vale, bookings for seats on the XPT only open 7 or 14 days ahead of travel date. Obviously this is designed to avoid long-distance passengers being denied a reservation because the seat is taken by someone only travelling a couple of stops and who had other options for the same journey on regular 'Intercity' services.


Transport for NSW said:
For most services, you can book 6 months in advance. However, other trips need to be booked closer to the travel dates.

When booking a short trip on a long-distance service, often this needs to be done closer to the departure date. If there is a restriction and you try to book too far in advance, you may receive a "service not available" message in the online booking system.

Check for any restrictions that may apply to you and reserve your seat online during the booking window. If you have further issues, call 13 22 32 for assistance.

All other bookings can be made 6 months or 180 days in advance.

2) If you're planning a longer XPT journey and fancy whiling away the hours with a carrier bag full of cans of the local 'amber fluid', regional trains here have a ban on bring-your-own booze. You can buy alcohol in the buffet car, but I believe only lower-strength types are stocked.

I'm sure this denial of basic freedoms might upset some who like to fulminate against Dry Trains and assert their Second Amendment 'Right-to-Swill-Ale' on any train of their choosing. But everyone seems to be used to the restriction, and it does help make a better travel experience without any of the hen party or football supporter annoyances you might find in Britain.
 

LesS

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I was wondering if anyone has been to Australia, mainly Sydney? I'm looking to go next year and want to ride the XPT I was thinking of using it to get to the Blue Mountains but think I might hire a car instead. Wondering if anyone knows a good day trip you can take on them Newcastle maybe?
If you let me know which months you intend to visit I should be able to provide some specific information about special activities.

For comprehensive information about Sydney Trains go to the website www.Transportnsw.info You will find all of the general information you need.

For short trips on XPT services there are few options. Rather than travel to Broadmeadow it is better for a railfan to go to Maitland, 20 miles west of Broadmeadow. There you can witness a procession of 9,000 tonne coal trains interspersed with occasional container trains; 1500 metres long; and several grain trains; usually about 5,00 tonnes. The coal trains run with the frequency of trams.

There are 3 daily return XPT services through Maitland. If you do not have a return reservation the station staff at Maitland can usually find a seat at short notice.

International visitors usually visit the Blue Mountains. The viewing points from Katoomba station are within walking distance but there is a bus service. Other worthwhile locations include Medlow Bath and Blackheath. The main viewing point at Blackheath is currently closed. Particularly at weekends and holidays it is best to use the train from Sydney as the highway is more like a car park.

A worthwhile day trip from Sydney is to the south coast. Wollongong, Kiama, and Bomaderry. The scenery from the train is varied and outstanding, ranging from ocean clifftop to beachfront to national park.

To help with planning there are 2 telephone apps available; Tripview and Anytrip. I use Anytrip. It covers detail of trains, trams, buses, and ferries. It also covers similar detail for Brisbane, Canberra, Adelaide, Darwin, and Auckland. Detail for Melbourne is very limited. For a few dollars a year the ads can be avoided and some additional information on freight and work trains is available for limited areas.

Please let me know if I can be of further assistance.
 

heathrowrail

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If you let me know which months you intend to visit I should be able to provide some specific information about special activities.

For comprehensive information about Sydney Trains go to the website www.Transportnsw.info You will find all of the general information you need.

For short trips on XPT services there are few options. Rather than travel to Broadmeadow it is better for a railfan to go to Maitland, 20 miles west of Broadmeadow. There you can witness a procession of 9,000 tonne coal trains interspersed with occasional container trains; 1500 metres long; and several grain trains; usually about 5,00 tonnes. The coal trains run with the frequency of trams.

There are 3 daily return XPT services through Maitland. If you do not have a return reservation the station staff at Maitland can usually find a seat at short notice.

International visitors usually visit the Blue Mountains. The viewing points from Katoomba station are within walking distance but there is a bus service. Other worthwhile locations include Medlow Bath and Blackheath. The main viewing point at Blackheath is currently closed. Particularly at weekends and holidays it is best to use the train from Sydney as the highway is more like a car park.

A worthwhile day trip from Sydney is to the south coast. Wollongong, Kiama, and Bomaderry. The scenery from the train is varied and outstanding, ranging from ocean clifftop to beachfront to national park.

To help with planning there are 2 telephone apps available; Tripview and Anytrip. I use Anytrip. It covers detail of trains, trams, buses, and ferries. It also covers similar detail for Brisbane, Canberra, Adelaide, Darwin, and Auckland. Detail for Melbourne is very limited. For a few dollars a year the ads can be avoided and some additional information on freight and work trains is available for limited areas.

Please let me know if I can be of further assistance.
Thanks Les. Looking at October/November 2023
 
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