Ask Your Routeing Guide Questions Here! your views

[transportphoto]

Hi All,
I have just had a thought.. Please don't punish me if it isn't a Very Good One - Just say it Politely Please!
Here I Go...

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This is a New Thread which I aimed to simplify this section by asking you all to post your Routeing Guide inquiries here. Obviously there are going to be problems where Person XXX is asking about one thing whilst Person AAA is asking another, one way of getting around that is to ask you all to wait for one to be answered and confirmed to be correct and then post your question.

As we get so many of these all under different titles etc... on here nobody knows whats what by the title (example London to Taunton - fare enq? or a route enq?)

So if I could ask for Questions to be asked in a Simply but Informative way e.g.

From XXX
To ZZZ
Valid Via:
CCC or LLL?

or in a similar way

And for the replies Just quote the original question (for the one you are answering) and give the details you feel appropriate.

The Routing Guides can Be found via ATOC & via this URL
http://www.atoc.org/about-atoc/rail-...routeing-guide
or by Clicking Here

The Rules (I've gathered what I've seen around the forums)

Section F of the roteing guide expands on the insructions in Section A
Regarding maps the expanded instructions are

If the route code has several maps, route tracing must observe the following rules:
1. Tracing must start at one of the ends of the route code.
2. All maps must be used.
3. Maps must be used in strict sequence, first to last or last to first, according to the
end of the route code where reading began.
4. Tracing may move from map to map only at a point where the two maps touch.
5. Once route tracing has left a map it cannot return to it.
6. Journeys may not double back except between stations which are members of a
routeing point group for interchange or unless an easement permits it.

Peter

Direct Trains Are Always Valid - No Matter How Slow / Fast or How Obscure the Route is!
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As I said at the top this was just an idea - if it isn't a very good one and Admin / Mods don't like it just lock it. I couldn't find out with out trying! Thanks

 

[OwlMan]

Hi All,
IThe Routing Guides can Be found via ATOC & via this URL
http://www.atoc-backup.org/rsp/Routeing_Guide/
or by Clicking Here
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The url for the current issue of the NRG is
http://www.atoc.org/about-atoc/rail-settlement-plan/routeing-guide

The one quoted above is a backup site showing an old version.

Peter

 

[wintonian]

Does anyone fancy posting a brief summary of the rules in the routing guide e.g. direct trains always valid, fare rule, use all maps in order etc....?

As I still get very confused although I think I have a basic understanding of the guide.

Or indeed any tips on how to learn how to use the guide because it’s bleeding confusing?

 

[yorkie]

Does anyone fancy posting a brief summary of the rules in the routing guide e.g. direct trains always valid, fare rule, use all maps in order etc....?

That's available here.

As I still get very confused although I think I have a basic understanding of the guide.

Or indeed any tips on how to learn how to use the guide because it’s bleeding confusing?

Yes the basic instructions are not sufficient. Some examples are here. Once you've read all that, there are more examples on this forum, e.g. this one.

 

[wintonian]

I ment I've read the instructions 2 or 3 times but still get confussed.

It would be so much easier if it was avalible on paper.

 

[yorkie]

If you have problems reading it on screen you could print it out that's the only way to get it on paper - it's no longer published!

If there's a particular piece of the instructions you are unsure about, if you quote it here I'm sure someone will be able to help

 

[transportphoto]

I have just updated the title - added your views.

I will probably start the proper one when it is decided what I should put in the first post of that forum (if it goes ahead.)

 

[A60K]

I don't think keeping all queries in a single thread would be helpful - it would make it too awkward to use and search for. Far better to keep queries about individual routes in individual threads, the same as anything else.

I'm sure we wouldn't consider putting all questions relating to EMUs in one thread. I say keep it exactly as it is, because it works fine at the moment. I would be a bit disappointed if this policy has been implemented, as transportphoto's last post implies - or is this just a proposal that hasn't been agreed?

 

[transportphoto]

I don't think keeping all queries in a single thread would be helpful - it would make it too awkward to use and search for. Far better to keep queries about individual routes in individual threads, the same as anything else.

I'm sure we wouldn't consider putting all questions relating to EMUs in one thread. I say keep it exactly as it is, because it works fine at the moment. I would be a bit disappointed if this policy has been implemented, as transportphoto's last post implies - or is this just a proposal that hasn't been agreed?

Sorry, I will reword my last post as it has caused confusion.

 

[Greenback]

I don't see any advantage in putting all routeing enquiries into one thread. I like to see thread titles with the station names in them' that way, I can tell instantly if the subject is relevant or of interest to me, whether it's a fare enquiry or routing query. In one thread, I would have to trawl through many pages of enquiries, perticularly if I have been away for a few days, as I have recently!

I agree with A60K, it would be awkward to use and read, as shown by the requirment to have 'rules'. It ain;t broke, so there's no need to fix it!

 

[dan_atki]

Indeed, it would make things very clunky when there is no problem with the current system. Waiting for one enquiry to be resolved before another is started is also impractical by its very nature here.

In some cases, there is a large amount of discussion regarding a single query and, dependent on the question, a can of worms can be opened. The most obvious example to me is Route Birmingham tickets and their acceptance (or previous lack of) on Wrexham and Shropshire. Several pages of replies later and discussions with ATOC, the tickets are now accepted on their services.

The Routeing Guide is a very difficult document to use and each enquiry can throw its own quirks. I think it is best left to individual threads and I'm sure many of the other regulars in this section of the forum will agree.

 

[DaveNewcastle]

I strongly agree with the other replies - that each separate enquiry should have its own thread and be allowed to reach its own conclusion quite independently of each other.
The excellent service offered by this forum would become confused and difficult to use if they were merged.
Similarly, the forum is already becoming muddled and unhelpful when people post replies which are no more than hunches, hearsay and other un-researched thoughts (all of which are often innacurate). The strength of this section is in the quality of its advice, and we should all try to maintain that quality where we can (and to remain silent if we can't ! ! ! ).

One improvement to useability might come from more consistency in thread titles:- The best titles are those that specify the journey start & end points in full, plus any special conditions, and the worst are those such as "help required", "urgent advice please", "angry again". Perhaps a moderator could intervene to "improve" a thread's title when they really don't say anything informative about the query?

 

[flymo]

A NO vote from me.

I've never posted a fare or route query myself but it is the part of the forum I read the most. I always feel I learn something and follow many threads to their conclusion. It is a fascinating insight into the world of fares and routeing. Keep it as it is as it is fairly easy to follow.

 

[Greenback]

Hear, hear, Dave and Flymo, and I have voted 'no' too now!

 

[Mojo]

As this isn't a question or discussion topic about fares, tickeing or routeing I'm going to move the thread as it's going to cause problems with people looking for advice or wanting to discuss things; not to debate the constitutional arrangements of the forum!

 

[transportphoto]

Ok - where to?

(it was at the start - but then I haven't got the powers to move it! (So I just renamed!))


This thread is now in GENERAL DISSCUSSION

 

[Ivo]

It's a good idea in principle but one single thread would rapidly become clogged with lost queries and interruptions. So on that basis, I have to vote "no". Sorry.

 

[Greenback]

Could consideration be given to splitting the fares, tickets and routeing section, so that there is a seperate routeing guide section, rather than a thread?

 

[Mojo]

Could consideration be given to splitting the fares, tickets and routeing section, so that there is a seperate routeing guide section, rather than a thread?

No need; it's not as if there is a lot of confusion between the enquiries, and adding further forums would just lead to complication. Any thread on fares, ticketing and routeing should appear as its own thread for different enquiries or discussion topics.

 

[Greenback]

You're right Mojo! Afte rmy post I went out and thought about it while on the train! There's alot of crossover between routeing guide and fare enquiries!