ATW to Rebrand Gerald Premier Service

[merlodlliw]

This comes as no surprise to me, it looks like a customer count has been made, if Welsh Government won't pay, then ATW certainly wont.

Here's the RMT response of today

RMT to fight plans to axe catering services on Arriva Trains Wales

RAIL UNION RMT today pledged to fight plans to axe the on-board chef facility on Arriva Trains Wales North/South services and has written to the Welsh Assembly calling for the their intervention to halt the cutting of the service and the associated threat to jobs.

Arriva Trains Wales have sought to blame the cut to the catering facilities on the Welsh Assembly with RMT deeply concerned that staff livelihoods are being caught in the middle of a row as the company seek to lump the blame on the politicians.

In the letter to Edwina Hart, the transport minister, RMT says:

“We are writing to you because I have just been informed this week that Arriva Trains Wales is removing the Chef service from the North / South Train service with the loss of a number of jobs. As you will appreciate the union is deeply concerned about the loss of these jobs and the impact for our members. ATW have informed RMT that this cut is due to financial cuts from the Welsh assembly to this service.

“RMT believes that this change to the current catering arrangements will have a very significant impact on the service and possibly lead to less people using the service which could threaten its future. Replacing a freshly cooked food option with a microwave for such a long journey may well mean less people will be attracted to using the service and actually cost money in ticket sale reductions. The current Chef service has been award winning and well thought of in the industry, perhaps the cooked meal service could have been extended to standard class travellers as well in a newly launched ' open Restaurant car ' as an option to help pay for itself.”‎

With the franchise due for renewal in 2017, and with the promise of the
consideration of a “not for profit” option, RMT cannot see any justification
whatsoever in cash-led cuts to jobs and services being imposed three years away from what may mark a major change to the nature of the franchise....

 

[LNW-GW Joint]

As this train is funded directly by the Welsh Government, I should think that Edwina Hart already knows about the catering cut and approved it.
In funding terms it will be restaurant meals versus Welsh NHS. No contest.
It will be interesting to see the longer term prospects for the train service.
I imagine it will be folded into the spec for the new franchise and become just another Holyhead-Cardiff train.

 

[Greenback]

I agree. I don't see why one restaurant service on two trains a day merits an outcry. I don't like to see anyone lose their job, and I'd prefer it if ATW could offer alternative employment, but these are specialist roles.

The bottom line is that with the funding cuts faced by the WG it's extremely difficult to justify subsidising anon profit making premium service that probably should never have been introduced int he first place. (I mean the restaurant, not the Holyhead - Cardiff service itself)

 

[ainsworth74]

When is it actually going?

 

[martynbristow]

How many people including the RMT who are moaning about it have actually used it!

Would you be willing to see fares go up to privide a luxury :/

 

[fgwrich]

Whilst it is a luxury for such a service, it will be a shame to see another TOC revise it's catering options especially after FGW dropping it's Travelling Chef - The trade off is more Pullman Dining but the TC option was very good to have as well. I suppose as the RFMs have been refurbished, it would just become another Buffer Service.

 

[Greenback]

The majority of people don't want full catering on trains any more. Years of jokes about railway catering, plus the perceived high prices and lack of quality hot snack type options have all contributed to the decline, along with the clamour for more seats at the expense of such facilities.

 

[merlodlliw]

When is it actually going?

Has LNWR/GW joint says,its all about funding.The Chiefs & catering staff are in talks with ATW about their future, my guess is the Dinner will finish in December.

I am not aware of the amount of funding WG are cutting,current £1.5million this year to run the service. Then the hiring in of stock is also due soon.
Edwina Hart in charge of Welsh Railways has already agreed to the axing of the dinner, I also expect first to go as well.

 

[trentside]

It's a great shame for the catering crews, as they clearly put a lot of effort into the service - certainly when I used it, you could easily describe it as restaurant quality. For journeys of such a length, a quality hot food option is a nice thing to have onboard, but clearly if the funding isn't in place there's not much hope that it will continue.

I wish the staff well for the future, they were top notch in my experience.

 

[merlodlliw]

The Minister also ordered a head count of those using the service and first class a few months ago from ATW, it is also a well known fact the majority who use the Premier Service are from the statutory sector and politicians, it was set up for business people, who fail to use it,one or two using the dinner and usually none for breakfast was never going to last.

 

[DarloRich]

terrible news for the guys working on the train - glad I had a run on it this year.

Thanks for doing a good job and preparing a great meal. Butties all round from the trolley next year!

 

[merlodlliw]

terrible news for the guys working on the train - glad I had a run on it this year.

Thanks for doing a good job and preparing a great meal. Butties all round from the trolley next year!

I fully expect the girls to run either a buffet service,which is well used, plus has experienced catering staff they may well be taken on by VT who have a catering dept at Holyhead.
The Chiefs worked from Rhyl to Cardiff/Cardiff to Rhyl,& should be able to get,hopefully positions elsewhere,
I am also wondering whether the loco hauled service from December? will continue on the Holyhead/Cardiff route,perhaps Cardiff/Manchester has a franchise service, if WG have withdrawn so much funding and ATW have to fund it themselves, this could be on the cards certainly from next May.

 

[Chester1]

I started organising a birthday day out to Cardiff using this service yesterday night! Do you think they will keep the chef cooked dinners until the end of the current time table on December 13th? My birthday is in December so knowing exactly when it will go matters allot! I dont want to pay for first class and end up with a microwave birthday dinner!

 

[merlodlliw]

I started organising a birthday day out to Cardiff using this service yesterday night! Do you think they will keep the chef cooked dinners until the end of the current time table on December 13th? My birthday is in December so knowing exactly when it will go matters allot! I dont want to pay for first class and end up with a microwave birthday dinner!

Anyones guess, but if the Chefs do get a job elsewhere,who can blame them,ATW will either run Gerald as a buffet, or take on an agency Chef,it will all become clear soon.

 

[Envoy]

In the event that the entire loco hauled service was axed, I wonder if another use could be found for the stock? Surely, a direct service via the Marches - freight failures permitting - from Cardiff to Edinburgh would be most welcome. Current fares on this route mean that people drive from south Wales to places like Carlisle & Edinburgh.

Cardiff > Edinburgh Anytime Return = £340 or £248 for 2 singles. You can't even book ahead & get cheaper fares. By using the present ATW services via Shrewsbury & changing at Crewe to Virgin you get the fastest journey times. (I think that Cross Country set the fare but anyone on this journey would not use CC as it would take about 1 hour longer- how crazy is that)?

It seems to me that the advance booking systems of ATW & Virgin cannot work out cheap fares for such a journey. Compare that with King's Cross to Edinburgh with East Coast where the costs are much lower. Hence my suggestion that 'Gerald' could be used to provide a through service with reasonable fares.

PS: Cheaper fares for this route can be acquired by splitting tickets with Crewe & Preston usually being the split points. Joe Public are surely not going to know that three tickets works out cheaper?

 

[LNW-GW Joint]

Cardiff > Edinburgh Anytime Return = £340 or £248 for 2 singles. You can't even book ahead & get cheaper fares. By using the present ATW services via Shrewsbury & changing at Crewe to Virgin you get the fastest journey times. (I think that Cross Country set the fare but anyone on this journey would not use CC as it would take about 1 hour longer- how crazy is that)?
It seems to me that the advance booking systems of ATW & Virgin cannot work out cheap fares for such a journey. Compare that with King's Cross to Edinburgh with East Coast where the costs are much lower. Hence my suggestion that 'Gerald' could be used to provide a through service with reasonable fares.
PS: Cheaper fares for this route can be acquired by splitting tickets with Crewe & Preston usually being the split points. Joe Public are surely not going to know that three tickets works out cheaper?

There's an Off Peak Return through fare at £167, comes up on the ATW site, travel after 0930, any route.
If you split at Crewe using ATW and VT, there are hardly any time restrictions with Off Peak tickets.
You can also get decent Advance fares on ATW to Crewe with VT onwards, or to Manchester with TPE onwards.
I can see £33 split Advance fares on the ATW site (two legs).

 

[trainophile]

We've done Hereford to Newport a couple of times, and Hereford to Cardiff just last Friday. Even at the tail end of the route, we were still served full breakfasts and treated like royalty, despite our 'on holiday' dress. The staff are second to none in their friendliness. Even the ticket inspector asked for ours with due reverence!

However, on each occasion there has never been more than half a dozen others in the coach, although presumably some may have disembarked at Chester or Shrewsbury.

With our senior railcards we worked out that we couldn't have bought a decent breakfast and paid the standard class fare for what we paid. We also got a newspaper (two actually, as they were trying to get rid of them). Absolute bargain, and such a lovely way to start a journey. I will be extremely sorry to see it ended.

 

[Welshman]

We have used it twice on two return journeys from North Wales to Cardiff, and been impressed on both occasions.

However, the numbers travelling made it quite clear the service was too good to last.

I do hope the chef and staff find other jobs.

 

[berneyarms]

Can someone please answer the question pose earlier.

When is it proposed that this will happen?

 

[Clip]

Can someone please answer the question pose earlier.

When is it proposed that this will happen?

I think the concensus is that knwo one knows yet

 

[ReeceEmmitt]

A shame.
I live in the south while my good lady works for Betsi Cadwaladr in the north so I race for this service most Fridays.
Apart from the fact that it's departure is an hour early for most business travellers, it's pretty enjoyable. More comfortable and spacious than a Coradia - which is saying something - and feels like a real train which makes the little boy in my heart jump for joy.
Hopefully the service itself won't be cut - because what will be missed the most? The plug sockets.

 

[Starmill]

The bottom line is that with the funding cuts faced by the WG it's extremely difficult to justify subsidising anon profit making premium service that probably should never have been introduced int he first place. (I mean the restaurant, not the Holyhead - Cardiff service itself)

Exactly. It would be good if we weren't in this position had they not introduced it!

I hope a use can be found for the loco hauled train to provide extra capacity where it is actually needed.

 

[merlodlliw]

Can someone please answer the question pose earlier.

When is it proposed that this will happen?

As ATW are in discussions with the staff involved, I say discussions no nice way of putting it, my guess is December timetable change, If the funding to ATW from Welsh Government runs out in December.
Gerald is an open access service & can be withdrawn at any time,so long as the South Wales return stops on the 1716 are catered for.

 

[Blindtraveler]

I am sheduled to do this in a few weeks, I hope it isnt gone by then, Nov 11th, I'd be most unhappy with a 175!

 

[Greenback]

I don't see any mention of cutting the train itself, only the catering aspect. Unless I've missed something, of course.

 

[merlodlliw]

I don't see any mention of cutting the train itself, only the catering aspect. Unless I've missed something, of course.

You are correct for the time being,I just made the point Gerald could axed without consultation being a non franchise service.

 

[Greenback]

Yes, you are right. Who knows, it may come to that one day, should ATW have sufficient stock to not need loco's and coaches.

 

[berneyarms]

The suggestion above is that the chef would be withdrawn, and in his place, there would be microwaved alternatives.

I've not seen any mention of the train itself being withdrawn.

 

[Envoy]

LNW-GW Joint - many thanks for fares advice.

It has been mentioned that relatively few people make use of the dining facility. Does anyone know if any effort is made to induce second class passengers to dine on the train? Are they allowed to transfer to the first class dining car or are table cloths put out in second class? Are the menus placed on the tables in second class? Do the menus carry the name of the train?
http://www.arrivatrainswales.co.uk/PremierServiceMenu/

 

[berneyarms]

Standard Class passengers can purchase meals from the buffet - they are advertised via the PA system.

They can take it back to their own seat.

Only first class passengers can sit in the first class dining coach.