Advice needed

[notabadperson]

Yesterday I was fined 50 pounds + a single ticket for purchasing a ticket with 16-25 railcard even though I do not have the railcard. The inspector made me make the payment on the spot and I paid for it with my credit card. I then disputed the transaction with my credit card company, citing double payment as the reason. The company then refunded the penalty amount to me, saying that they will contact the merchant (greater anglia). But in the case that the merchant rejects the dispute, they will need to take the refund back. Is it likely that the merchant will reject the dispute?

 

[John R]

On what basis did you dispute the transaction given you were caught without a valid ticket?

We haven't seen this before, so not sure we can say what the retailer's response will be, but I would suggest that if they don't dispute it then the PF remains unpaid, and the company are likely to prosecute you in due course. Normally when they write threatening prosecution a suitably worded contrite letter will result in an offer of an out of court settlement, but they are more likely to play hardball given your action. And if they do offer you a settlement, it will inevitably cost more than had you not disputed the payment.

P.S. Whilst we try not to be judgmental on this forum, your forum name is "interesting" given you appear to have deliberately tried to avoid paying the correct fare (on the basis that you have not said it was a mistake) and then when caught still try to avoid paying the penalty.

 

[Fawkes Cat]

Yesterday I was fined 50 pounds + a single ticket for purchasing a ticket with 16-25 railcard even though I do not have the railcard. The inspector made me make the payment on the spot and I paid for it with my credit card. I then disputed the transaction with my credit card company, citing double payment as the reason. The company then refunded the penalty amount to me, saying that they will contact the merchant (greater anglia). But in the case that the merchant rejects the dispute, they will need to take the refund back. Is it likely that the merchant will reject the dispute?

Welcome to the forum. I don't think this is something we've seen before, but my first question would be what you think you paid for twice. You appear to have bought a train fare that you weren't entitled to use, and then a penalty fare which will have covered your travel to ( at least) the trains next stop. These look like two distinct items to me.

 

[Mcr Warrior]

@notabadperson. Welcome to the forum. Not sure how you reckon you've paid twice. Anything you've paid for the original (inappropriately railcard discounted) ticket was money wasted if you didn't also hold the appropriate valid, in date, railcard. Without the accompanying railcard, the ticket you held was invalid.

By not now paying for the PF, which would likely have been the end of the matter, there must now be a possibility that the train company (= Greater Anglia?) will investigate your online ticket purchasing history, to ascertain if there have been any previous occasions on which discounted tickets have been purchased and used, in all likelihood also without an accompanying valid, in date, railcard. That could prove much more expensive. Good luck!

 

[skyhigh]

The normal process with a credit card dispute is that if the initial submission to the bank from the customer seems reasonable the bank will credit the customer immediately and then investigate. If the customer loses the dispute then the money is deducted from their account again.

So I suspect that Greater Anglia still have their money, will counter the dispute and win - meaning that the OP will still be charged.

If Greater Anglia loses the dispute then they may look to undertake civil/criminal action.

 

[AlterEgo]

Yesterday I was fined 50 pounds + a single ticket for purchasing a ticket with 16-25 railcard even though I do not have the railcard. The inspector made me make the payment on the spot and I paid for it with my credit card. I then disputed the transaction with my credit card company, citing double payment as the reason. The company then refunded the penalty amount to me, saying that they will contact the merchant (greater anglia). But in the case that the merchant rejects the dispute, they will need to take the refund back. Is it likely that the merchant will reject the dispute?

As it was for a penalty fare and there is no duplicate payment, it is likely. Making vexatious charge backs will get you into trouble with your credit card company if you do it often and may lead to action with a marker placed with CIFAS.

 

[Trainman40083]

@notabadperson. Welcome to the forum. Not sure how you reckon you've paid twice. Anything you've paid for the original (inappropriately railcard discounted) ticket was money wasted if you didn't also hold the appropriate valid, in date, railcard. Without the accompanying railcard, the ticket you held was invalid.

By not now paying for the PF, which would likely have been the end of the matter, there must now be a possibility that the train company (= Greater Anglia?) will investigate your online ticket purchasing history, to ascertain if there have been any previous occasions on which discounted tickets have been purchased and used, in all likelihood also without an accompanying valid, in date, railcard. That could prove much more expensive. Good luck!

I think, had the OP done the action before (buying tickets with invalid discount), then it will most certainly see an investigation and end up more costly. Time will tell.

 

[WesternLancer]

My advice would be to find another way to pay the penalty fare within 21 days. And not pay it by credit card but by debit card so the payment is made in full. In the hope this prevents matters escalating.

The op needs to appreciate that penalty Fare is the least worst sanction available to the railway and the cheapest for the op. Anything else that happens will probably have a starting price if at least £150.

Given the action with the ticket sounds move like deliberately evading the correct fare as opposed to a genuine mistake it wouldn’t be wise to draw attention to yourself here imho.

 

[skyhigh]

My advice would be to find another way to pay the penalty fare within 21 days. And not pay it by credit card but by debit card so the payment is made in full. In the hope this prevents matters escalating.

Assuming payment was made in full then any automated system is going to believe that no payment is due and not allow a further payment.

The best thing to do is contact the credit card provider and ask to cancel the dispute.

 

[WesternLancer]

Assuming payment was made in full then any automated system is going to believe that no payment is due and not allow a further payment.

The best thing to do is contact the credit card provider and ask to cancel the dispute.

Good advice there I think.

The Op is well advised to pay this. If they think it’s not owed they should use the Appeal process as the penalty fare payment would then be refunded.

No doubt advice can be given here on what might potentially be included in an Appeal or if it’s worth submitting one.

 

[island]

Raising a chargeback on a payment like this is fraud.

I would urge you to contact your card issuer to cancel the dispute.