Advance for non-existent GC service

[cjohnson]

My other half held an Advance ticket for the 1346 GC service from York to Kings Cross today (25th June).
Due to (apparently long planned) engineering works there were no GC trains running all day.

Notwithstanding the poor showing re: lack of communication about the cancellation of all GC services from the retailer (LNER) and selling an Advance ticket for a service that was never running, what should the ticket acceptance situation have been here?

She was told at York that a new full price ticket would need to be purchased to travel on LNER, and going via the MML was “only allowed because the trains are run by the same parent company”.
In the end she went via Derby on true original GC ticket (thankfully avoiding most of the MML wires chaos) but with no ticket checks en route I am not sure whether it was a valid option!

 

[Watershed]

Grand Central's Advance tickets are routed "AP GC only", so the default position is that they cannot be used on any other operator in the event of a cancellation.

However, as GC weren't operating any services at all through York today, this would otherwise leave your partner stranded overnight. Therefore condition 28.2 of the NRCoT applies, and any operator that can assist is obliged to do so - regardless of the ticket's original operator restrictions.

Accordingly, LNER, XC and any other relevant operator was required to allow your partner to travel with them (for free), and it was bang out of order for any member of staff to claim that a new ticket needed to be bought.

Your partner could also have required GC to arrange re-routing at the earliest opportunity under the Passenger Rights and Obligations Regulation (PRO). In some cases this might have been more advantageous than relying on 28.2 rights.

But as 28.2 doesn't require the original operator's involvement and GC are hardly likely to have had any staff at York, and their customer services staff are likely to have been useless, 28.2 is probably the better option here.

Depending on her exact arrival time in London, your partner would also be entitled to claim delay compensation for the delay she incurred. Sadly, this probably wouldn't be paid without a fight, as GC will undoubtedly claim that there was "no delay" as the service she was booked on "didn't form part of the Timetable of the Day". This is an absurd argument in the first place, and especially so in these circumstances!

 

[Par]

Depending on her exact arrival time in London, your partner would also be entitled to claim delay compensation for the delay she incurred. Sadly, this probably wouldn't be paid without a fight, as GC will undoubtedly claim that there was "no delay" as the service she was booked on "didn't form part of the Timetable of the Day". This is an absurd argument in the first place, and especially so in these circumstances!

GC should surely pay Delay Repay?

I was fearing a similar argument with Northern with a recent Advance ticket. I only found out at the station that the service wasn’t running, it showed on the PID as “cancelled,“ but checking on RTT and other sources it seems it was pulled in advance (at least the day before). Ultimate arrival at my destination was 61 late and Northern payed 100% Delay Repay without quibble (much to my surprise).

 

[cjohnson]

Thanks both. I will suggest going down the Delay Repay route. The actual arrival at St Pancras was 1641 (vs originally planned arriving at KGX of 1541) so that should just about tip over the 60 minute threshold for GC@s delay repay.

 

[Haywain]

GC should surely pay Delay Repay?

GC are not involved in Delay Repay but do offer delay compensation for delays of an hour or more.

 

[SuspectUsual]

Your partner could also have required GC to arrange re-routing at the earliest opportunity under the Passenger Rights and Obligations Regulation (PRO). In some cases this might have been more advantageous than relying on 28.2 rights.

Grand Central? PRO obligations???

Good luck with that

 

[Watershed]

GC should surely pay Delay Repay?

I was fearing a similar argument with Northern with a recent Advance ticket. I only found out at the station that the service wasn’t running, it showed on the PID as “cancelled,“ but checking on RTT and other sources it seems it was pulled in advance (at least the day before). Ultimate arrival at my destination was 61 late and Northern payed 100% Delay Repay without quibble (much to my surprise).

GC are the stingiest operator in the country when it comes to compensation, other than the devolved local operators (TfL/Merseyrail). They don't operate a Delay Repay scheme, and the minimum delay for which they'll pay compensation is a 1 hour delay, for which they'll only pay the minimum that the NRCoT requires.

They do pay slightly more for delays of more than 2 and 3 hours, but it's still a very poor showing.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 27 Jun 2023 ==

Grand Central? PRO obligations???

Good luck with that

To be fair, I think you could say that about just about any TOC at the moment. None seem to have taken onboard their obligations, let alone trained their frontline staff on it. Vindicating your rights may require taking legal action.