Advance tickets-what if?

[Taff17]

Planing advaced ticket purchase from Tenby to Heathrow LHR.Train leaves Tenby at 11:42 and travels Tenby > Swansea > Reading > Hayes and Harlington > Heathrow. What if connections are missed due to late arrival at change point...there is only 5 mins at Swansea.Are you entitled to travel on later trains to reach Heathrow ?

 

[Ferret]

Planing advaced ticket purchase from Tenby to Heathrow LHR.Train leaves Tenby at 11:42 and travels Tenby > Swansea > Reading > Hayes and Harlington > Heathrow. What if connections are missed due to late arrival at change point...there is only 5 mins at Swansea.Are you entitled to travel on later trains to reach Heathrow ?

Yes, there's no argument whatsoever on a through advance ticket - you'll be allowed to catch a later train if you are delayed while travelling.

 

[mikeg]

This one again... If changing you should leave a gap between trains of at least the minimum connection time for that station. You may have trouble changing at Swansea as Swansea's minimum connection time is 7 minutes: http://www.nationalrail.co.uk/stations/swa/details.html
But generally its fine and you're allowed to catch a later train if your previous advance booking is late.

Is it all on one ticket? If so you'll be fine no matter what.

Edit: Sorry I didn't notice it was a through advance ticket. You will be fine. Ignore what I said above.

 

[blacknight]

Planing advaced ticket purchase from Tenby to Heathrow LHR.Train leaves Tenby at 11:42 and travels Tenby > Swansea > Reading > Hayes and Harlington > Heathrow. What if connections are missed due to late arrival at change point...there is only 5 mins at Swansea.Are you entitled to travel on later trains to reach Heathrow ?

Have you taken into account the minimum connection time allowed for Swansea station to make it a valid connection in first instance? I see above post answers that question so it would appear you dont have a valid connection at Swansea so you could be on a sticky wicket & empty wallet

 

[MikeWh]

Surely if a booking engine has generated the itinery with that connection at Swansea then it must be valid. If you're not using the itinery suggested by the booking engine then you may hit problems. Take the printout of the itinery with you in case anyone queries what you are doing.

 

[blacknight]

Yes, there's no argument whatsoever on a through advance ticket - you'll be allowed to catch a later train if you are delayed while travelling.

I think the offical 7 minute connection time might start an argument as to whether ever had a valid connection in first place or you were a no show for your booked service at Swansea.
Another problem theres no TVM at Tenby to collect tickets & station is shown as unstaffed on http://www.nationalrail.co.uk/stations/ten/details.html

 

[YorkshireBear]

I wanted to ask same thing today, i got a 12 mintue connection time at Birmingham new street, so if my service coming in is late im fine to get on next avaliable train? do i need to see station staff etc?

 

[flymo]

Have you taken into account the minimum connection time allowed for Swansea station to make it a valid connection in first instance?

According to the most recent version of the online NRT there is no specific minimum connection time at Swansea, so any connection there should default to the obligatory 5 minutes.

{quick edit} There was a minumim 7 minute connection in the NRT until the May 09 version. Since then, Dec 09 onwards, - no minimum connection at Swansea in the National Rail Timetable.

If you are on the 1142 from Tenby, this arrives into Swansea at 1323. As your departure is at 1328 this meets the criteria for any minimum connection time should there be a problem.

 

[Taff17]

Thanks for all your replies. The ticket will be a through advanced ticket only changing at stops permitted in the intinerary generated by the booking engine.The Tenby to Swansea train is a little erratic and often arrives after the London train has left.If this is the case,the ticket is still valid for onward travel?

 

[scotsman]

Thanks for all your replies. The ticket will be a through advanced ticket only changing at stops permitted in the intinerary generated by the booking engine.The Tenby to Swansea train is a little erratic and often arrives after the London train has left.If this is the case,the ticket is still valid for onward travel?

Yes it is.

 

[mikeg]

{quick edit} There was a minumim 7 minute connection in the NRT until the May 09 version. Since then, Dec 09 onwards, - no minimum connection at Swansea in the National Rail Timetable.

Ah interesting, so the information on the National Rail website (where I found the 7 minute figure) must be outdated.

 

[pdq]

When I used to live in Tenby and travel via Swansea the inter-city (as it was then) would wait a short while if the regional train was late, and vice-versa. Does - or can - that happen now?

 

[MCR247]

Not as often

 

[scotsman]

When I used to live in Tenby and travel via Swansea the inter-city (as it was then) would wait a short while if the regional train was late, and vice-versa. Does - or can - that happen now?

I doubt it, as FGW would get delay minutes for it. It's lead to the ridiculous situation where the Northbound Highland Chieftain has been put behind the local Edinburgh - Dunblane service because the train wasn't ready to leave within a few minutes of it's booked departure time.

Result: 40 min delay to Chieftain, when Dunblane could have recovered the delay easily

 

[yorkie]

Result: 40 min delay to Chieftain, when Dunblane could have recovered the delay easily

I agree with what you are saying but the delay is around half that! 20 mins max. Yesterday it was 25 late off EDB and was 20 late at Dunblane, making up 5 mins. Even if the headways don't permit it to get any closer to the Dunblane train, the most it can be delayed is 20 mins if it is right behind it, providing the Dunblane is on time.

 

[A60K]

I agree with what you are saying but the delay is around half that! 20 mins max. Yesterday it was 25 late off EDB and was 20 late at Dunblane, making up 5 mins. Even if the headways don't permit it to get any closer to the Dunblane train, the most it can be delayed is 20 mins if it is right behind it, providing the Dunblane is on time.

I wonder if it was meant that the arrival in Inverness could be 40 minutes late, taking into account losing crossing paths on the single-track sections of the Highland Main Line? A little while since I've been that way, but I have experienced a similar thing where a northbound train was around 15 minutes late leaving Perth and picked up three or four more delays of 4-10 minutes in loops to keep southbound services on schedule.

 

[scotsman]

I agree with what you are saying but the delay is around half that! 20 mins max. Yesterday it was 25 late off EDB and was 20 late at Dunblane, making up 5 mins. Even if the headways don't permit it to get any closer to the Dunblane train, the most it can be delayed is 20 mins if it is right behind it, providing the Dunblane is on time.

Hmm, seems to be some exaggeration from my source in Nethy Bridge then....
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

I wonder if it was meant that the arrival in Inverness could be 40 minutes late, taking into account losing crossing paths on the single-track sections of the Highland Main Line? A little while since I've been that way, but I have experienced a similar thing where a northbound train was around 15 minutes late leaving Perth and picked up three or four more delays of 4-10 minutes in loops to keep southbound services on schedule.

Well, what I've heard is 40mins by Aviemore

 

[trainophile]

Hi, been reading this forum for a couple of weeks and, as my username suggests, I really love trains, although I don't have much variety in my regular journeys, which is Hereford to Southport and back, undertaken by various routes.

Reason I have now joined is on the back of this thread to ask a question that I've been pondering about since it happened.

Last year I travelled on a Sunday from Hereford to Southport via Manchester Piccadilly, on an Advance Single. The train was delayed for about 20 minutes at Crewe (I think they had to change an engine) so consequently I just missed my connection by about a minute, despite running along the platform and up the stairs!

Anyway the next direct train to Southport (on Northern Rail) was in an hour, but I realised by hearing an announcement that there was an East Midlands train about to depart for Liverpool Lime Street from the platform I was on, so I figured if I got on that one I could pick up a Southport connection by changing at Liverpool South Parkway.

The driver was leaning out of his cab just about to shut the doors, so I hastily tried to ask if this would be okay, but I don't think he quite took in the situation. Anyway he waved me on board, and my ticket wasn't inspected, so it all worked out well.

Reason for long post (sorry ) is to ask whether it is okay to use alternative services for the parts of Advance journeys where no reserved seat on a timed train has been allocated.

Thanks for reading. Looking forward to being a regular on here as it is full of helpful advice.

 

[yorkie]

I think so. One of the terms of Advance conditions is as follows:

b) If delays occur while
travelling, they will be
allowed to take the next
available train(s) to complete
their journey.

This was the next available train so my interpretation of that is there is no problem doing this.

However there could be an issue over the fact you got an EMT train, depending on the routeing on your ticket. If your ticket was routed for a particular TOC only then it would perhaps not be valid on another operator without permission. As this ticket should have been routed "AP SHREWSBURY" (source: Avantix Traveller NFM07) and you have already complied with going via Shrewsbury, I see no problem.

If you were going on a journey wholly on one TOC (e.g. routed "ATW Only") but with a change of trains, then it is a question of whether the condition quoted above trumps Condition 10 of the NRCOC or not...! I wouldn't like to say. Anyway that does not apply to this particular case.

 

[trainophile]

Thanks for helpful answer Yorkie. Btw is it forum etiquette to post just saying thanks, or does than annoy as people open the thread to find nothing of interest?

 

[ainsworth74]

I would be very surprised if anyone complained if you just popped on to say thanks

 

[yorkie]

Thanks for helpful answer Yorkie. Btw is it forum etiquette to post just saying thanks, or does than annoy as people open the thread to find nothing of interest?

I think it's to be welcomed yes And, you're welcome for the advice

I agree you do raise a valid point and that it is probably best done within a few days of the advice is first given, as people can get annoyed reading an old thread that has been re-opened when nothing of value is added.

If the advice is regarding a future journey, it is always welcome for the person to post after their journey (which may be several weeks later) saying how the journey went (I do sometimes try to encourage this by saying "Let us know how you get on") and this may be best placed in the original topic. Re-opening an old topic where the previous posts are still relevant is generally fine, providing there is some significant content to be added. It is always nice to know if the advice worked, particularly when people have concerns over whether a particular ticket will be accepted or not.

 

[trainophile]

Gotcha! (that's as in "understood" not "caught you out"). Posting on train at the moment on phone so no access to smileys. Lucky to even have a signal on this route! Just left Chirk.

 

[Flamingo]

When I used to live in Tenby and travel via Swansea the inter-city (as it was then) would wait a short while if the regional train was late, and vice-versa. Does - or can - that happen now?

You find that the dispatch staff in Swansea sometimes are fixedly looking the other way and it's impossible to attract their attention to start dispatch until the crowd off the late-running West Wales train start to run down the platform. :roll:

 

[Taff17]

Again thanks to all who contibuted to my question;eventually found this in Advaced tickets Terms and Conditions.
"If delays occur while travelling, you will be allowed to take the next available train(s) to complete your journey."
Again Thanks