Anti-Fooball

[HST Power]

How many other sports do players cheat on a regular basis though? For example deliberately diving to get a penalty.

Can't really do that in a majority of other sports. You're diving a lot anyway in Rugby!

 

[Zoe]

Can't really do that in a majority of other sports. You're diving a lot anyway in Rugby!

I was just giving the example of how people cheat in football. How many other sports do players often cheat in?

 

[HST Power]

There was the Pakistan Cricket incident where the players were deliberately bowling certain types of balls for some betting syndicate to make their money (I'm no cricket expert, so I only know the vague details of the case!)

 

[EM2]

I was just giving the example of how people cheat in football. How many other sports do players often cheat in?

A friend of mine is a drugs tester for athletics. some of the ingenious ways they used to try and cheat are unbelievable. For example, a false penis filled with clean urine?!
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I am similarly ignorant when it comes to foopball.

You are Nigel Molesworth and I claim my five pounds!
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I wonder if I am unique, in that I like most sports, trains and soaps! Not all of them miind, but I do watch Enders, Corrie and Emmerdale...
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

There was the Pakistan Cricket incident where the players were deliberately bowling certain types of balls for some betting syndicate to make their money (I'm no cricket expert, so I only know the vague details of the case!)

There are also incidents of bowlers and fielders scraping, picking or otherwise trying to modify the ball to make it behave in a certain way.

 

[Minilad]

I would be amazed if there is a sport anywhere on the planet where some players don't try and cheat to gain an advantage
And please cut the bull about Rugby having the high moral ground. It doesn't

 

[HST Power]

make it behave in a certain way.

Disciplining the ball, eh?

 

[Seacook]

-

You are Nigel Molesworth and I claim my five pounds!
.

Rumbled! That's nigel molesworth, foopball was not a typo. Where do I send the cheque?

 

[Ivo]

Doesn't this just sum up what most people dislike about football. Take a perfectly reasonable thread, and it degenerates into a fantasy team chat. The blinking "sport" gets everywhere, and ruins everything, like rising damp.

There's a bit of a difference between this and the usual "fantasy chat" though. This is more about teaching the sissies tht play the game that they aren't the most important people in the world and need to act like mature men and not five year old girls. In that respect, it isn't anti-football as such, but it is anti-player - and you can't play football without players.

Regarding the cheating thing, even my (and seemingly HST Power's) favourite sport is not immune from cheating; in fact, F1 has more than its fair share - and not just of minor infringements either. Name another sport in which several men have been found guilty of holding technical data of another team, sacked, and been seriously threatened with court action (whilst watching their team get disqualified)...

 

[HST Power]

There's a bit of a difference between this and the usual "fantasy chat" though. This is more about teaching the sissies tht play the game that they aren't the most important people in the world and need to act like mature men and not five year old girls. In that respect, it isn't anti-football as such, but it is anti-player - and you can't play football without players.

Regarding the cheating thing, even my (and seemingly HST Power's) favourite sport is not immune from cheating; in fact, F1 has more than its fair share - and not just of minor infringements either. Name another sport in which several men have been found guilty of holding technical data of another team, sacked, and been seriously threatened with court action (whilst watching their team get disqualified)...

Well said!

This thread was far from a fantasy league debate. It was about footballers who need to stop acting like spoilt children and realize that they are not the only ones on the centre stage. This doesn't go for all of them, but for all the massive egos, massive bank balances and hordes of women they seem to get for kicking a ball between posts, their attitudes can be reminiscent to six year olds who couldn't have a lollipop from the corner shop.

F1 has certainly suffered at the hands of cheating. There was the crash gate affair in Singapore, the spy gate affair with Mclaren and Ferrari, the controversy surrounding Fernando Alonso and Lewis Hamilton, and of course, lets not forget the 'Fernando is faster than you' saga in Germany last year, when Massa was 'asked' to pull over so a supposedly quicker Alonso could go through and run at the heels of Vettel.

F1 comes first for me every day of the year!

 

[EM2]

I would rather support some of the crappest teams in the country, than any of the teams in the premiership. I'm proud of my ignorance towards football, I dont know anything about how divisions, leagues, friendlys and any other form of football listings works. I'm sure the organisers or managers of football are autistic becuse they feel they have to meticulously, list and catagorise something that has about as much purpose as trainspotting, or the lib dems.

If you walk into an 8 year old football nutters room, they will probably have a premiership wall chart and a stickers collection which they will have to catagorise and list. Its as if football is encouraging people to have autistic traits deliberately. They seem to encourage people to obsessively collect football merchandised crap, to drool every time Wayne Rooney decides to park his car in another womans garage, watch every match with endless replays, fill their heads with useless knowledge etc etc.

Side note, why is football called the beautiful game? Forgive me if I'm missing a massive point but a bunch pot bellied lager drinking louts are hardly beautiful, Its like calling train spotting the sexy hobby.

I don't get this post. You say you don't understand how divisions and leagues work, yet that you wouldn't support a Premiership team (even some of them were, in the not too distant past 'some of the crappest teams in the country'). So you surely do know that the PL is the highest ecehelon of club football?
Those teams (Wolverhampton Wanderers are a good example) were right at the bottom English professional football but fought and battled and pulled themselves up to the highest level in the country. Isn't that something to admire?
And the players are not pot-bellied lager-drinking louts. If they were, then they wouldn't be able to cover fifteen miles in a game, two (and sometimes three) times a week for ten months (and longer if they play in a major international championship).

 

[Ivo]

I would rather support some of the crappest teams in the country, than any of the teams in the premiership. I'm proud of my ignorance towards football, I dont know anything about how divisions, leagues, friendlys and any other form of football listings works. I'm sure the organisers or managers of football are autistic becuse they feel they have to meticulously, list and catagorise something that has about as much purpose as trainspotting, or the lib dems.

Pardon my saying this, but I would appreciate it if you took back the autism line. There is a lot of strategy involved in football - even if it doesn't appear that way - which means the managers have to be on top of their game and understand a lot of rules and information. This doesn't make someone autistic, even if it could be considered an autistic trait. And the same would apply to the many idi... I mean, fans who support the (tens of) thousands of clubs the world over. Everyone has something they will know a lot about, even where they are accepted to be of limited mental capacity. And I personally am not overly interested in football, but it doesn't mean I can't know an awful lot about its history, structure and, dare I say it, outcomes. I have even simulated Leagues before now (for some reason Manchester City always under perform though...). I probably know more about every club in the Premiership than at least 75% of their individual fanbase, and the same could be said of most of the Championship as well. To give an example, I doubt most Liverpool supporters would be able to tell you that their club was the first to win the League title at the first attempt after promotion.

I will admit that my argument is weakened by virtue of me actually being autistic though.

Back to the anti-football sentiment, it is interesting to note how city streets tend to be safer on non-football days in many areas, especially when clubs like Millwall are involved (EM2, if your team are relegated, I wish you luck in surviving those derbies next season).

 

[43021HST]

I don't get this post. You say you don't understand how divisions and leagues work, yet that you wouldn't support a Premiership team (even some of them were, in the not too distant past 'some of the crappest teams in the country'). So you surely do know that the PL is the highest ecehelon of club football?
Those teams (Wolverhampton Wanderers are a good example) were right at the bottom English professional football but fought and battled and pulled themselves up to the highest level in the country. Isn't that something to admire?
And the players are not pot-bellied lager-drinking louts. If they were, then they wouldn't be able to cover fifteen miles in a game, two (and sometimes three) times a week for ten months (and longer if they play in a major international championship).

I had to ask someone first about the premiership before I wrote this, by the way regarding Wolverhampton wanderers, no I couldnt give a sh**. I didnt say the players were pot bellied louts, the players look like poofs with their fancy hair cuts and stupid names.

Thats what makes the game boring, the football players are too fit. I would rather watch a bunch of wheezing louts play the game, it would be much more amusing.

 

[EM2]

Ah, so it's homophobia now?
But you implied that the the players are pot-bellied louts. You said 'why is football called the beautiful game? Forgive me if I'm missing a massive point but a bunch pot bellied lager drinking louts are hardly beautiful'.
It's the players that make the beautiful game with their skill and control. No-one is suggesting it's the supporters that are beautiful!

 

[ralphchadkirk]

Ah, so it's homophobia now?

It certainly seems like it.

 

[Eng274]

I enjoy watching football, rugby sometimes, F1, darts, snooker (strangely enchanting I find) and touring cars. Many sports have taken steps to level the playing field, because a couple of major teams have left the rest of the series for dead on numerous occasions, which is why the winning touring cars are ballasted after the first race on a race day to give the others a chance.

Football can be garish at times, but being a follower of a financially responsible team (living within their means, our weekly gates couldn't pay for John Terry's salary) in Edinburgh, I wouldn't be a glory-hunter in any sense of the word.

Unfortunately, a big problem in scottish football is sectarianism; moreso on the west coast. But the SFA are too pally with the glasgow teams to do something decisive about it, and are being made to look inept by UEFA's threats of making Rangers play in an empty stadium because the fans can't behave themselves.

Re the political football teams. I would pay lots of money to charity to see Boris Johnson pole-axe Nick Clegg in a football match, like he gored somebody in the last charity 'friendly' he participated in! Go Boris, you are a brilliant charismatic reckless buffoon, long may your tenure in London continue!

 

[CarterUSM]

Unfortunately, a big problem in scottish football is sectarianism;



It is a problem, but not as great as its been made out to be. I would argue that a bigger problem in Scottish Fitba, is dwindling supports, unfair distribution of monies, lack of quality youth setups, not to mention poor league construction and some clubs still living outwith their now meagre means. On the subject of the possible 2 game ban for Rangers, I still find it funny that UEFA decided to act on evidence from some fans group despite their own observer at the match having reporting nowt. The so called "shame game" was pretty tame too, I have been at far worse matches, the one at Parkhead where Hugh Dallas and several players were struck with coins springs to mind, amongst others.

 

[MidnightFlyer]

It is a problem, but not as great as its been made out to be. I would argue that a bigger problem in Scottish Fitba, is dwindling supports, unfair distribution of monies, lack of quality youth setups, not to mention poor league construction and some clubs still living outwith their now meagre means. On the subject of the possible 2 game ban for Rangers, I still find it funny that UEFA decided to act on evidence from some fans group despite their own observer at the match having reporting nowt. The so called "shame game" was pretty tame too, I have been at far worse matches, the one at Parkhead where Hugh Dallas and several players were struck with coins springs to mind, amongst others.

Indeed. I'm not 100% sure what to make of the restructuring proposals, but something needs to be done. There are 42 football teams in the Scottish league set-up, the trouble is is about only 16 of them are any good (and sadly the rest seem to plaay English non-league level football). You need youth academies, better grounds, more fans etc. Sadly, it ain't happening at the moment.

The trouble with the proposed restructuring is that it just give the Gers, the enemy, Hearts and Dundee Utd more points a season automatically. maybe the Old Firm is the only thing keeping Scottish pro footy on the map, without them, I think the SPL would be at Welsh Premier levels. Maybe we should take the top 6 from Scotland (I don't know how you'd decide that), place them in the English league structure, and leave Scotland as a downgraded system. Drastic, I know, but in the current status quo, Scottish football future is slowly disappearing.

 

[CarterUSM]

Indeed. I'm not 100% sure what to make of the restructuring proposals, but something needs to be done. There are 42 football teams in the Scottish league set-up, the trouble is is about only 16 of them are any good (and sadly the rest seem to plaay English non-league level football). You need youth academies, better grounds, more fans etc. Sadly, it ain't happening at the moment.

The trouble with the proposed restructuring is that it just give the Gers, the enemy, Hearts and Dundee Utd more points a season automatically. maybe the Old Firm is the only thing keeping Scottish pro footy on the map, without them, I think the SPL would be at Welsh Premier levels. Maybe we should take the top 6 from Scotland (I don't know how you'd decide that), place them in the English league structure, and leave Scotland as a downgraded system. Drastic, I know, but in the current status quo, Scottish football future is slowly disappearing.

I don't know, I wouldn't like to see Scottish clubs playing league football outwith Scotland to be honest. Gone are the days of Dundee United getting to European cup semi finals(what a team!) though. Things cannot really go on as they are however, clubs aren't bringing youths through as much as they used to either, with a few exceptions, league reconstruction is a joke, there are 3 governing bodies adding to red tape, and there isn't really any money. Splitting away from the Scottish Football league didn't really work out the way everyone thought, did it?

 

[Ivo]

Indeed. I'm not 100% sure what to make of the restructuring proposals, but something needs to be done. There are 42 football teams in the Scottish league set-up, the trouble is is about only 16 of them are any good (and sadly the rest seem to plaay English non-league level football). You need youth academies, better grounds, more fans etc. Sadly, it ain't happening at the moment.

The trouble with the proposed restructuring is that it just give the Gers, the enemy, Hearts and Dundee Utd more points a season automatically. maybe the Old Firm is the only thing keeping Scottish pro footy on the map, without them, I think the SPL would be at Welsh Premier levels. Maybe we should take the top 6 from Scotland (I don't know how you'd decide that), place them in the English league structure, and leave Scotland as a downgraded system. Drastic, I know, but in the current status quo, Scottish football future is slowly disappearing.

"The enemy"? That's my Scottish club of choice you're talking about!

Seriously though, a restructuring is needed, but for it to succeed would need cooperation from other countries. I would propose the following:

Six clubs from Scotland (the top five for League titles and also the most prominent besides them since 1980; these are Aberdeen, Celtic, Dundee United, Hearts, Hibernian and Rangers), and two clubs from Wales (I would like to suggest TNS and - if they can return to their former dominating ways from ten years ago - Barry [if not then Llanelli]), join the English League system in an expansion to 100 clubs. The League is restructured into five divisions of 20, with the present League Two between split geographically (with a boundary roughly around the River Trent). Rangers and Celtic go straight into the Prem, while the other four Scottish clubs join the Championship. The two Welsh clubs then join League Two (South for Barry/Llanelli; North for TNS).

The Scottish League will suffer like this, but it should mean that the major Scottish clubs [besides Rangers and Celtic] undergo the same transformation as Cardiff and Swansea and become more widely-known, and thus able to attract better players. After all, which is stronger - the Championship, or the Scottish League minus the Old Firm?

 

[Eng274]

As much as Scottish football is a shambles, I don't think breaking it up in this manner is the answer. Not just because the SPL would toil to compete with league one sides, but logistically. Can you see/expect Inverness fans trekking to London of Birmingham eight times a season? It would be detrimental in that respect, and because of the standard mentioned, it would harm the Scottish teams that had moved. And the Scottish 'leagues' left would be many times more unattractive to outside investment than it is at the moment.

 

[Minilad]

If you ask me the best thing that could happen for the health of Scottish football is that Celtic and Rangers are closed down !

 

[HST Power]

If you ask me the best thing that could happen for the health of Scottish football is that Celtic and Rangers are closed down !

I agree. Big time. Even though I quite like Rangers!

 

[Eng274]

Unfortunately, a big problem in scottish football is sectarianism;



It is a problem, but not as great as its been made out to be. I would argue that a bigger problem in Scottish Fitba, is dwindling supports, unfair distribution of monies, lack of quality youth setups, not to mention poor league construction and some clubs still living outwith their now meagre means. On the subject of the possible 2 game ban for Rangers, I still find it funny that UEFA decided to act on evidence from some fans group despite their own observer at the match having reporting nowt. The so called "shame game" was pretty tame too, I have been at far worse matches, the one at Parkhead where Hugh Dallas and several players were struck with coins springs to mind, amongst others.

The shame game (I'm assuming you mean the recent 1-0 on the 2nd March?) could have been worse, but let's not kid ourselves that it was still acceptable. The OF have previous for making brad pitts of themselves on telly, and whether its misguided decision or not by UEFA, its about time something decisive was done. If Rangers (and indeed Celtic) were serious, they'd name and shame and ban the fans and groups thereof that continue to tarnish Rangers and Scotland's reputation on the european stage.

There are bigger fish suppers to fry for the SFA et al certainly, the deteriorating quality caused by a number of things hasn't helped. The scrapping of the reserve leagues was a monumental cock-up by the SPL, and will only be a detriment to the standard of both domestic football and our national team.

The idea of 2-tier 20 team SPL and SPL2 is a ridiculous idea, and will only make the 1st division seem better in name than it actually is. The english "championship" gets away with it because it is still a decent standard of football.

 

[MidnightFlyer]

I agree. Big time. Even though I quite like Rangers!

Yay! Welcome to the bright side!

 

[Minilad]

With regards to sectarianism I went to a Rangers game in the early 90s with the Walsall branch of the Rangers Supporters club. Many of whom were also Villa fans.
We arrived in Glasgow and went to a bar close to Ibrox. The bouncers on the door heard the English accents and asked us who we followed in England. When I said I was a Villa fan he said I couldn't come in as Villa were the Catholic club in Birmingham.
I was absolutely gobsmacked on hearing this but he was adamant he was right.
He could reel off all the major cities in England and who was the Catholic or Protestant club. And the worst thing was he actually believed it.
From that moment on I have decided that these two clubs should be avoided like the plague !!

 

[MidnightFlyer]

Indeed - those in blue tend to be the Proddie clubs - Birmingham City, Everton, Chelsea. The Gers also have quite strong followings in Stoke and Sunderland.

 

[HST Power]

Yay! Welcome to the bright side!

Thank you! Now, the small matter of getting rid of them....

 

[Minilad]

Indeed - those in blue tend to be the Proddie clubs - Birmingham City, Everton, Chelsea. The Gers also have quite strong followings in Stoke and Sunderland.

I wouldn't say there is any divide in Birmingham between Catholic / Protestant at all. It used to be South Birmingham = Birmingham, North Birmingham = Villa. Although now it's not as clear cut.

 

[MidnightFlyer]

I wouldn't say there is any divide in Birmingham between Catholic / Protestant at all. It used to be South Birmingham = Birmingham, North Birmingham = Villa. Although now it's not as clear cut.

Think it stems more from liking the Irish and not liking them.

 

[Minilad]

Think it stems more from liking the Irish and not liking them.

Evidence ?