Advice on Potential Prosecution for Fare Evasion! Please Help

[ridz17]

I was stopped by a ticket inspector at Waterloo station and I had a ticket from Vauxhall to Waterloo with the wrong railcard. I actually came from a few stops earlier. He took my details and I paid the actual fare.

I received an email last week about potential prosecution- they had access to my trainline account and found that it had been done multiple times (using the incorrect railcard and incorrect stations)

They said if I respond with a truthful account of my journeys then I can pay a settlement and avoid it going to court.

What should I expect to happen?? I don’t want it to go to court or for me to go to jail.

Someone please help

 

[Gloster]

It would help if you could post a copy of the e-mail that you received on this forum so that the experts know exactly how the railway is dealing with it. Obscure your name, address and any other identifying details, such as reference numbers.

Your chances of going to jail are virtually zero.

 

[Fawkes Cat]

I was stopped by a ticket inspector at Waterloo station and I had a ticket from Vauxhall to Waterloo with the wrong railcard. I actually came from a few stops earlier. He took my details and I paid the actual fare.

I received an email last week about potential prosecution- they had access to my trainline account and found that it had been done multiple times (using the incorrect railcard and incorrect stations)

They said if I respond with a truthful account of my journeys then I can pay a settlement and avoid it going to court.

What should I expect to happen?? I don’t want it to go to court or for me to go to jail.

Someone please help

Welcome to the forum!

You can be certain that you won't go to prison: even if the worst comes to the worst, the only sentence that is allowed for fare dodging is a fine (there is more detail than this, but this is the headline that you need to know).

Realistically, what we've seen when people get this type of letter is that if they fully disclose what they've been doing, and are prepared to pay back the fares that they dodged plus an administration fee then there will be no further action taken. So go through your trainline history and see what it has to say, and tell the railway this. As long as what you come up with is much the same as what they've found out, they may well let you settle out of court.

 

[ridz17]

Welcome to the forum!

You can be certain that you won't go to prison: even if the worst comes to the worst, the only sentence that is allowed for fare dodging is a fine (there is more detail than this, but this is the headline that you need to know).

Realistically, what we've seen when people get this type of letter is that if they fully disclose what they've been doing, and are prepared to pay back the fares that they dodged plus an administration fee then there will be no further action taken. So go through your trainline history and see what it has to say, and tell the railway this. As long as what you come up with is much the same as what they've found out, they may well let you settle out of court.

Yes I’ve gone through my history- they’ve flagged up ‘suspicious’ journeys but there have been multiple times where I have used the 16-17 railcard instead of my 16-25. And other times where I have come from a different station. I have attached the email they sent to me.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 18 Jun 2024 ==

Welcome to the forum!

You can be certain that you won't go to prison: even if the worst comes to the worst, the only sentence that is allowed for fare dodging is a fine (there is more detail than this, but this is the headline that you need to know).

Realistically, what we've seen when people get this type of letter is that if they fully disclose what they've been doing, and are prepared to pay back the fares that they dodged plus an administration fee then there will be no further action taken. So go through your trainline history and see what it has to say, and tell the railway this. As long as what you come up with is much the same as what they've found out, they may well let you settle out of court.

Yes I’ve gone through my history- they’ve flagged up ‘suspicious’ journeys but there have been multiple times where I have used the 16-17 railcard instead of my 16-25. And other times where I have come from a different station. I have attached the email they sent to me.

Welcome to the forum!

You can be certain that you won't go to prison: even if the worst comes to the worst, the only sentence that is allowed for fare dodging is a fine (there is more detail than this, but this is the headline that you need to know).

Realistically, what we've seen when people get this type of letter is that if they fully disclose what they've been doing, and are prepared to pay back the fares that they dodged plus an administration fee then there will be no further action taken. So go through your trainline history and see what it has to say, and tell the railway this. As long as what you come up with is much the same as what they've found out, they may well let you settle out of court.

I might add that I use the trainline app very regularly so I have to go through about 300 journeys!!

 

[John R]

If you don't want to go through 300 journeys then it seems your simplest option is to confirm that the journeys they have highlighted are indeed instances of fraudulent travel. And apologise (sincerely, don't use ChatGPT and mention the "gravity of the situation" amongst other cliches it comes up with), and promise not to do it again.

You should then be offered an out of court settlement. It will be made up of two elements, the first of which is an admin fee, which is typically around £150, but may be more due to the extent of the fraud they have had to wade through.

The second element will be that for each journey they will recalculate the full Anytime Single fare that you should have paid. They won't usually offset anything that you did pay, so to some extent you will be paying twice for the same journey. You might regard that as the "penal" element of the settlement, that you are willing to pay to stay out of court.

If you get an offer, you'll have to pay it within 14 days in full. So even if you don't want to go through 300 journeys, you can see how many they have identified - find out the Anytime Single fare for each journey (twice if it was a return), and work out roughly how much you will need to have to hand quickly.

 

[ridz17]

If you don't want to go through 300 journeys then it seems your simplest option is to confirm that the journeys they have highlighted are indeed instances of fraudulent travel. And apologise (sincerely, don't use ChatGPT and mention the "gravity of the situation" amongst other cliches it comes up with), and promise not to do it again.

You should then be offered an out of court settlement. It will be made up of two elements, the first of which is an admin fee, which is typically around £150, but may be more due to the extent of the fraud they have had to wade through.

The second element will be that for each journey they will recalculate the full Anytime Single fare that you should have paid. They won't usually offset anything that you did pay, so to some extent you will be paying twice for the same journey. You might regard that as the "penal" element of the settlement, that you are willing to pay to stay out of court.

If you get an offer, you'll have to pay it within 14 days in full. So even if you don't want to go through 300 journeys, you can see how many they have identified - find out the Anytime Single fare for each journey (twice if it was a return), and work out roughly how much you will need to have to hand quickly.

Thanks for your reply John.

Yes I’ve gone through all the journeys- I’ve had to note down the departing and arriving station, valid railcard etc of each journey.

I just wanted to pay a court settlement and not go to court.

 

[ainsworth74]

You mention incorrect railcard, what railcard was selected for the journeys in question and did you hold an actual railcard at the time and if so, which one?

 

[Fawkes Cat]

You mention incorrect railcard, what railcard was selected for the journeys in question and did you hold an actual railcard at the time and if so, which one?

Per post #4

Yes I’ve gone through my history- they’ve flagged up ‘suspicious’ journeys but there have been multiple times where I have used the 16-17 railcard instead of my 16-25.

 

[ridz17]

You mention incorrect railcard, what railcard was selected for the journeys in question and did you hold an actual railcard at the time and if so, which one?

I selected the 16-17 railcard, and I actually hold a 16-25 railcard.

 

[ainsworth74]

Ah yeah sorry, what I get for skimming!

 

[ridz17]

Welcome to the forum!

You can be certain that you won't go to prison: even if the worst comes to the worst, the only sentence that is allowed for fare dodging is a fine (there is more detail than this, but this is the headline that you need to know).

Realistically, what we've seen when people get this type of letter is that if they fully disclose what they've been doing, and are prepared to pay back the fares that they dodged plus an administration fee then there will be no further action taken. So go through your trainline history and see what it has to say, and tell the railway this. As long as what you come up with is much the same as what they've found out, they may well let you settle out of court.

I have gone through my history and provided a truthful account. The email mentioned that they could use CCTV footage in court!

I just read that it could result in jail time so I was worried

 

[ainsworth74]

I just read that it could result in jail time so I was worried

Try not to worry, it's exceptionally rare, to the point that I don't think we've ever heard of such a thing happening!

 

[shortticket]

Im in a similar situation but have done it 14 times, can you keep me updated on ur case or fine you get please, I'm so scare

 

[Gloster]

Im in a similar situation but have done it 14 times, can you keep me updated on ur case or fine you get please, I'm so scare

If you have a problem please start your own thread. It is forum policy to have only one case in each thread as it avoids confusion and means that advice can be tailored to the specific case. No two problems are exactly the same.

 

[ChewChewTrain]

Yes I’ve gone through my history- they’ve flagged up ‘suspicious’ journeys but there have been multiple times where I have used the 16-17 railcard instead of my 16-25. And other times where I have come from a different station. I have attached the email they sent to me.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 18 Jun 2024 ==


Yes I’ve gone through my history- they’ve flagged up ‘suspicious’ journeys but there have been multiple times where I have used the 16-17 railcard instead of my 16-25. And other times where I have come from a different station. I have attached the email they sent to me.

I might add that I use the trainline app very regularly so I have to go through about 300 journeys!!

Out of curiosity, can I ask why, specifically, you chose to buy a 16-25 Railcard and then say you had a 16-17 one? This is something we’ve seen again and again here, yet the consequences are exactly the same as if you had no Railcard at all. Is there some advice going round somewhere that one is more likely to be “let off” if one has a 16-25 Railcard and claims to have selected the 16-17 one by mistake? That doesn’t appear to be the case, and nor would I expect it to be.

 

[Hadders]

Out of curiosity, can I ask why, specifically, you chose to buy a 16-25 Railcard and then say you had a 16-17 one? This is something we’ve seen again and again here, yet the consequences are exactly the same as if you had no Railcard at all. Is there some advice going round somewhere that one is more likely to be “let off” if one has a 16-25 Railcard and claims to have selected the 16-17 one by mistake? That doesn’t appear to be the case, and nor would I expect it to be.

The discount for a 16-17 Railcard is 50% compared to the 16-25 Railcard where it is 34%

To add to what other forum members have said if you co-operate with SWR then you will almost certainly be offered an out of court settlement. Expect to have to pay the cost of the fares avoided at the full Anytime rate with no discount goven for the invalid tickets you did purchase. In addition you will need to pay an admin fee to reflect the costs of SWR investigating your case. Expect this to be around £150-£300. You will need to be in a position to pay the settlement in full within a few days of it being offered.

 

[ChewChewTrain]

The discount for a 16-17 Railcard is 50% compared to the 16-25 Railcard where it is 34%.

But then why bother procuring the 16-25 Railcard at all?

 

[Mcr Warrior]

The discount for a 16-17 Railcard is 50% compared to the 16-25 Railcard where it is 34%

But then why bother procuring the 16-25 Railcard at all?

Depends on how old the OP is, and what railcard they actually hold (if any). Reads to me as if the OP may possibly hold a 16-25 Railcard, but instead has been inappropriately / incorrectly purchasing and then using tickets with 16-17 Saver discount, to avail themselves of the greater discount, but one which they aren't entitled to.

 

[Fawkes Cat]

Depends on how old the OP is, and what railcard they actually hold (if any). Reads to me as if the OP may possibly hold a 16-25 Railcard, but instead has been inappropriately / incorrectly purchasing and then using tickets with 16-17 Saver discount, to avail themselves of the greater discount, one which they aren't entitled to.

If you hold a railcard but buy tickets with another one, then you may think it's possible to argue that you 'clicked the wrong button' - in that if you don't hold a railcard at all, why would you be looking to select a railcard discount?

 

[AlterEgo]

But then why bother procuring the 16-25 Railcard at all?

If you're 18 or older.

 

[Mcr Warrior]

If you hold a railcard but buy tickets with another one, then you may think it's possible to argue that you 'clicked the wrong button' - in that if you don't hold a railcard at all, why would you be looking to select a railcard discount?

Indeed. Post #1 suggests that incorrect tickets have been purchased / used by the OP on more than one occasion.

 

[ridz17]

Moderator note - I’ve merged a thread about how long CCTV is kept for to keep everything related to this case in one thread.

Does anyone know how long SWR keep CCTV footage at their stations?

I have been prosecuted for potential fair evasion and they have threatened to use CCTV to try and see if I have indeed used my ticket to open a barrier into a station. The offence was about 20 days ago- will they actually go through all this CCTV footage?

Out of all the CCTV at all stations would they actually do this or is it just a threat?

 

[AlterEgo]

Does anyone know how long SWR keep CCTV footage at their stations?

I have been prosecuted for potential fair evasion and they have threatened to use CCTV to try and see if I have indeed used my ticket to open a barrier into a station. The offence was about 20 days ago- will they actually go through all this CCTV footage?

Out of all the CCTV at all stations would they actually do this or is it just a threat?

They have probably retained it for 20 days, yes.

What are you accused of? And do you deny the offence?

 

[skyhigh]

They have probably retained it for 20 days, yes.

What are you accused of? And do you deny the offence?

The previous thread was:

I was stopped by a ticket inspector at Waterloo station and I had a ticket from Vauxhall to Waterloo with the wrong railcard. I actually came from a few stops earlier. He took my details and I paid the actual fare.

I received an email last week about potential prosecution- they had access to my trainline account and found that it had been done multiple times (using the incorrect railcard and incorrect stations)

They said if I respond with a truthful account of my journeys then I can pay a settlement and avoid it going to court.

What should I expect to happen?? I don’t want it to go to court or for me to go to jail.

Someone please help

There was no mention of CCTV in the screenshot of the email so I wonder if the OP has tried to claim they did indeed board at Vauxhall and have had their bluff called.

 

[father_jack]

More likely body worn camera really

 

[Drapes]

I’m guessing they’ve looked at all your short tickets and not a single one was scanned for entry at Vauxhall which obviously meant you came from further. They can also check the gateline compliance on those dates you supposedly came from Vauxhall and they will prove the gates were in operation. As for the wrong rail card, elaborate on it? I’m guessing you applied a 16/17 when you have a 16-25. You’re probably best advised to cooperate with them. You know what you done, they definitely know. Why risk ending up in court.