19th July Lockdown Easing - Observations and Compliance

[RPI]

Reading through this thread, I note some particularly strong views on the minor inconvenience of wearing a face covering to try to slow the spread of a virus that has killed millions in a worldwide pandemic.

On a trip between Scotland and Southern England, I noted more facemask wearing the further south I went at service stations. I wonder whether the north of England has been hit worse by covid than the south and if there might be a correlation there.

I would have a little bit of agreement with you IF there were any credible evidence that a flimsy cloth mask makes any difference, fact is it doesn't, yet we're in a situation where communicating effectively is becoming difficult and ultimately children are suffering the most, my youngest son is an example of this, he's had over a year of trying to understand adults muffling through a face nappy at the exact time he is learning to talk, he has been delayed somewhat and is now also being delayed a year in school because of his communication issues. Is it 100% because of masks? Likely not, but it certainly hasn't helped his cause and he gets so frustrated now when he's trying to understand someone who is trying to talk to him with one on.
My own health has suffered, I suffer migraines and on average would have one every six weeks, since wearing a mask this was up to two a week, this was incredibly debilitating and I was a constant f*****g delight to be around, a phone conversation with my GP with me mentioning this led to the suggestion that I stop wearing one, this would be a legitimate exemption, that was 8 weeks ago, IVE NOT HAD A SINGLE MIGRAINE SINCE! to say they have no effect on people is utter tripe, I've become a different person since, happy and not popping painkillers every 4 hours.
I fear that many health side effects will come to the surface after long term wearing of these things.

Apologies for the rant, I feel better now for that lol

 

[VauxhallandI]

Reading through this thread, I note some particularly strong views on the minor inconvenience of wearing a face covering to try to slow the spread of a virus that has killed millions in a worldwide pandemic.

On a trip between Scotland and Southern England, I noted more facemask wearing the further south I went at service stations. I wonder whether the north of England has been hit worse by covid than the south and if there might be a correlation there.

Reading through your post with the hindsight of 17 months of Covid I am frankly astounded that you can make any comprehensive link between masks and the spread of a virus.

Do you have any snake oil for sale?

 

[NorthOxonian]

On a trip between Scotland and Southern England, I noted more facemask wearing the further south I went at service stations. I wonder whether the north of England has been hit worse by covid than the south and if there might be a correlation there.

My experience is that (broadly speaking) areas with younger and more working class populations have abandoned masks faster than areas which are older and/or more affluent. That also applies to areas within cities - I would imagine somewhere like Richmond still has overwhelming mask usage but Barking would be quite the opposite.

I suspect these demographic factors account for the north south divide you've seen. Most places in the south are either affluent or have a big elderly population (or both) - the few areas that don't will presumably be similar to the north in terms of masking.

 

[kristiang85]

Reading through your post with the hindsight of 17 months of Covid I am frankly astounded that you can make any comprehensive link between masks and the spread of a virus.

Do you have any snake oil for sale?

Honestly, I'm pretty sure had we all been told to wear a magic top hat through COVID to combat the virus, there would have absolutely no difference in the infection rates compared to the masks.

You only need to look at the comparisoon on the epidemic curves of Sweden and the UK to see that.

 

[MikeWM]

My experience is that (broadly speaking) areas with younger and more working class populations have abandoned masks faster than areas which are older and/or more affluent. That also applies to areas within cities - I would imagine somewhere like Richmond still has overwhelming mask usage but Barking would be quite the opposite.

That was the case pre-July 19th too - I've been to both Richmond and Barking recently (probably both in June I think) and there was certainly more masking in one than the other

The effect can be significantly more localised than that though - walk from East Croydon to West Croydon for example, and there's quite a lot of masks at the 'East' end and far fewer at the 'West' end.

 

[43094]

On the LNER service I’m on now, the TM has just announced ‘please ensure a face mask is worn, covering your nose & mouth, and that this is worn throughout your journey’….

 

[Merseysider]

On the LNER service I’m on now, the TM has just announced ‘please ensure a face mask is worn, covering your nose & mouth, and that this is worn throughout your journey’….

I’d contact LNER about that, telling them which service, and request that their announcements reflect the fact passengers now have free choice.

 

[NorthKent1989]

That was the case pre-July 19th too - I've been to both Richmond and Barking recently (probably both in June I think) and there was certainly more masking in one than the other

The effect can be significantly more localised than that though - walk from East Croydon to West Croydon for example, and there's quite a lot of masks at the 'East' end and far fewer at the 'West' end.

Ive had an opposite experience, Woolwich which is a poor area had more masks than affluent Blackheath and Greenwich, even during the height of lockdowns.

East Dulwich has certainly been behaving as normally as possible throughout this entire Covid period.

 

[Freightmaster]

Reading through this thread, I note some particularly strong views on the minor inconvenience of wearing a face covering to try to slow the spread of a virus that has killed millions in a worldwide pandemic.

Reading through this post, I note that the Sturgeon 'daily briefings' have really brainwashed some Scots...

MARK

 

[MikeWM]

Ive had an opposite experience, Woolwich which is a poor area had more masks than affluent Blackheath and Greenwich, even during the height of lockdowns.

East Dulwich has certainly been behaving as normally as possible throughout this entire Covid period.

Yes, Lewisham seemed to have a surprisingly high level of masking too last time I was there. So it's not *just* a socio-economic thing, though that appears to be a correlating factor on the whole.

For whatever reason, the place that seems biggest on masks is Lincoln - worse even than Cambridge. When I was there a few times in late May the vast majority were even wearing masks outside. (I observed one fellow climbing Steep Hill in an N95, and he was struggling terribly. Can't say I had a lot of sympathy.)

 

[NorthOxonian]

For whatever reason, the place that seems biggest on masks is Lincoln - worse even than Cambridge. When I was there a few times in late May the vast majority were even wearing masks outside. (I observed one fellow climbing Steep Hill in an N95, and he was struggling terribly. Can't say I had a lot of sympathy.)

Oxford was pretty extreme when I was there. Very much majority outdoor masking when I was last there, though it may have changed since. Obviously there were exceptions but these tended to be in areas like Cowley and Blackbird Leys which are more like working class towns in the Midlands than they are like the city centre.

In most cases student areas tend to be pretty overwhelmingly non masked, so it's surprising Oxford and Cambridge are quite the opposite. However, it may be due to the more international influence in those cities (Americans especially are massively mask obsessed) and the fact residents might be more likely to want to "follow the science".

 

[MikeWM]

In most cases student areas tend to be pretty overwhelmingly non masked, so it's surprising Oxford and Cambridge are quite the opposite. However, it may be due to the more international influence in those cities (Americans especially are massively mask obsessed) and the fact residents might be more likely to want to "follow the science".

Indeed - plus Cambridge in particular is increasingly dominated by Chinese money and Chinese tourists, probably with pretty much the same result.

 

[Failed Unit]

Reading through this thread, I note some particularly strong views on the minor inconvenience of wearing a face covering to try to slow the spread of a virus that has killed millions in a worldwide pandemic.

On a trip between Scotland and Southern England, I noted more facemask wearing the further south I went at service stations. I wonder whether the north of England has been hit worse by covid than the south and if there might be a correlation there.

Scotland hasn't done that much better than England in terms of deaths per 100k of population, despite its more draconian restrictions. Something the SNP don't ever mention. They failed in similar areas (letting it go in care homes the big one)

 

[LAX54]

Reading through your post with the hindsight of 17 months of Covid I am frankly astounded that you can make any comprehensive link between masks and the spread of a virus.

Do you have any snake oil for sale?

I think the masks were brought in at the very start, as there was nothing else that could be 'seen' by everyone that the Government were doing something, it got bashed into us every 30 seconds, so we all (well most) went along with it, however it was until a majority had been vaccinated, and this has been done, as for the wearing, many wore them, and still do wear them wrong, so for all intents useless for them, The Blue throw away, were used more than once, so again a bit pointless, then more recently, Scientists responding to reports that some 200,000 medical staff (around the World) who were wearing the same blue masks, as no correct PPE available had died contracting the virus.
I wore mine as requested, but i do wonder if it was worthwhile, but at least manufacturers made a lot pf money !

 

[DustyBin]

I think the masks were brought in at the very start, as there was nothing else that could be 'seen' by everyone that the Government were doing something, it got bashed into us every 30 seconds, so we all (well most) went along with it, however it was until a majority had been vaccinated, and this has been done, as for the wearing, many wore them, and still do wear them wrong, so for all intents useless for them, The Blue throw away, were used more than once, so again a bit pointless, then more recently, Scientists responding to reports that some 200,000 medical staff (around the World) who were wearing the same blue masks, as no correct PPE available had died contracting the virus.
I wore mine as requested, but i do wonder if it was worthwhile, but at least manufacturers made a lot pf money !

I agree although I think it was a lot more calculated than simply "being seen to be doing something". Masks were, in my opinion (supported by the (in)famous SAGE meeting minutes) introduced to increase fear by acting as a visual reminder of the threat. This makes even more sense when you consider the fact that anything could be used as a face covering; there was no minimum standard. I've seen everything from respirators costing hundreds of pounds to see through pieces of fabric. They all serve the same purpose which is to increase the perceived threat to the individual, nothing more.

 

[OuterDistant]

I used public transport a couple of times this week since the mask requirement was dropped:

• Bus: I was the first passenger, so I wore a mask. There were around a dozen of us by the time I got off, with all but three of us wearing masks.
• Train: two people who got on before me put a mask on and the conductor was wearing one too, so I masked up as well. By the time I sat down, only 50% of passengers seemed to be wearing one. On the return journey (also about 50% masked), I didn't bother, and it felt fantastic.

I also popped into a supermarket for the first time in weeks, and again around 50% were masked. I didn't, and once again it felt truly liberating.

 

[Failed Unit]

I must admit Scotland now has the biggest inconsistency in the rules in the UK. (or it will from Monday)

It is acceptable to dance without a mask on. So something that is energetic and is likely to result in water vapor getting transmitted is OK. But sitting in silence on a train or in a shop is not OK without a mask. Follow the science, follow the science.....

 

[NorthKent1989]

I must admit Scotland now has the biggest inconsistency in the rules in the UK. (or it will from Monday)

It is acceptable to dance without a mask on. So something that is energetic and is likely to result in water vapor getting transmitted is OK. But sitting in silence on a train or in a shop is not OK without a mask. Follow the science, follow the science.....

It does rather feel that all the leaders are just scoring points off one another at this point, leading to the very inconsistencies you mentioned.

 

[Furryanimal]

I must admit Scotland now has the biggest inconsistency in the rules in the UK. (or it will from Monday)

It is acceptable to dance without a mask on. So something that is energetic and is likely to result in water vapor getting transmitted is OK. But sitting in silence on a train or in a shop is not OK without a mask. Follow the science, follow the science.....

Rather the same in Wales but from tomorrow.
if i have this right we don’t need them in pubs,cafes,restaurants or nightclubs but will need them in shops and on public transport.Makes no sense at all.
And it will be up to landlords to decide if we can order a drink at the bar!

 

[Merseysider]

But sitting in silence on a train or in a shop is not OK without a mask.

I think as time goes on we’ll start to see more and more people connect the dots and start to make their own decisions on compliance, including on masks. I’m just back from a week travelling around Scotland and I’d estimate a consistent 25% of adults on my trains weren’t wearing a mask.

 

[bramling]

Some London experiences yesterday:

GTR into London, about 50/50. One got on at Stevenage and seemed to make a bit of a drama over deciding where to sit, not sure if this was mask related or something else.

Underground is 50/50 during the day, though reducing heavily during the evening. I was on a very late evening Piccadilly Line train which was modestly loaded, and mask use was probably down to around 10-20% if that. Quite a few not wearing them on LU stations too.

Visited a small Sainsbury’s where virtually no one, including staff, was wearing a mask.

Took an early morning GTR train out of London, mask use 0%, but the train was very lightly loaded. Noticed the staff at my station have largely ditched them too.

One thing which has changed, I’m not finding so many evil looks compared to a month ago. Not entirely disappeared, but a lot better than things were.

 

[NorthKent1989]

Yes, Lewisham seemed to have a surprisingly high level of masking too last time I was there. So it's not *just* a socio-economic thing, though that appears to be a correlating factor on the whole.

For whatever reason, the place that seems biggest on masks is Lincoln - worse even than Cambridge. When I was there a few times in late May the vast majority were even wearing masks outside. (I observed one fellow climbing Steep Hill in an N95, and he was struggling terribly. Can't say I had a lot of sympathy.)

My cousin lives in Aylesbury but works in Oxford, he says that there’s more mask wearing in indoor settings in Aylesbury than in Oxford, though he did say it’s fairly mixed, he’s said that he gets less stares for not wearing one in Oxford than in Aylesbury

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 6 Aug 2021 ==

GTR into London, about 50/50. One got on at Stevenage and seemed to make a bit of a drama over deciding where to sit, not sure if this was mask related or something else.

Underground is 50/50 during the day, though reducing heavily during the evening. I was on a very late evening Piccadilly Line train which was modestly loaded, and mask use was probably down to around 10-20% if that. Quite a few not wearing them on LU stations too.

Visited a small Sainsbury’s where virtually no one, including staff, was wearing a mask.

Took an early morning GTR train out of London, mask use 0%, but the train was very lightly loaded. Noticed the staff at my station have largely ditched them too.

One thing which has changed, I’m not finding so many evil looks compared to a month ago. Not entirely disappeared, but a lot better than things were.

I’m getting less evil stares myself now compared to a month ago.

Ive even changed where I shop now because of the last 18 months.

Beckenham was awful to be without a mask, where as East Dulwich was much much friendlier, less people were panicking and the shopping experience was just nice and the staff in all the shops were trying to be as accommodating as possible, so I decided that I would only do my shopping in East Dulwich from now on

 

[takno]

Rather the same in Wales but from tomorrow.
if i have this right we don’t need them in pubs,cafes,restaurants or nightclubs but will need them in shops and on public transport.Makes no sense at all.
And it will be up to landlords to decide if we can order a drink at the bar!

No no, that's not what's proposed in Scotland at all. Masks are still essential to protect us from certain doom in pubs, cafes and nightclubs while not seated, but (and stick with me here), not if you're doing something energetic or you're holding a drink. Presumably there's double points for doing both at the same time.

EDIT: It's just been brought to my attention that you can only leave the mask off if you are holding one drink. If you have a handful of drinks then you clearly wouldn't be theoretically able to drink from them, and that would be *checks notes*: dangerous

 

[devon_metro]

No no, that's not what's proposed in Scotland at all. Masks are still essential to protect us from certain doom in pubs, cafes and nightclubs while not seated, but (and stick with me here), not if you're doing something energetic or you're holding a drink. Presumably there's double points for doing both at the same time.

EDIT: It's just been brought to my attention that you can only leave the mask off if you are holding one drink. If you have a handful of drinks then you clearly wouldn't be theoretically able to drink from them, and that would be *checks notes*: dangerous

You clearly don't have the level of intelligence required to understand the glorious leader.

 

[DustyBin]

You clearly don't have the level of intelligence required to understand the glorious leader.

Seemingly few do!

 

[Merseysider]

If you have a handful of drinks then you clearly wouldn't be theoretically able to drink from them, and that would be *checks notes*: dangerous

Ah, now there lies the misunderstanding. If the drinks themselves are wearing masks, then it’s a lot safer, you see.

 

[Failed Unit]

EDIT: It's just been brought to my attention that you can only leave the mask off if you are holding one drink. If you have a handful of drinks then you clearly wouldn't be theoretically able to drink from them, and that would be *checks notes*: dangerous

Buy a straw

I guess someone like Yogi Bear would have a mask with a straw hole in it.

 

[CentralTrainer]

It’s like GB News or an edition of the Daily Express in here…

I’ll leave you to your echo chamber

 

[VauxhallandI]

It’s like GB News or an edition of the Daily Express in here…

I’ll leave you to your echo chamber

It is far from an echo chamber here; but it sounds like you might prefer the comfort of your own one?

Why not constructively challenge something, with evidence. You might be surprised.

 

[Merseysider]

It’s like GB News or an edition of the Daily Express in here…

I’ll leave you to your echo chamber

A lot of people here share similar opinions and criticisms of past events/decisions, yes, but by all means provide a differing point of view to that which you see & it’ll be respectfully debated.