Airdrie-Bathgate service

[First ScotRail]

helensburgh-waverley, departing hlc at xx:40 and waverley at xx:21.

 

[The Engineer]

Thanks

 

[route101]

Very strange going to Edinburgh on a 334! I can tell you it aint that comfortable as a 158/170. Does the Bathgate to Edinburgh bit still have DMU service ? Strange 334s and DMUS on the same line.

 

[MCR247]

Don't think so

 

[First ScotRail]

yes at peak times, 158 services runs to bathgate to provide additional capacity. hourly helensburghs (soon to be half hourly) run in addition to these at peak.

 

[MacCookie]

yes at peak times, 158 services runs to bathgate to provide additional capacity. hourly helensburghs (soon to be half hourly) run in addition to these at peak.

At the moment, Monday to Friday, there's an hourly electric service between Helensburgh and Edinburgh and an hourly diesel service between Bathgate and Edinburgh. During the peak periods this is supplemented by additional DMUs to give a quarter hourly service between Bathgate and Edinburgh. (Timetable on the ScotRail website)

This will, in the next few weeks, become half-hourly electric from Helensburgh with additional DMUs in the peaks giving a quarter hourly service. (Timetable recently removed from the ScotRail website)

Some time in January this should then become a quarter hourly service all day long with EMUs from Helensburgh and Milngavie. (Timetable on the Network Rail website unless they've removed in the past week or so)

Ewan

 

[me123]

On the way home from work, I noticed the 17:12 departure from Airdrie to Helensburgh (would have departed Waverley at 16:21 I think) had a nice healthy loading despite only Blackridge being open and the hourly service - good to see.

 

[Damien1986]

Would it be accurate to say that Airdrie to Bathgate probably got most of their class 334 units cascaded from the Argyle Line due to the need to keep more class 334 units there until more class 380 units arrive?

 

[Bittern]

Both trains I used over the new route yesterday were very well used.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
What unit was on the 14:06 from Edinburgh yesterday? I lost my phone on it,

 

[First ScotRail]

334015, I was on it.

 

[Bittern]

That's what I was thinking. Thanks.

 

[Train Pilchard]

"The next train at platform 1 is the xx:xx service to Edinburgh" resulted in many confused faces at platform 2 at Partick.

The display on the front said Airdrie though.

 

[Nightrider]

"The next train at platform 1 is the xx:xx service to Edinburgh" resulted in many confused faces at platform 2 at Partick.

The display on the front said Airdrie though.

Post of the month.

 

[route101]

You will get some dumb people assuming the train just runs to Edinburgh and not through Glasgow haha.

 

[Bittern]

True. Once had idiots boarding a Glasgow-bound 225 at Motherwell asking if it's already been to Edinburgh.

Oh, and they weren't very polite either.

--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

NETWORK RAIL - THE AIRDRIE BATHGATE STORY.

 

[Nightrider]

Hopefully Scottish electrification can now move full steam ahead.

 

[tbtc]

Now we've had a couple of weeks, what are the first impressions of the new line?

There have been well documented problems with weather/ units, but are things running smoother now? Are passenger numbers in line with expectations?

 

[Failed Unit]

To be honest it is hard to tell. The service on all lines has beign so bad recently it is hard to tell real loadings. The mainline has just had half hourly services, big delays etc that going via Bathgate has recently beign the quickest journey between the 2 city's. With one train per hour it will probably depress numbers. It will be helped on Sunday by engineering works. Maybe better idea next month.

 

[tbtc]

Fair enough, cheers. I didn't want to ask for progress in the first week, was wondering whether things were settling down.

I'll maybe "bump" the thread in a few weeks time...

 

[rail-britain]

Bathgate was busy today
However I noticed the number of passengers travelling to Glasgow was very low
Equally, very few passengers getting off services from Glasgow

Schools go back tomorrow, so I think next week will be a better comparison, the first full business week of use

 

[me123]

I was on the line once (I think the Tuesday after it opened) and it was very quiet between Airdrie and Bathgate, although the hourly service frequency, ongoing snow disruption and time of day wouldn't have helped. However, I have seen some fairly healthy looking loadings on evening trains from Edinburgh, and have heard about overcrowding problems on the current 07:21 from Edinburgh (although hopefully a more frequent timetable will resolve this issue). It was a fast journey through to Edinburgh, and definitely much better than driving down the M8.

Recently, Saturday timetables have been in place throughout Scotland over the festive period. This meant that a half hourly service was operating for much of the day (although it is now back to hourly at the moment), so that combined with the January sales may have boosted passenger numbers between Christmas and New Year (and, consequently, hopefully people will like the line and start using it regularly).

We now know that the 4tph frequency will not be achieved in this timetable period, due to the issues with the 380s, but hopefully the half hourly weekday service will give a boost to passenger numbers when it arrives. As has been said, this will be the real test for the route - half hourly trains will provide a usable and acceptable service frequency on the line.

It's a shame that it's encountered problems; it's a great line and it deserves to do well. It will be a real asset for North Lanarkshire and West Lothian.

It's also worth noting that only Blackridge is open at the moment. Once Drumgelloch, Armadale and (to a lesser extent) Caldercruix open as well, you'll probably see more people hopping on the train. I doubt many people will be using the buses.

 

[tbtc]

It's a shame that it's encountered problems; it's a great line and it deserves to do well. It will be a real asset for North Lanarkshire and West Lothian

Agreed.

The trouble (and I don't want to sound overly-pessimistic) is that we are justifying future reopenings by saying "Alloa got more passengers than expected, Ebbw Vale got more passengers than expected..." but one "underperforming" reopening may harm the cause for future ones.

Hopefully things settle down in the next few months...

 

[First ScotRail]

I was on the line today and my service was well loaded from Airdrie, blackridge looked busy as well.

You have the commuter hotspots at the minute of Edinburgh-Bathgate and Airdrie-Glasgow. Lets just hope the bit in between grows. I know alot of people further west of Glasgow who are very keen to use the service however at the minute the service seems so unreliable with services being frequently cancelled from Helensburgh due to unit shortages.

 

[me123]

The trouble (and I don't want to sound overly-pessimistic) is that we are justifying future reopenings by saying "Alloa got more passengers than expected, Ebbw Vale got more passengers than expected..." but one "underperforming" reopening may harm the cause for future ones.

I fear you may be right. The initial passenger numbers for the route, like it or not, will be lower than expected because the line is opening with only 1tph (compared to the anticipated 4tph) and with the intermediate stations out of use. Now, hopefully, by the end of 2011 we shall see the full service and all stations open. But until then, we have to make do with what we've got.

Problem is, the bean counters will probably see this as a failure. If it doesn't meet their expectations, it could definitely put a question mark over the Borders Rail Link in these uncertain times (especially if Labour win the next election and reinstate GARL) and have a significant adverse effect on any future rail reopenings in Scotland - things like a line to St Andrews, extending the Larkhall line, reopening the line to Kilmalcolm, etc

Projects recently have been justified at least in part by claiming that Alloa and Larkhall were big success stories. And indeed they were. In fact, I'm sure this claim was also used to push through the Airdrie-Bathgate project. The problem with this strategy is that even the slightest blip in passenger numbers for whatever reason (either a genuine overestimation, or as in this case issues affecting the service on the new line) will potentially mar future rail projects. To that end, I would hope that the initial passenger numbers are reported in the context of the reduced service.

Having said all this, the M8 completion works due to take place over the next few years will surely push people onto the new line, even if it is only a temporary measure. A significant boost in passenger numbers later on could actually be beneficial for new railway lines.

 

[tbtc]

I fear you may be right. The initial passenger numbers for the route, like it or not, will be lower than expected because the line is opening with only 1tph (compared to the anticipated 4tph) and with the intermediate stations out of use. Now, hopefully, by the end of 2011 we shall see the full service and all stations open. But until then, we have to make do with what we've got.

Problem is, the bean counters will probably see this as a failure. If it doesn't meet their expectations, it could definitely put a question mark over the Borders Rail Link in these uncertain times (especially if Labour win the next election and reinstate GARL) and have a significant adverse effect on any future rail reopenings in Scotland - things like a line to St Andrews, extending the Larkhall line, reopening the line to Kilmalcolm, etc

Projects recently have been justified at least in part by claiming that Alloa and Larkhall were big success stories. And indeed they were. In fact, I'm sure this claim was also used to push through the Airdrie-Bathgate project. The problem with this strategy is that even the slightest blip in passenger numbers for whatever reason (either a genuine overestimation, or as in this case issues affecting the service on the new line) will potentially mar future rail projects. To that end, I would hope that the initial passenger numbers are reported in the context of the reduced service.

Having said all this, the M8 completion works due to take place over the next few years will surely push people onto the new line, even if it is only a temporary measure. A significant boost in passenger numbers later on could actually be beneficial for new railway lines.

I agree with all of that.

Whilst we "enthusiasts" understand the background, and that some of the problems were "unexpected", there is the danger that one "bad" reopening will attract headlines like "Over budget and delayed - the ghost train which only carries half the expected passenger numbers"...

Look at the way the Cambridge Guided Busway has generated bad publicity for other busways (it'll be a long time before Cambridge is forgotten, even though Ipswich/ Leeds/ Bradford show it can work.

Similarly,large public building schemes (Millenium Dome, London Olympics) which go over-budget, are delayed (etc) make people sceptical of whether the UK can build HS2 on time and on budget (which ignores the building projects which have been a success and have been built on time/ on budget).

Like I say, I hope A2B is given time and that people only form judgements after a few months of operation. But I wouldn't be surprised if A2B gives a bad name to the re-openings/ extensions you mention (like the Borders line).

 

[rail-britain]

I had a discussion with someone today
"Didn't realise I could get a train to Shettleston, sounds good"
Then I mentioned instead of 4 trains per hour it was just one
"Stuff that, I'll take the car"; and that's what it is currently up against, due to a really basic timetable

 

[kylemore]

I agree with all of that.



Look at the way the Cambridge Guided Busway has generated bad publicity for other busways (it'll be a long time before Cambridge is forgotten, even though Ipswich/ Leeds/ Bradford show it can work.

Yes but the difference is that properly thought out rail schemes ie. AtoB but not Edinburgh Tram, are sensible, while Guided Busways are complete nonsense. The great advantage of the bus is it's flexibilty and ability to economically serve smaller passenger flows that rail cant.
Guided infrastructure for Rail transport is neccesary for buses it is not, the driver is perfectly capable of guiding it himself! By all means have bus lanes and even roads reserved for buses but the guided part is about as useful as a fifth leg on a horse.
These guided busways were seen by our useless govt. masters as a cheap way of avoiding spending money on real infrastructure, the bus industry just jumped on the bandwagon even coming up with buses with a bit of fancy skirting which they attempted to pass off as an "alternative" to rail based infrastructure.
However they are not as cheap as they thought and are a poor alternative, the Edinburgh one was falling apart before it was closed for conversion to tramway!

 

[Damien1986]

I read,on wikipedia I think,that class 320 units maybe used on peak services on the Airdrie to Bathgate route,is this true or just a rumour?

 

[ObservationCar]

Great to see the route re-open. But as odd as this may sound, it would have been beter in hindsight for this project to have over-run. Even if there was just PR spin put on it. But with the shortage of units and intermediate stations not yet open, it would have been beter to say it won't be ready until March.

That way the weather would have been warmer, trains would work, there would be addiquite stock provision, infrastructure completed and a good time for there to be great fanfare of an opening, heralding the rush to try out this "new", "completed" line.

 

[Failed Unit]

I caught the 0721 ex Edinburgh service at Glasgow today. 3 coach and totally rammed so I suspect the people that used that service in the past may be wishing the line hadn't opened.