Accused of shoplifting in M&S

[Millercool21]

I was in M&S and a plain clothed man was staring at us the entire time while we were sorting things out with our bags and followed us out the store and then accused us of shoplifting! He didn't give any identification card and and also before that he was on a fake phone call saying "there's 3 of them" (referring to my family) and I could see his phone screen was blank and he was just tapping his blank screen?

Has anybody had incidents with M&S especially being accused of shoplifting because it seems to be a recurring incident that seems to happen?

 

[GusB]

I was in M&S and a plain clothed man was staring at us the entire time while we were sorting things out with our bags and followed us out the store and then accused us of shoplifting! He didn't give any identification card and and also before that he was on a fake phone call saying "there's 3 of them" (referring to my family) and I could see his phone screen was blank and he was just tapping his blank screen?

Has anybody had incidents with M&S especially being accused of shoplifting because it seems to be a recurring incident that seems to happen?

If anyone genuinely suspected you of theft they'd have to make sure that they had absolute proof before trying to apprehend you. I'd expect them to tell you what they thought you had stolen and provide some kind of ID to prove who they were.

I could walk into any supermarket, follow someone out and accuse them while tapping my phone. I could even ask them to tap on a card reader to make it all go away...

 

[GatwickDepress]

Have you reported this to M&S customer services or the store manager?

This is completely unacceptable behaviour, and there is a strong possibility this is either an overzealous in-store detective thinking he's Dirty Harry or a customer playing vigilante (had that happen a few times). Retail security should follow SAFER and ASCONE, display identification when attempting a stop or making enquires, and call over store management, especially if they're not wearing a uniform. These days, even plain clothes guards usually have a body camera under a jacket and a walkie-talkie or headset in a pocket too.

Some guards are just completely unsuited for public-facing roles and I've had to request certain individuals no longer represent our company on many occasions. Hopefully M&S will give you some vouchers for the trouble.

 

[Cloud Strife]

He didn't give any identification card

In this situation, the correct thing to do is walk away.

Having said that, if you haven't nicked anything, then you should just walk away anyway, regardless if they're in uniform or plain clothes, ID or not.

 

[Dai Corner]

'Sorting things out with your bags' and observing their phone closely enough to see what they were doing probably looked suspicious from the point view of the person who followed you out. It would probably be best to avoid such activity inside shops.

 

[Haywain]

If anyone genuinely suspected you of theft they'd have to make sure that they had absolute proof before trying to apprehend you.

That's a silly thing to say. Suspicion and absolute proof a very different things, and shoplifting is not ignored because of a lack of the latter.

 

[AM9]

That's a silly thing to say. Suspicion and absolute proof a very different things, and shoplifting is not ignored because of a lack of the latter.

That is correct, - however action taken also has to be very different unless the business wants to risk being prosecuted for harassment or even assault. "He/she looked like they might have committed a crime" is not a very good accusation nor a valid defence when subsequently sued.

 

[Gloster]

This feels more like the ’store detective’ is no such thing but an opportunistic conman who is going to either steal something that you had bought or, less likely, solicit a bribe for letting you off. A request to check the card you paid with or to check your ID so that you take out your wallet, then ‘I can’t get a good signal here’ and away, or plenty of other variations. I would report it to M&S.

 

[PG]

I would report it to M&S.

On the off chance that this M&S was at a railway station then you could also report it to the BTP (British Transport Police), which on the off chance you don't know the number(!), by texting 61016.

 

[Cloud Strife]

That's a silly thing to say. Suspicion and absolute proof a very different things, and shoplifting is not ignored because of a lack of the latter.

No, it's not silly. Civil claims for unlawful detention where force has been used are being settled for even 5 figure amounts plus legal costs, and the retailers don't want force being used unless there's a cast iron case against the shoplifter. I know at least one large retailer has the policy not to use force except with the consent of the duty manager, as they paid out so much money in false detention cases.

 

[87electric]

That is correct, - however action taken also has to be very different unless the business wants to risk being prosecuted for harassment or even assault. "He/she looked like they might have committed a crime" is not a very good accusation nor a valid defence when subsequently sued.

I had an approach from a Lidl staff member a few years ago. I went in to find the craft beer they had just promoted but couldn’t find it on the shelf. I left and was in the store 2 minutes only. The staff member called me back into the store, to the entrance part and asked to see my receipt. I told them I hadn’t bought anything. They said my backpack looked very heavy. They didn’t actually accuse me of shoplifting but alluded to it by mentioning my bag. They asked me to open it and I refused. They said I was seen in the aisle looking at the beer. I asked if they had evidence of me doing anything illegal. They said nothing. A stand off occurred and I was flabbergasted with their attitude and insistence so I asked them to call the police to come and sort out this “criminal act”.
I then realised while they were talking to me that they were listening to another staff member via their headset. I think it was fairly certain they had been reviewing video footage…..that proved my story.
I was told I could now leave and they sharply departed.
The option these days to have a receipt or not at tills isn’t very clever either. Everyone should always take their receipt for proof.

 

[Lewisham2221]

No, it's not silly. Civil claims for unlawful detention where force has been used are being settled for even 5 figure amounts plus legal costs, and the retailers don't want force being used unless there's a cast iron case against the shoplifter. I know at least one large retailer has the policy not to use force except with the consent of the duty manager, as they paid out so much money in false detention cases.

There was no mention, or suggestion, of any kind of force being used though.

 

[Cloud Strife]

A stand off occurred and I was flabbergasted with their attitude and insistence so I asked them to call the police to come and sort out this “criminal act”.

In this situation, the best course of action is to simply leave. There's nothing to be gained by entering into discussion or getting involved in a dispute, just walk away.

They asked me to open it and I refused.

It's perhaps a side point, but many crimes are actually caught in this way: by people doing things voluntarily. But they have no right to search you, they can only do so by request.

 

[Ivor]

I was approached by a staff member outside my local Tesco Express in November saying I hadn’t paid for items I purchased, shoplifted in other words. I was so shocked I opened my carrier bag & showed my till receipt as I had paid in full at a self serve checkout, he said….
“ok & walked away”

I got home fuming & called Tesco Customer Services & was given a reference, next two weeks I chased it up three times to be told by the third call handler “company policy is we don’t respond directly to this sort of complaint, you can return to to the store & speak to the store manager if you want”

I returned twice to the store, the manager wasn’t available but second visit spoke to the team leader who I politely berated that if they are going to accuse people of shoplifting they need to be 100% sure, he just nodded like a naughty schoolboy.

On You Tube especially Tesco seem to be the stand out business of this sort of action, not seen anything re M&S but you won’t be alone @Millercool21 I'm sure.

In hindsight as petty as it sounds I should have refused to show proof & got them to call the police but maybe I would have been accused of wasting police time?

 

[dangie]

As a side issue, is it much different for a store to ask to look into your bag, than it is for a train manager to ask you to produce a ticket?

Yes I know there is a difference. One is accusing you of being dishonest, and the other is asking you to prove you are honest. But they both have a common goal. To catch those who don’t pay.

We all know that shoplifting is a massive problem for UK shops, as is travelling without a valid ticket is for the railway.

 

[Gloster]

As a side issue, is it much different for a store to ask to look into your bag, than it is for a train manager to ask you to produce a ticket?

Yes I know there is a difference. One is accusing you of being dishonest, and the other is asking you to prove you are honest. But they both have a common goal. To catch those who don’t pay.

We all know that shoplifting is a massive problem for UK shops, as is travelling without a valid ticket is for the railway.

As a non-expert, I would think that there is a difference. On the railway the byelaws say you must show your ticket to an authorised person on demand and, I assume, that in purchasing a ticket you are accepting the byelaws. In a shop you do not, as far as I know, enter into any agreement with the shop that any member of its staff has the right to insist that you open your bags for inspection.

 

[PG]

is it much different for a store to ask to look into your bag, than it is for a train manager to ask you to produce a ticket?

I think it would be similar to be asked for a receipt, although as noted by @Gloster the railway has its own bylaws unlike shops. It possibly has something to do with transport upon the railway not being an item that you can physically possess unlike goods in a shop.

 

[AM9]

I think it would be similar to be asked for a receipt, although as noted by @Gloster the railway has its own bylaws unlike shops. It possibly has something to do with transport upon the railway not being an item that you can physically possess unlike goods in a shop.

It would only be justified if a member of staff had witnessed you putting something into a bag and seen you exiting the store without paying. There is no law against entering a shop (with or without a bag) and then exiting,* - despite some shops expecting those customers to queue at the tills to get out.

* I've done it a few times, entering with intent to buy a specific item and when finding it not available, walked straight out again.

 

[dangie]

Personally, if I was stopped when leaving a shop, if the member of staff was courteous and explained why they’d stopped me, I would have no problem in showing them my bags etc, as long as this was done privately in a way as not to draw attention, or to make me out as a criminal.

Shoplifting is a scourge of society. Sometimes we need encounter things we don’t like to hopefully make something better.

 

[jfollows]

A very long time ago I was chased home by police following being reported by M&S for using an “out of town” cheque with a valid cheque guarantee card. I was less than impressed, both with M&S and with the police. I haven’t forgotten how M&S treats its customers. Still, this is really nothing to do with the details of this post. I sent a letter of complaint to the police of course. Probably just put me on their radar as a serial troublemaker.

 

[87electric]

In this situation, the best course of action is to simply leave. There's nothing to be gained by entering into discussion or getting involved in a dispute, just walk away.



It's perhaps a side point, but many crimes are actually caught in this way: by people doing things voluntarily. But they have no right to search you, they can only do so by request.

Simply walking away might imply a guilt in the staff member's mind towards me. Who knows. I'll stand my ground any day of the week if accused (or loosely accused in this case) of a criminal act when I am 100% innocent. I hope they squirmed and thought long and hard about doing this to anyone else in the future especially without any concrete evidence beforehand.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 7 Jan 2025 ==

Personally, if I was stopped when leaving a shop, if the member of staff was courteous and explained why they’d stopped me, I would have no problem in showing them my bags etc, as long as this was done privately in a way as not to draw attention, or to make me out as a criminal.

Shoplifting is a scourge of society. Sometimes we need encounter things we don’t like to hopefully make something better.

Wait until you actually have an encounter like I did. See if you feel a little humiliation or not as this happened at the entrance in front of every shopper going in and out. I agree there is a way to do this but this was incorrect on many levels.

 

[Sun Chariot]

Hello @Millercool21 I'll share my own insight. I was a store manager with two UK retailers, end-1990 to start of 1998; in Oxfordshire and then at various central London locations.

Both my retail orgs used third party security companies for in-store uniformed and plain clothes security personnel.

All plain clothes and uniformed personnel had ID on them. They always showed their IO to any individual they spoke to.

No security personnel apprehended or accused a person of shoplifting, without:
a) the security personnel themselves witnessing,.or
b) having been alerted by a store staff member who themselves had witnessed
an act of shoplifting or malicious damage to store property.

if a person had been witnessed thus, then the security personnel - usually with one or more store staff - would stop the individual only after they'd left the premises. Then the security personnel would explain what had been witnessed and they'd ask the individual for their version of events. No use of force was permitted, in stopping a person.

Security personnel did not search people, if needed, the police were contacted to attend and to perform a physical search.

If there was any doubt, then no accusation was made to that individual. The security personnel might, however, keep close eyes on the individual during future visits.

Store staff were always instructed to make no attempt at apprehension or accusation. Even more so, after the sad fatal stabbing of John Penfold at Woolworths Teddington, in the mid 1990s, when he tried to stop one shoplifter; and a further (non-fatal) stabbing of one of my London managerial colleagues the following year.

So, in relation to your experience, your best course of action would be to make an M&S staff member aware of what the individual said to you. That would help M&S identify if that person was a) bogus or b) plain clothes security personnel with a lack of competency

 

[AlterEgo]

I was in M&S and a plain clothed man was staring at us the entire time while we were sorting things out with our bags and followed us out the store and then accused us of shoplifting! He didn't give any identification card and and also before that he was on a fake phone call saying "there's 3 of them" (referring to my family) and I could see his phone screen was blank and he was just tapping his blank screen?

Has anybody had incidents with M&S especially being accused of shoplifting because it seems to be a recurring incident that seems to happen?

Sounds like you encountered someone who had nothing to do with the store. Just leave.

 

[3141]

The option these days to have a receipt or not at tills isn’t very clever either. Everyone should always take their receipt for proof.

Many years ago - 30 or 40 - Which? magazine was very concerned about a case in which M&S had accused somebody of shoplifting, and although she was eventually exonerated the stress of the matter and of court proceedings led to her death. I absolutely agree with you about always asking for a receipt. It not only provides evidence that you have paid, but it is very useful if the goods have a defect and you can prove when and where you bought them.

 

[dangie]

Wait until you actually have an encounter like I did. See if you feel a little humiliation or not as this happened at the entrance in front of every shopper going in and out. I agree there is a way to do this but this was incorrect on many levels.

That was why I said staff being courteous. If it was like what you encountered then my thoughts & actions would be different.

 

[Ladder23]

Just go to any staff member and ask for a manager to confirm they’re legit, if your bothered that is.. I’d personally just walk out

 

[Crossover]

We were once stopped at the exit to IKEA for a random check by a contract security officer (uniformed). We hadn't bought much, but had multiple of a couple of items, but as we had used self service, they weren't all scanned in order.

I can't remember the numbers specifically, but he noted that we had scanned 7 of an item but were carrying 8. It took quite a bit of effort to make him actually look properly at the receipt that the eighth had been scanned a couple more items further on.

It winds me up that they put these third party "heavies" in place but they don't actually have the knowledge needed to properly read the pieces of paper the customers hold!

At least at the likes of Costco, who do their checks on everyone leaving, that it is their own staff who know what they are looking at.

 

[GusB]

That's a silly thing to say. Suspicion and absolute proof a very different things, and shoplifting is not ignored because of a lack of the latter.

"Absolute proof" was the wrong thing to say. However, any staff member or store detective/security guard needs to be reasonably sure about their suspicion before they can apprehend anyone. If someone has been seen to stash an item in their bag, that person needs to be carefully observed to make sure that there has been no attempt to dump the goods before they leave the store. A stop is only made once a suspect has left the store.

This post more or explains things from the retailer point of view:

Accused of shoplifting in M&S

I was in M&S and a plain clothed man was staring at us the entire time while we were sorting things out with our bags and followed us out the store and then accused us of shoplifting! He didn't give any identification card and and also before that he was on a fake phone call saying "there's 3 of...

www.railforums.co.uk

In some cases it's a slam-dunk becuse some people aren't really aware of how vigilant retailers actually are, but when you're up against persistent thieves it's very much a game of cat-and-mouse. They know that you're likely to be on to them and they also know their rights.

I think the that the OP has every right to feel aggrieved. The "plain clothed man" did not show any identification when this is the first thing they should have done when trying to apprehend someone.

What we shouldn't be doing is branding someone as guilty just because security staff have a vague suspicion. That suspicion needs to be a bit more concrete before action can be taken and the fact that someone might look a bit dodgy is not sufficient.

 

[Richardr]

A very long time ago I was chased home by police following being reported by M&S for using an “out of town” cheque with a valid cheque guarantee card. I was less than impressed, both with M&S and with the police. I haven’t forgotten how M&S treats its customers. Still, this is really nothing to do with the details of this post. I sent a letter of complaint to the police of course. Probably just put me on their radar as a serial troublemaker.

What is an "out of town" cheque, and what is the legal issue with it?

 

[jfollows]

What is an "out of town" cheque, and what is the legal issue with it?

Sorry, I could have been clearer, nothing wrong with it in the slightest, at the time I was in M&S Fareham and the cheque was from Barclays in Wilmslow. Ludicrous behaviour.