Are regular NR tickets able to be used on the sleepers?

[Bittern]

Say I wanted to do Glasgow Central - Penzance, standard class on both the Caledonian and Night Rivera sleepers. Would I be allowed to use a regular ticket I pick up at a ticket office (eg. a single to Penzance) on the sleepers?

 

[yorkie]

Yes, but I recommend you reserve a seat, particularly if travelling on busy days such as Fridays, and particularly on the Caledonian sleeper.

 

[Bittern]

Thanks. I always reserve seats when doing long distance journeys anyway. It's just for future reference, really.

 

[wintonian]

You mean to say they let you on so you can stand all night if it's full up!! hock:hock:hock:

 

[CarterUSM]

No, it is at the guards discretion. It should be no problem booking a seat though.

 

[First class]

On the ScotRail sleeper, you can be refused travel if you do not hold a reservation as it is advertised as a 'mandatory reservation' service. Signs went up about this at Euston for a few months a while back because the situation was getting quite bad with turning people away.

The FGW Night Riviera Sleeper allows you to board the seated portion of the train just like any normal daytime one. Therefore if you are standing up then it's your choice. The guard would not refuse carriage as reservations are not compulsory and no rules/policies exist preventing you from standing.

If you're definitely going on this and hold a ticket, I would recommend making a seat reservation...

About the Sleepers in UK

http://www.networkrail.co.uk/browse%20documents/eNRT/Dec09/Sleepers.pdf

 

[yorkie]

The Fort William service is a normal service between Edinburgh and Fort William, and yes I've seen people stand all the way from Edinburgh to Fort William on that.

 

[reb0118]

On the ScotRail sleepers reservations are compulsory in the seated area. Wether there is space or not if you do not hold a seat reservation then your ticket is not valid.

Train Managers/ Guards can however sell a "ScotRail only" ticket on demand if space is available.

Any "normal" ticket is valid in the seated area if you hold a seat reservation.

Exception. Tickets purchased with an MOD warrant are issued from/to the origin/destination as stated on the warrant - travel subject to space being available.

The reasoning behind this is that ScotRail do not get any revenue from an unreserved SVR from Edinburgh to London e.g. but do so if a reservation is made onto the sleeper with such a ticket.

 

[yorkie]

On the ScotRail sleepers reservations are compulsory in the seated area. Wether there is space or not if you do not hold a seat reservation then your ticket is not valid.

I don't think there can be any justification for saying it is 'not valid' but I can understand that they can refuse travel if it's full.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

The reasoning behind this is that ScotRail do not get any revenue from an unreserved SVR from Edinburgh to London e.g. but do so if a reservation is made onto the sleeper with such a ticket.

Revenue allocation does not, and can not, determine validity.

 

[Bittern]

Yeah that one confused me there for a second...

 

[reb0118]

Revenue allocation does not, and can not, determine validity.

With the exception of the seated Fort William to Edinburgh section which is reservation recommended all travel on the Scotrail sleepers seated or otherwise is reservation compulsory. Therefore if you do not have a seat reservation there is a very great possibility that you will not be allowed to board.

It is not your ticket validity per se that stops you boarding but your lack of a reservation. As seats are limited this is primarily to stop overcrowding. Revenue allocation is important in this instance however as Scotrail get next to no revenue from cross border tickets. The sleeper trains are very expensive to operate and at present the only way to recover the correct revenue is to ensure that all seated passengers have valid reservations. Prospective passengers without reservations can however purchase "Scotrail only" tickets from the train manager at trainside prior to departure if space is available.

The problem I feel is with the reservation system in that it shuts down to early esp for sleeper travel. If a train is reservation compulsory then it should it theory be able to book a seat up to 5 minutes before it leaves your station (note not the origin of the service). With modern technology this could even be done on your mobile phone via text messaging - a confirmation can even be sent to the train manager to inform him that another passenger is joining en-route.

 

[rail-britain]

The problem I feel is with the reservation system in that it shuts down to early esp for sleeper travel

When I worked on the sleepers (INTERCITY 1990s) the cutoff was typically 20:00
This allowed the train crew time in which to collect it, typically 30 minutes after that

However, southbound some stations would phone us to check if there were spare berths
Dundee and Edinburgh would normally phone on Fridays and Sundays

 

[Flying Snail]

With the exception of the seated Fort William to Edinburgh section which is reservation recommended all travel on the Scotrail sleepers seated or otherwise is reservation compulsory. Therefore if you do not have a seat reservation there is a very great possibility that you will not be allowed to board.

It is not your ticket validity per se that stops you boarding but your lack of a reservation. As seats are limited this is primarily to stop overcrowding. Revenue allocation is important in this instance however as Scotrail get next to no revenue from cross border tickets. The sleeper trains are very expensive to operate and at present the only way to recover the correct revenue is to ensure that all seated passengers have valid reservations. Prospective passengers without reservations can however purchase "Scotrail only" tickets from the train manager at trainside prior to departure if space is available.

The problem I feel is with the reservation system in that it shuts down to early esp for sleeper travel. If a train is reservation compulsory then it should it theory be able to book a seat up to 5 minutes before it leaves your station (note not the origin of the service). With modern technology this could even be done on your mobile phone via text messaging - a confirmation can even be sent to the train manager to inform him that another passenger is joining en-route.

You are just repeating what you previously stated.

I can understand refusing people without reservations if the service is full or fully booked including passengers reserved from later stops. However I would certainly not agree that it is acceptable to demand a new ticket be purchased by passengers who already hold a ticket valid for the journey but do not have a reservation in the event of unreserved seats being available.

I am not saying that they would not/are not doing this just that I doubt the legality of it.

BTW the Fort William - Edinburgh sleeper is still listed as reservation compulsory in the current timetables as it has been back to BR times.

 

[Sleepy]

Please note PRIV tickets are NOT permitted on seated portions of Scotrail Sleepers as stated in NFM 06 but are on Cornish Sleeper.

 

[yorkie]

Has anyone been told they cannot board the train as there are no reservations available but they can travel if they pay for a new ticket? I do not see how that can be legal! Has it happened? I suspect not?