3-car Class 158s

[PhilipW]

All the 3-car Class 158s that I travel on, which is mainly the Portsmouth-Cardiff services, are really 2-car sets with an extra car tagged on. Thus making them have a redundant driving cab.

Were any 158s built as true 3-car sets with a purely passenger car as the centre carriage ?

 

[HSTfan!!!]

I'm not sure on exact details/numbers etc. but in short the answer is yes

 

[sprinterguy]

Yes, 158798-814 (17 sets) were built with centre cars for the North Transpennine Network, the centre cars numbered 58701-58717. These centre cars are now split between South West Trains class 159/1s (8 trains, which were converted directly from the ex-Transpennine 3 car sets), and the remaining centre cars have been remarshalled into Northern units in the 15875X range.

The 22 class 159/0 units were built as class 158s, but were converted to 159 prior to initial entry into service, and the carriages are indeed numbered as if they are 158 units 158873-894, so they could technically count as 158s built as three carriage units.

 

[PhilipW]

I'm not sure on exact details/numbers etc. but in short the answer is yes

Thanks. Does the purely passenger carriage still have an engine underneath or is it purely a passenger carriage ?

To travel in a quiet 158 carriage would be quite something. They really are very noisy with the engine underneath.

 

[sprinterguy]

I think the centre cars are powered. There's nothing wrong with the sound of a 158 engine burbling away beneath you!

 

[starrymarkb]

They are powered, though I do find 159s less obtrusive then 158s (or 159/1s) as the higher horsepower engines have less whine to them IME...

 

[TheExmoorBeast]

All coaches on both Class 158 & 159 are powered, the only time you'll get a quiet ride in one is if the engine is dead or is idling.

 

[Bastiaan]

These centre cars are now split between South West Trains class 159/1s (8 trains, which were converted directly from the ex-Transpennine 3 car sets), and the remaining centre cars have been remarshalled into Northern units in the 15875X range.

There is also one FGW class 158 with an MSL in it. The rest has a driving car as centre car.

 

[Oracle]

If you want to hear how well those engines can roar, stand at the back of Tesco's in Salisbury as the sets ascend up the incline towards Dean from Lavenham South Junction.

 

[TheExmoorBeast]

No... I like a nice quiet coach, no engines roaring away, just peace, quiet, a magazine/paper + drink (tea/coffee). Bliss.
That is why I try my best to avoid them.

 

[Templecombe]

No... I like a nice quiet coach, no engines roaring away, just peace, quiet, a magazine/paper + drink (tea/coffee). Bliss.
That is why I try my best to avoid them.

Theres nothing wrong with that The 159/8s are the best units running in the uk

 

[Mojo]

You're kidding me?! This time of year my heart sinks when I see a 158 pull in due to the fact the aircon never works (except SWT units).

 

[Templecombe]

You're kidding me?! This time of year my heart sinks when I see a 158 pull in due to the fact the aircon never works (except SWT units).

Nope my heart sinks when a 150 or153 turns up

 

[Helvellyn]

You're kidding me?! This time of year my heart sinks when I see a 158 pull in due to the fact the aircon never works (except SWT units).

The EMT ones now have the same air-con units as on the SWT ones, and keep the units nice and cool. I also think the internal refurb is better than SWT - certainly feels like more legroom with the new seats.

 

[Templecombe]

The EMT ones now have the same air-con units as on the SWT ones, and keep the units nice and cool. I also think the internal refurb is better than SWT - certainly feels like more legroom with the new seats.

swt 158s feel the same as 159s

 

[455driver]

There is also one FGW class 158 with an MSL in it. The rest has a driving car as centre car.

158798, this is the only original 3 coach 158 with its original number.

 

[Templecombe]

I seen last Saturday near westbury a two car 158 with the driving car of another 158 attached to the front of it no proper middle carrage I thought it was strange

 

[455driver]

That is how the extra 3 coach ones have been made up, that would have been a FGW 158/9 on a Cardiff to Pompie service, FGW have 10 of these sets.

If you look at the gangway connections between the cab end and inner end of the extra coach they are actually a different size and need an adapter plate to fit together.

 

[Templecombe]

That is how the extra 3 coach ones have been made up, that would have been a FGW 158/9 on a Cardiff to Pompie service, FGW have 10 of these sets.

If you look at the gangway connections between the cab end and inner end of the extra coach they are actually a different size and need an adapter plate to fit together.

I mean that there was 3 driving cabs not two

 

[455driver]

Yes, take a 2 car set and seperate them, then take one of those and attach it to the front of another 2 car set (twice), so 3x 2 car sets become 2x 3 car sets with an (OOU) cab in the middle.
Renumber it into the 1589xx series, job done.

 

[Templecombe]

it wasn't like that its hard to explain without a photo

 

[starrymarkb]

Something like this?

 

[Templecombe]

Something like this?

yes exlatly like that

 

[starrymarkb]

yes exlatly like that

That'll be one of the 1589xx units then, CT were the first to do it, then Transpennine and Wessex did it and now FGW.

 

[Greenback]

They do look a bit strange, but they do deliver the extra capacity that busy routes need.

 

[455driver]

Yes, take a 2 car set and seperate them, then take one of those and attach it to the front of another 2 car set (twice), so 3x 2 car sets become 2x 3 car sets with an (OOU) cab in the middle.
Renumber it into the 1589xx series, job done.

In that photo the front coach is the one that has been added to the normal 2 coach set as i wrote above.
Here is a FGW set-
http://stevesrailpics.fotopic.net/p63119960.html

Also notice the different air con vents on the roof of the front coach (above the doors).

 

[Drsatan]

You're kidding me?! This time of year my heart sinks when I see a 158 pull in due to the fact the aircon never works (except SWT units).

The aircon on FGW's 158/9s seems to work without any problems. Were the air conditioning units replaced when FGW's 158s were refurbished? The ex WT and TPE units usually ran without functioning aircon.

 

[dk1]

The EMT ones now have the same air-con units as on the SWT ones, and keep the units nice and cool. I also think the internal refurb is better than SWT - certainly feels like more legroom with the new seats.

I agree about the internal seating/decor which is greatly improved. I must however dispute the air-con issue as a great deal of the fleet i have passed across the fens of late have the hopper windows open for ventilation in one or both vehicles.

 

[WillPS]

You're kidding me?! This time of year my heart sinks when I see a 158 pull in due to the fact the aircon never works (except SWT units).

At least they have the 'fail safe' windows which can be opened only by a guard.

The EMT ones now have the same air-con units as on the SWT ones, and keep the units nice and cool. I also think the internal refurb is better than SWT - certainly feels like more legroom with the new seats.

Except the ex-Alphaline units, which are easily identifiable by the aforementioned windows all open at this time of year.

 

[northwichcat]

The ex WT and TPE units usually ran without functioning aircon.

And one day during a heatwave temperatures reach around 27oC on a TPE 158. The conductor came through with free bottles of water after he did the ticket check.
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No... I like a nice quiet coach, no engines roaring away, just peace, quiet, a magazine/paper + drink (tea/coffee). Bliss.
That is why I try my best to avoid them.

So you must really hate 150s and 156s then and you wouldn't enjoy 185s.